CHE factory ejector modification?

[David C Porter]

Seller claims factory extractor to ejector modification & no dolls head at end of barrel top rib. I don't see any Parker repair codes. Claims PGCA letter, but doesn't show it. Opinions?
https://www.gunsinternational.com/guns-for-sale-online/shotguns/parker-shotguns---antique/fabulous-and-rare-parker-che-20ga-factory-2-brl-set-with-case---rare-special-order-gun-with-fantastic-pgca-research-letter--great-provenance-.cfm?gun_id=102259538

[jimlott]

The seller is a member here. I have dealt with Josh for several purchases and was lucky enough to meet him one day at Morphy Auction house. Had my father (who will be 88 this coming week) with me and Josh gave us quite an education on Parkers and some other doubles He is great to work with and you can certainly trust him. The guns I have gotten from him have been nicer than advertised.
David, This is a great organization, I encourage you to join. I have learned so much from this group.

[Brian Dudley]

That is not a parker ejector system. It is of aftermarket design. I could not imagine the factory installing someone else's ejector system in the gun. I wonder what exact documentation there is to support it?

Interesting on this one that you can see where the rib extension was filled in. Typically on guns without rib extensions, this is not visible.

[David C Porter]

I agree with Brian. Look at the inconsistency between the two forearm metals.

[Dean Romig]

There must be some kind of misunderstanding. Josh certainly knows that is not a Parker Bros. ejector system and I seriously doubt Parker nor Remington would have midified the gun that way.





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[Dave Noreen]

That pin forward of the hinge pin smacks of the Moran & Wolfersperger after-market ejectors, but the mechanism in the forearms doesn't look like the other M & Ws I've recorded. After M & W split up, Gus Habich in Indianapolis continued to offer the M & W ejectors.

These were said to be C.A. Fischer ejectors, though not stamped with all his patent dates --

115274

somewhat similar --

115277

These after-market ejectors show the same circle --

115275

as the #2 forearm --

115276

Moran & Wolfersperger ejectors --

115278

[David C Porter]

I asked Josh to post PGCA letter & pictures of serial numbers. He added to posting. Letter states no rib extension on original order. Then latter returned to add 2nd barrel, bore extractor hole out & supply split extractor & return. No mention of converting forearm extractor assembly to auto ejector assembly. Obviously, conversion was done by someone else & not Parker. So much for "all factory special order".

[Dean Romig]

Picky, picky, picky…





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[Reggie Bishop]

I think it’s a pretty rare gun. I have never seen a grade 4 with floral engraving.

[Alfred Greeson]

Unusual and beautiful Parker. You can bet the farm on Josh Loew and what he says. This is a rare bird with some unusual work not done by Parker I would guess too.

[Josh Loewensteiner]

David - by “all special order” I meant the engraving, lack of rib extensions. I will clarify the ad. No harm intended. It might have been more gentlemen like to ask me a question in private before assaulting my character.

[todd allen]

I've not done business with Josh, but I have met him, been advised on gun sales questions by him, and have been overall just paying attention.
Josh L is for real, and a true resource to our community. Go to him with real questions, and receive real answers.
That's been my experience.

[John Albano]

I have done business with Josh on several occasions. He has a wealth of knowledge and it is always a pleasure to do business with him. Josh will always answer any questions I may have honestly and I can make my own decisions.

[edgarspencer]

That gun has been shown at Hausmann's several years ago, and owned by several members, at various times.

[edgarspencer]

Interesting to note, that both fore end irons, which were extractor, were used in the conversions, but it appears they were done by two different men. I do remember when the gun was at the NE SxS, the fore end, whose hammers move fore and aft, was troublesome, But until just now looking at the pictures, don't remember the other fore end.

[David C Porter]

Of interest, the letter states gun was ordered & deliverd with 30" open choked barrel. In 1902 2nd 30" full choke barrel added. The GI listing claims 26" open choke barrel & 30" full choked barrel. Was the Parker book incorrect, or was the 30" open choked barrel cut down to 26"? In picture #18 the left barrel extractor looks like it was broken & welded up; excess weld. Also, forearm has 2 big cracks in the botton of the wood.

[Brian Dudley]

Interesting to note, that both fore end irons, which were extractor, were used in the conversions, but it appears they were done by two different men. I do remember when the gun was at the NE SxS, the fore end, whose hammers move fore and aft, was troublesome, But until just now looking at the pictures, don't remember the other fore end.

Edgar,

I do recall seeing a gun very similar to this one. A C grade with floral engraving. But do not think it was this one. I recall it being in original condition and not having aftermarket ejectors. I think Larry Frey may have had it.

[edgarspencer]

Edgar,

I do recall seeing a gun very similar to this one. A C grade with floral engraving. But do not think it was this one. I recall it being in original condition and not having aftermarket ejectors. I think Larry Frey may have had it.

You’re partly correct Brian, it was Larry, who had it at Haussmanns. I don’t specifically remember the condition, as much as the lack of rib extensions and aftermarket ejectors. His wife shot it with us on the lower course, and Larry said it was giving her trouble.

[Larry Frey]

Edgar and Brian are correct, I did own this gun for a short time but sold it on this site six years ago to another member. It was my belief that the first set of barrels were cut to 26'' possibly due to damage and a second 30'' set was ordered as per the letter. I seem to recall the barrel wedges were installed in the short barrels which could mean the work was done at the factory but it was not referenced in the letter so who knows. I have not seen the gun since the Turnbull restoration so if another member gets it hopefully, I will get to see it again someday.

[edgarspencer]

I have no doubt many would take exception to this, but if it were my gun, I’d do away with both fore end irons, and return the gun to its original state, as an extractor gun. I don’t feel that the after-market ejector system adds any value to the gun.

[Dean Romig]

No Edgar it doesn’t add a penny to it’s value however, the very well done aftermarket ejector ststem is part of the gun’s history, regardless of what a research letter may or may not say… and regardless of where it was done.
Me…?… I’d leave it just the way it is.





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[edgarspencer]

" the very well done aftermarket ejector ststem is part of the gun’s history, regardless of what a research letter may or may not say… and regardless of where it was done.
Me…?… I’d leave it just the way it is"

Im guessing you might not have been at Hausmann's that year, or at least weren't with Deb when she was "shooting" the gun. I say this, because the ejector system, maybe good on paper, wasn't working. I remember Larry being pretty annoyed (for the lack of a more colorful term) And, so what if it's part of it's history. Not all history proves to be good history. It's most important history is how it left the factory.

[Dean Romig]

No I don’t think I’ve ever seen it in use, just handled and hefted it a number of times in his gun room/vault. A beautiful gun!!!





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[Bruce Day]

Xxxx