12 gauge Parker shotguns

[Ian Civco]

Or any 12 gauge, for that matter. They have become really unpopular.

Why?

Is the recoil that punishing? (I don’t find it to be a problem.)

[Brian Dudley]

They are common.

[CraigThompson]

At present I have more intrest in 8 and 10 gauge Parker’s vs 12 gauge . About the only time 12’s intrest me is at a Colombaire , boxbird or zz bird match .

[William Woods]

Possibly that people have found that smaller, lighter, gauges work just as well for for their intended purpose.

In my younge years, I thought that I had to have a 12 gauge in order to effectively hunt. I am strictly an upland guy, and the other smaller gauges work fine for my type hunting. That and that is what my father hunted with, same mindset I am sure.

I still have my 12 gauges, save one, and am having another one worked on currently. Anything I dispose of now will be my 12 gauges.

[Dave Noreen]

Supply of shooter quality vintage 12-gauge doubles far exceeds the dwindling pool of us Boomers with an interest in such things. Us Boomers are leaving the marketplace faster than any Millennials, Gen Xers, etc. are entering it.

[Chris Pope]

I suspect other guages have become more popular as opposed to people not liking the 12. The old guys I grew up hunting with told me to stick with the 12 because you can almost always find a box of 12's at a hardware store. Now most sporting goods store and on-line services offer most all guages. And yes many gauges are expensive.
Because I knew better than the old guys, I bought a BPS 10 gauge when I was young. Sure enough I forgot to pack my ammo on the way to a goose/duck trip in upstate NY. Had to drive 45 mins to a mom and pop hardware store in Greenwich (I think) to find a box of 10's. Had to shell out almost $40 for the box.

[John Allen]

The slow down in 12 gauge sales is really the result of two things in my opinion. One is as Brian said,there are just a lot more 12s out there than small gauge guns. High supply means lower price. The 2nd cause is the improvement in small bore ammo. Within reason, a 20 can do almost anything a 12 can do in most hunting situations. That said,there are some great buys out there in 12 gauge guns right now.

[Steven Groh]

Small gauges have become cool over the past couple of decades.
Most don’t realize the value in light, well-made English 12 bores, which shoot marvelously and feel wonderful between the hands.
In many upland fields, it seems a badge of honor to be shooting a 28 gauge or a .410, but those are toys (albeit beautiful ones) which, in my mind, are not worth the trade-off.
I want a gun that I can shoot! And for me, in the field I want something between 28 and 30 inches and between 6 and 7 pounds that points and balances well enough that you don’t even know it becomes a part of you.
There a plenty of 12s that fit that bill.
I prefer 16s as the most versatile gauge of them all, but I still love a good 12.

[CraigThompson]

The slow down in 12 gauge sales is really the result of two things in my opinion. One is as Brian said,there are just a lot more 12s out there than small gauge guns. High supply means lower price. The 2nd cause is the improvement in small bore ammo. Within reason, a 20 can do almost anything a 12 can do in most hunting situations. That said,there are some great buys out there in 12 gauge guns right now.

You recently had a DH 12 gauge 2 frame 32” safety delete gun I bought off a dealer in the Pacific NW I think 4 or 5 years ago . I sold it to someone in PA two years ago I believe who later sold it to someone else who saw fit to open the chokes . When I had it the gun 38 or 39 points in both barrels . I think when you sold it they’d been opened IC/IM . Someone before you got it in their infinite wisdom messed up a damn good sporting/box bird/Colombaire gun :banghead: oh yeah the price you finally let that gun go for was just a skoosh over 2/3rds what I had in it and sold it for .

[Garry L Gordon]

So buy a 12 now, and enjoy the value, and its versatility. If you want to sell, know you likely won’t make money on the deal.

[Bill Murphy]

It's hard to find an AHE 32" Parker or a Whitworth Steel Purdey hammer pigeon gun in anything but 12 gauge. It's all in what you're looking for. Little sub bore bird guns get tiring when shooting box birds or competitive sporting clays. I won't be selling my 12 gauges any time soon.

[Pat Boccuzzi]

I'll take a Parker especially high grade 12 bore In a 1/2 frame or a 12 bore 1 frame parker , you can shoot 12,16 :) and 1 frame 20 bore.

[Craig Larter]

No question the market for small bore Parkers keeps accelerating, just look at the asking prices of major dealers and auction results from top auction houses. They must be selling to someone. 12ga above C grade also bring strong prices if in original condition. The lack of supply of 12 ga C grade and above keeps prices strong and growing. 12ga in grades 0,1,2, are dogs in the market unless in very high condition. As many have stated it's just supply and demand. The internet has changed everything including Parker sales and values. It's a national market with literally thousands of choices if your searching for a Parker. The best value in Parkers today is a 12ga DH(E).

[Bill Murphy]

Pat, one of my 1/2 frames is a two barrel set in 12 and 16. Thanks for mentioning the possibility.

[Ian Civco]

The best value in Parkers today is a 12ga DH(E).

I completely agree with this statement. I’m surprised at how LITTLE a 12 gauge DH(E) brings these days! I can’t afford NOT to have one! Which means that’s the next thing I’ll have to actively seek.

[allen newell]

20s have replaced the 12. With few exceptions

[Phil Yearout]

Where I come from if you don't shoot a 12 you ain't shooting a real gun. 'Course, it has to be an auto - or a pump if you're a second-class citizen - and if that 12 will handle 3" mags, so much the better. 20's are for kids or girls, and 16's...why hell; nobody shoots them old relics any more. Can you even get shells for 'em? 12's are real popular here...so long as you can stuff 4-5 shells into 'em :rotf:

[Bill Murphy]

Phil, if you're talking about Browning A-5s, I can get nine shells into mine. :rotf::rotf:

[Craig Larter]

Another gauge that doesn't get much respect is the 16. Lower grade Parker 16's seem to command only a modest premium over 12's. You get very close to a 20ga without parting with as much money. Owning a 16 almost requires that you reload, but a small sacrifice IMHO.

[John Davis]

I will admit that I’m living in a pretty narrow lane of the shooting world. (Very narrow when you consider I’m presently at the Grand American shooting my Parker SBT and side by side.). But as a result, nearly every gun I own these days is a 12 gauge. I find I have very little use for anything else. I still keep a couple of 20’s and a 16 for the occasional quail hunt. So, it really does come down to what your interests and goals are. And in the greater shotgun shooting world 12’s are still the most popular gauge, with 20’s running a close second. Just my opinion.

[David Safris]

I am curious what the 'unpopular' meaning is here. Is it to mean the prices on 12 gauges have dropped ? etc. anyone ever charted this on a known group of guns? It is actually pretty impressive that a shooter grade 100 year old gun is 1.5-3K comparing to something like a 725 Citori Field that is approx 3k and has zero hassles or worries on purchasing. I'd say the demand is still there considering the knowledge of wood, metal finish , barrels, etc required to buy and use vintage guns. So much easier to just buy the Browning and yet.. here we are.

[Pete Lester]

Supply of shooter quality vintage 12-gauge doubles far exceeds the dwindling pool of us Boomers with an interest in such things. Us Boomers are leaving the marketplace faster than any Millennials, Gen Xers, etc. are entering it.

Simply watch the age of the folks with a birthday at the bottom of the PGCA forums page, not many young people, lots of older folks and those names of familiar posters keep getting older.

It would be an interesting exercise to graph the membership data to see if PGCA members are getting older on average and if membership is experiencing any kind of decline as a result.

[Mike Koneski]

Simply watch the age of the folks with a birthday at the bottom of the PGCA forums page, not many young people, lots of older folks and those names of familiar posters keep getting older.

It would be an interesting exercise to graph the membership data to see if PGCA members are getting older on average and if membership is experiencing any kind of decline as a result.

Pete, we did a survey of PGCA membership a few years ago to be able to answer questions from prospective advertisers for Parker Pages. Predictably, the largest age group was in the 60-70 year old range. The younger age groups were growing but nowhere near the 60-70 demographic.

[Ian Civco]

Pete, we did a survey of PGCA membership a few years ago to be able to answer questions from prospective advertisers for Parker Pages. Predictably, the largest age group was in the 60-70 year old range. The younger age groups were growing but nowhere near the 60-70 demographic.

If that was a few years ago, that demographic might now be the 70 to 80 range…those that are left…

[CraigThompson]

Pete, we did a survey of PGCA membership a few years ago to be able to answer questions from prospective advertisers for Parker Pages. Predictably, the largest age group was in the 60-70 year old range. The younger age groups were growing but nowhere near the 60-70 demographic.

Glad I’m not old enough oh shit wait , I’m right in the damn middle :crying::rotf::rotf:

[Garry L Gordon]

Glad I’m not old enough oh shit wait , I’m right in the damn middle :crying::rotf::rotf:

Join the crowd, Craig!:)

[Pete Lester]

Pete, we did a survey of PGCA membership a few years ago to be able to answer questions from prospective advertisers for Parker Pages. Predictably, the largest age group was in the 60-70 year old range. The younger age groups were growing but nowhere near the 60-70 demographic.

Can you define a few years ago into a number?

[Dean Romig]

Allan Swanson used to study and catalog for our use all sorts of member demographics.

I sure miss Allan a lot. He was truly one in a million for as many reasons.





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[Mike Koneski]

Can you define a few years ago into a number?

The survey was completed and published December 2022.

Ian, the major demographics are still 61-70 and over 70. Both at 34.5%. The results are on this site.

[Bill Murphy]

Can you imagine that in the next 20 years, about five of us will own all the existing Parker shotguns.

[Pete Lester]

Can you imagine that in the next 20 years, about five of us will own all the existing Parker shotguns.

:rotf: Good one Bill.

I was thinking most of the PGCA dues collected is sourced from the Social Security Administration.

[Garry L Gordon]

Can you imagine that in the next 20 years, about five of us will own all the existing Parker shotguns.

:rotf::rotf::rotf::rotf:

[Ian Civco]

The survey was completed and published December 2022.

Ian, the major demographics are still 61-70 and over 70. Both at 34.5%. The results are on this site.

That’s still 69% over 60. Not good.

[George Davis]

I'm similar to John Davis' reply I own all 12 gauge shotguns except my two 16 gauge upland game guns.
However along the same trend as 12 gauge guns are 32 inch barrels, they've become the "Cat's Meow" and now everyone is desiring only long barrels. Every Wednesday morning we have a skeet shot at one of my local clubs and last week we had two shooters with 32 inch barrels. In fact last week we had more shooters with 30 and 32 barrels then 26 or 28. I know I'm getting older as I can remember when everyone had to have 26 inch barreled skeet guns!

[Mike Koneski]

That’s still 69% over 60. Not good.

Granted, that is a small sampling of PGCA members. 200 responded to the survey out of almost 1500 members. Plus, there are many other shooters/collectors who have Parker guns that are not members of the PGCA. For example, at our range we have a solid core of double gunners that is growing every year. They are not members of any organization.

[Mike Koneski]

Can you imagine that in the next 20 years, about five of us will own all the existing Parker shotguns.

I hope I'm one of the five!! :rotf::rotf::rotf::rotf::rotf:

[Mike Koneski]

You can pretty much look across every collector organization and the demographic will be much like ours, especially when it comes to collecting firearms. This trend also extends to conservation organizations such as PF/QF, RGS/AWS, RMEF, NDA, TU, DU, etc. Even "gun clubs" are seeing this trend. Organizations are "aging out". Members who have been active for a long time just do not have the energy or desire to continue to do the heavy lifting and the younger demographic are not stepping up to fill the vacancies. Whether they have no interest or just do not want to volunteer their time, the answer is unclear. As the saying goes, "It is what it is".

[Pete Lester]

Granted, that is a small sampling of PGCA members. 200 responded to the survey out of almost 1500 members. Plus, there are many other shooters/collectors who have Parker guns that are not members of the PGCA. For example, at our range we have a solid core of double gunners that is growing every year. They are not members of any organization.

Dusting off the cobwebs of my college Quantitative Analysis class a sample size of 13% (200/1500) would have a confidence of around 90% with a margin of error around 7.5%.

[John Davis]

Historically speaking, the PGCA has probably always been basically 69% over 60. I’ve been a member for around 23 years. When I joined I was something like 43 and was considered a youngster in the group, a mere child.

[Christopher Cefalu]

Just turned 52 over here, I've been doing my best to introduce younger than me folks (mid 40's) to vintage shotguns and old stuff in general. I'll keep trying to lower your age average:).

[Andrew Sacco]

Like all membership organizations, and it doesn't matter if it's the AAA or AMA or your bowling league, membership is grown ONE person at a time through a relationship. I notice a lot of forum associates post just to get a price. One idea is to have someone act as a "liaison" to non members and offer to speak to them on the phone about any questions. Another is to form our own database of SOLD PRICES such as Excellence Magazine does for Porsches'. The only ones who can access that database are members. I'm not sure that would be difficult to do.

[Dylan Rhodes]

Being a young bloke in this collecting world - if anyone is wanting to get rid of their Parker 12 gauges I offer a low cost service for disposal, just send them to me.


But its a lot of what people have already said I think. The 12 gauge is the most common gauge and few my age want a double barrel, and even fewer want a SXS, and even fewer still want a vintage one.

The anti-thesis to this - I personally enjoy the 12 gauge guns and the few collectors my age I know do as well, purely because we can afford them. Saving up for a 16 or even a 20 is a financial undertaking even in the lowest grades. Mind you the economy is what it is, then you have a family to support, then your other hobbies, trying to buy a first home, etc. At least we can get in the game with 12's

[Pete Lester]

If you think the price of a vintage Parker 12ga is low now it will be a lot lower if and when the US follows the UK and enacts a complete ban on the use of lead shot.

Sometimes I think having a collection of vintage doubles is like playing a game of musical chairs, there may not be seat when the music stops if you own too many.

[Ian Civco]

If you think the price of a vintage Parker 12ga is low now it will be a lot lower if and when the US follows the UK and enacts a complete ban on the use of lead shot.

Sometimes I think having a collection of vintage doubles is like playing a game of musical chairs, there may not be seat when the music stops if you own too many.

Is that being proposed?

[Dylan Rhodes]

In my humble opinion if you have the disposable income for this hobby a ban on lead shot would just fuel the fire by allowing you to afford higher grades for less money. Considering I collect for the nostalgia and solely hunting and not to diversify my investment portfolio, 5-10 boxes of bismuth or similar a year won’t dissuade me.

It probably will effectively negate anyone new from entering the game, unless they grow up into it, but I don’t think it’s going to cause a mass exit of the hobby.

Of course, if you’re shooting a round of 100 every weekend your opinion will be different.

In any event, it’s speculation at this point, and out of my control. What is in my control is enjoying these guns and choosing to accept the risk that may or may not come, considering there is an existing solution.

[Pete Lester]

Is that being proposed?

It became the law of the land in California on July 1st. It was banned for waterfowling 35+ years ago and it has been banned on some federal and state lands as well.

I would say it's coming eventually, just a question of when.

[Pete Lester]

In my humble opinion if you have the disposable income for this hobby a ban on lead shot would just fuel the fire by allowing you to afford higher grades for less money. Considering I collect for the nostalgia and solely hunting and not to diversify my investment portfolio, 5-10 boxes of bismuth or similar a year won’t dissuade me.

It probably will effectively negate anyone new from entering the game, unless they grow up into it, but I don’t think it’s going to cause a mass exit of the hobby.

Of course, if you’re shooting a round of 100 every weekend your opinion will be different.

In any event, it’s speculation at this point, and out of my control. What is in my control is enjoying these guns and choosing to accept the risk that may or may not come, considering there is an existing solution.

Over the course of a year I shoot thousands of lead shells at clay pigeons and crows. Bismuth is not an affordable alternative/existing solution and steel remains the most economical non tox shot which is not friendly to vintage guns.

Seriously who is going to pay $50 or more for the shells to shoot a 25 target round of trap, skeet or five stand? Because two dollars a shell is about the cost of reloading bismuth at today's prices.

[Daryl Corona]

I'll say it again. Have waterfowl populations done better or worse since they mandated non toxic waterfowl loads?

[Pete Lester]

I'll say it again. Have waterfowl populations done better or worse since they mandated non toxic waterfowl loads?

That argument won't change the trajectory of saving the planet.

[Dylan Rhodes]

Over the course of a year I shoot thousands of lead shells at clay pigeons and crows. Bismuth is not an affordable alternative/existing solution and steel remains the most economical non tox shot which is not friendly to vintage guns.

Seriously who is going to pay $50 or more for the shells to shoot a 25 target round of trap, skeet or five stand? Because two dollars a shell is about the cost of reloading bismuth at today's prices.

You may have overlooked my statement regarding what you do with the guns and how you get enjoyment from them. I can swallow the 2 dollar a shot pill for my purposes, and if no one else can for theirs, well I guess that just works out for me then.

[Pete Lester]

Is that being proposed?

Not a generalized lead ban but here in NH I know of three trapshooting clubs, N. Hampton, Exeter and Lone Pine in Hollis that were shut down because it was determined lead pellets were landing in a wetland (it doesn't take much for the state to declare a wetland). The largest trap shooting facility in Pelham NH had to shut down two fields out of eight for the same reason and could no longer handle the number of shooters for the state championship, so the NH state championship was moved to MA of all places. Another club, Farmington, has half a skeet field because some of the stations were determined to be putting shot in a pond.

[Daryl Corona]

Like Pete I shoot on average a flat a week. I'll have take to up pickleball.

[William Woods]

I am passionate about hunting and the second ammendment. While we all know what is coming, I believe we are in a state of denial. It is not a matter of if but when. As we age out the letter designated youth that have been force fed through the publlic education system, to believe that guns and hunting are bad things, will be electing, and elected. I could stand on my soapbox and continue much longer but will cede the floor lest I be banned from further comments.

[David Safris]

I try to take a hopeful view. CA did ban lead on public ground for hunting. Not private - i confirmed this with a large skeet/trap club today. No change on private land. UK did ban lead but lets not forget this phrase 'Exemptions: ... outdoor target shooting ranges with appropriate risk management, ' I tend to think outdoor shooting ranges will come up with long term risk management plans. Maybe we should all ask our clubs about future plans now. I am sorry about the impact to an old club shooting over a pond or on public land. I'm sure its frustrating to be forced to change. Every industry has to adapt over time. A race track i ran at for a long time got run out of business over noise and zoning. Didnt adapt fast enough. A golf course i used to frequent got zoned out and turned into commercial property. funny that now the hottest ticket in town is TopGolf -seems to always be crowded . I am hopeful for hunting and shooting to survive well into the future.

[Daryl Corona]

I've belonged to a public club for about 50 years and it is located on the shores of the water resevoir for the Baltimore City and County drinking water. You can see the water as you shoot. We have the lead mined every 5-6 years or so, just had it done a month or so ago, and the soil and water tested. Zero lead contamination and this club has been in existence almost 75 years. This banning lead shot for whatever purpose is just another back door way to ban hunting, shooting and eventually guns.

[Andrew Sacco]

You may have overlooked my statement regarding what you do with the guns and how you get enjoyment from them. I can swallow the 2 dollar a shot pill for my purposes, and if no one else can for theirs, well I guess that just works out for me then.

I think you mentioned shooting 100 rounds on a weekend somewhere Dylan? Your $2 a pill is a lot when some of us shoot 200-500 A WEEK. There are a lot of those guys out there who shoot many thousands a year. Bismuth is simply NOT an option for these guns at that volume. Hunting is low volume but if this is for all shooting then either our guns go bye bye or I suspect there will be a LOT of outlaws walking around simply giving the finger. I know one person who simply will not comply.

[Bill Murphy]

This started out as a "why 12 gauge" thread. Getting back to that, let me comment. Where would be be without Parker pigeon guns, Parker duck guns, Parker single trap guns, Parker 12 gauge skeet guns, high condition Trojans, high condition VH and VHE guns, average condition G, D, C, B, A and higher Parkers? That's a large number of 12 gauge guns on the double gun market. Of course, that's just Parkers. What about the Foxes, Smiths, Purdeys and Bosses? I don't think the 12 gauge market is quite dead yet. Please comment.

[Dean Romig]

I try to take a hopeful view. CA did ban lead on public ground for hunting. Not private - i confirmed this with a large skeet/trap club today. No change on private land. UK did ban lead but lets not forget this phrase 'Exemptions: ... outdoor target shooting ranges with appropriate risk management, ' I tend to think outdoor shooting ranges will come up with long term risk management plans. Maybe we should all ask our clubs about future plans now. I am sorry about the impact to an old club shooting over a pond or on public land. I'm sure its frustrating to be forced to change. Every industry has to adapt over time. A race track i ran at for a long time got run out of business over noise and zoning. Didnt adapt fast enough. A golf course i used to frequent got zoned out and turned into commercial property. funny that now the hottest ticket in town is TopGolf -seems to always be crowded . I am hopeful for hunting and shooting to survive well into the future.



Massachusetts covered this with a ‘caveat emptor’ clause that says if the shooting range was there before you were you have NO CASE.





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[Phil Yearout]

12 gauges certainly make sense, given the ease and expense of finding appropriate ammo. I shoot off-the-shelf stuff in my three 12ga SBT's. I have two other 12's, a Sterlingworth and an early Fox A grade but when I'm in the field it's still a 16 or occasionally a 20 for me.

[John Allen]

Bill, In response to your comment on 12 gauge guns, it is really a matter of how many 12 gauges are out there. I talk to a lot of the major dealers on a regular basis. They all are hesitant to buy 12s unless they are cheap because they tend to sit in inventory a long time. If you look at gunsinternational today they have 444 Parkers listed for sale. 80% of them are 12 gauge. No businessman wants to have inventory that is slow turning. The flip side to this is look how much small bores have gone up in price.

[Bill Murphy]

John, so the twelves are slow selling. I don't care because mine are being put to good use. They will be a hard sell when I am ready to liquidate but sixty percent of real value will usually be more than I paid for them.

[Ian Civco]

If you want a Purdey, the overwhelming majority of production is in 12 gauge.

I created this thread because I thought folks are simply “softer” than they were in the past. I’m not one to ask about that as I shoot a .375 Holland & Holland for pleasure at the range. Not everyday, but from time to time.

[William Woods]

This started out as a "why 12 gauge" thread. Getting back to that, let me comment. Where would be be without Parker pigeon guns, Parker duck guns, Parker single trap guns, Parker 12 gauge skeet guns, high condition Trojans, high condition VH and VHE guns, average condition G, D, C, B, A and higher Parkers? That's a large number of 12 gauge guns on the double gun market. Of course, that's just Parkers. What about the Foxes, Smiths, Purdeys and Bosses? I don't think the 12 gauge market is quite dead yet. Please comment.

Mr. Bill, I have 12 gauge guns, and mentioned earlier that I have a Parker 12 gauge that is being redone, reurbished, restored, ruined at this time. I was advised by several people, including Steve Fjestad (a picture of myself and Mr. Fjestad looking at the gun while at the NRA show in Louisville, KY appears in the memorial Blue Book, later published in the DGJ) that the gun was not worth the money it would take to restore it. Being only the second Parker D grade that I had ever seen for sale locally, I ignored those wiser than myself and have had it as a project ever since. I have purchased one or two other 12's since. I do not object to the 12's, and have no disdain for the gauge, I just find the 16's and 28's preferable to the 12's. I miss just as many with the 12's as I do with the smaller gauges, and the smaller gauges are easier to blame due to having less powder and shot.

[Steve McCarty]

Or any 12 gauge, for that matter. They have become really unpopular.

Why?

Is the recoil that punishing? (I don’t find it to be a problem.)

No 12 gauge is not "really unpopular", they are just not the shotgun fad today. People who shoot shotguns understand that the most effective gun is the 12 gauge. Other's are used for various reasons which includes what is the in thing at the time. If one shows up at the gun range with a 16 then he/she is cool. If he/she has a 12 then he/she is old hat.

[David Livesay]

I currently have 14 shotguns that are 12 gauge made by various manufacturers including Parker, Marlin, Franchi, Mossburg, Stevens, Hatsan & Winchester. I have a couple of .410's, one 28 ga. couple of 20's and a couple of 16's, none of which are Parkers. I don't plan on buying any more 12's unless it's a really great deal, because I don't need any more.

[Rich Anderson]

While I'm not a 12 gauge guy and never have been in the last two years I have bought several. A 12 gauge with a 7/8oz or 3/4oz payload is a pure pleasure to shoot.
As mentioned previously the UK has banned all lead shot which drives down the cost of a vintage Purdey, H&H, Boss etc. Two years ago at the Southern I picked up a matched pair of Purdey forward snap action guns for what one would have cost several years prior.
To the best of my recollection my shotgun adoptions over the last two years by gauge are 12's -6 (but in my defense there are two matched pairs), 16's-3 and 20's -2..
The only hunting I do with a 12 is some Quail hunting in Georgia and some Grouse hunting in MI with a Purdey light game gun and RST 2 inch shells. Essentially a 28ga load in a 12

[Victor Wasylyna]

Clearly there is much pessimism here about the future of side-by-side shotguns, bird hunting, and Parker collecting. I do not share that pessimism. From my perspective, the left and their culture wars have created a generation of men that are exploding with masculinity. Just Google the "Tate brothers." Many of those men will eventually find their way to us.

I recently read this article and thought the author was preaching to the choir: https://dailyreckoning.com/gen-z-nationalists-vs-communists/

-Victor

[Mike Koneski]

Victor, I'm with you! :clap:

[Ira Whitten]

Clearly there is much pessimism here about the future of side-by-side shotguns, bird hunting, and Parker collecting. I do not share that pessimism. From my perspective, the left and their culture wars have created a generation of men that are exploding with masculinity. Just Google the "Tate brothers." Many of those men will eventually find their way to us.

I recently read this article and thought the author was preaching to the choir: https://dailyreckoning.com/gen-z-nationalists-vs-communists/

-Victor


What do shotguns and Parker’s have to do with two brothers who have been accused of human trafficking and sexual assault of minors, to name just two of the serious allegations against them.

[Victor Wasylyna]

Ira:

Either you are being obtuse or you missed my point entirely.

I am not defending or promoting the Tate brothers. I am no fan of theirs whatsoever. I am just pointing out that there is an entire generation of young men (Gen-Zers) that are rediscovering masculinity after years of being emasculated. Millions of these Gen-Zers were searching for something masculine and ended up "following" the Tate brothers (before they were canceled based on various criminal allegations). My point was simply that it is only a matter of time before these Gen-Zers—eschewing the culture wars and desperately seeking masculinity—find their way to parkerguns.org.

-Victor

[Andrew Sacco]

Ira:

Either you are being obtuse or you missed my point entirely.

I am not defending or promoting the Tate brothers. I am no fan of theirs whatsoever. I am just pointing out that there is an entire generation of young men (Gen-Zers) that are rediscovering masculinity after years of being emasculated. Millions of these Gen-Zers were searching for something masculine and ended up "following" the Tate brothers (before they were canceled based on various criminal allegations). My point was simply that it is only a matter of time before these Gen-Zers—eschewing the culture wars and desperately seeking masculinity—find their way to parkerguns.org.

-Victor

I don't think rebellious Gen-Zers will choose classic American doubles when they are ready to flex their testosterone :rotf::rotf::rotf::rotf: