Bidding Frenzy

[Arthur Shaffer]

There is a Parker DHE 20 gauge with 32" Titanic barrels on LSB right now. I bid $1k soon after it appeared so I would get bid notifications. It is a 1921 gun with several dents in one barrel that extend into the bore. The wood is rough with a lot of scratches and actual gouges, checkering is worn quite a bit, metal finish is not there on the action and the ejectors don't work. On the plus side it appears original and matches the book. I did a search and found that it's twin in much better condition sold on their site 4 or 5 years ago for $9250. Considering the visible condition and known problems (especially the barrel dents), it looks like a bidding frenzy is building. It is already near mid 3's with 9 days left in the auction. At the rate bids normally progress there, it may go to the 10,000 range. It is a nice original gun, but the potential pitfalls are big before it is restored.

[Ed Blake]

What’s the frame size?

[Brian Dudley]

It is an 0 frame.

Currently at $3,300

It will sell for much more.

It will sell for much more.

[Craig Larter]

What's LSB?

[Reggie Bishop]

Lock stock & barrel. It’s a gunbroker auction Craig.

[Russ Jackson]

Lock Stock and Barrel , a seller on Gun Broker !

[Steve Huffman]

Things will always sell for more if everyone knows what and where it is, just saying.

[Kevin McCormack]

"On the plus side it appears original and matches the book."

Not to come on to macabre, but so would dental records in a homicide.

[Russ Jackson]

I will probably get my head bit off for posting this but here goes ..... It never ceases to amaze me constantly how folks will get on a board and direct other folks to an auction with something for sale thinking they are helping everyone out by letting everyone know that there is something special up for grabs ! What about the people that are already bidding on it that are members of the board also and hoping to finally " Maybe " be able to pick something special up and actually get a decent deal on it ! After someone posts about it on the board where those items are collected by everyone on the board ,so much for that idea !!!! I understand if you have the item listed for sale here and there is no interest and you list it on an auction site then pointing everyone to your auction especially since we have to price our For Sale items here and you may have started your item at auction for a penny etc. ! I know personally ,I put a lot of time in searching guns for sale and when I was working ,I would get up an hour early every morning just to check the four or five sites that I frequent in search of guns before the crowd got out of bed and before I was tied up all day at work ! Last week I picked up on Gun Broker ,a super nice VHE 12 Gauge ,Very Late Remington era Parker built on the 1/2 Frame and I sure didn't steal it and even discussed how rare the 1/2 Frame guns are with the seller but every day the gun was on GB ,I kept checking our site and would even comment to my wife ,I wonder when this 1/2 Frame gun will be discussed on our Parker Site and still can't believe it wasn't ! I am not sour grapes and hadn't bid on this gun yet but I sure wish if folks don't own the gun or have an interest in its ending price that this would stop on our Board ! Hopefully I am not the only one that feels this way and maybe it won't ever stop but there are two sides to every story and the guy that's a member here and was already bidding ,I am sure feels beaten already ! Just My Opinion for what it's worth ! Thank You for reading !!!!

[CraigThompson]

I will probably get my head bit off for posting this but here goes ..... It never ceases to amaze me constantly how folks will get on a board and direct other folks to an auction with something for sale thinking they are helping everyone out by letting everyone know that there is something special up for grabs ! What about the people that are already bidding on it that are members of the board also and hoping to finally " Maybe " be able to pick something special up and actually get a decent deal on it ! After someone posts about it on the board where those items are collected by everyone on the board ,so much for that idea !!!! I understand if you have the item listed for sale here and there is no interest and you list it on an auction site then pointing everyone to your auction especially since we have to price our For Sale items here and you may have started your item at auction for a penny etc. ! I know personally ,I put a lot of time in searching guns for sale and when I was working ,I would get up an hour early every morning just to check the four or five sites that I frequent in search of guns before the crowd got out of bed and before I was tied up all day at work ! Last week I picked up on Gun Broker ,a super nice VHE 12 Gauge ,Very Late Remington era Parker built on the 1/2 Frame and I sure didn't steal it and even discussed how rare the 1/2 Frame guns are with the seller but every day the gun was on GB ,I kept checking our site and would even comment to my wife ,I wonder when this 1/2 Frame gun will be discussed on our Parker Site and still can't believe it wasn't ! I am not sour grapes and hadn't bid on this gun yet but I sure wish if folks don't own the gun or have an interest in its ending price that this would stop on our Board ! Hopefully I am not the only one that feels this way and maybe it won't ever stop but there are two sides to every story and the guy that's a member here and was already bidding ,I am sure feels beaten already ! Just My Opinion for what it's worth ! Thank You for reading !!!!

While I don’t disagree with you I don’t agree either . I used to get a little peeved of someone disclosed an auction item that intrested me . But it’s a free world so if someone wishes to make it known that’s their prerogative .

[Dave Noreen]

For the internet impaired --

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/952204647

This gun is another with a three-digit number stamped on the left barrel flat --

110893

[edgarspencer]

Russ, I wish there was a way I could hit the 'like' button more than once.
It might be one thing, if the listing had been up a while, and was 'obscure', but posting, altruistically, well after it was bid on, by fellow members is kind of disrespectful.

[Jerry Harlow]

Russ, I wish there was a way I could hit the 'like' button more than once.
It might be one thing, if the listing had been up a while, and was 'obscure', but posting, altruistically, well after it was bid on, by fellow members is kind of disrespectful.

Agreed. Postings of guns pending for sale other than this site, at an auction should be removed by the moderators. Best yet, not posted in the first place. If you want to let another know, PM them. It has bitten me before. I once saw a 20 Trojan that was broadcast by a Town Crier, but recognized the bidder as a member here, and although a good buy for me, I did not bid out of respect for him. He won it at a very good price.

My opinion.

[Reggie Bishop]

I am neutral on the matter. Personally I think anyone actively looking for such a gun will find it without much issue. I saw the listing right after it came online. It is the 21st Century and millions of people have access to the internet. We always tell people to put their gun on Gunbroker and it will bring whatever its fair market value is. So to me its moot.

[Brian Dudley]

Even though I have benefitted from time to time. I do completely agree with you Russ. I just dont understand it. If one does not have any dog in the fight, then why put it out there.? What does it benefit them???

I more look at it this way. Say the gun ends up being bad. Or the seller screws the buyer. Then resentment may be held towards the one who led the buyer to the gun. It just is not worth it.

[Ian Civco]

I will probably get my head bit off for posting this but here goes ..... It never ceases to amaze me constantly how folks will get on a board and direct other folks to an auction with something for sale thinking they are helping everyone out by letting everyone know that there is something special up for grabs ! What about the people that are already bidding on it that are members of the board also and hoping to finally " Maybe " be able to pick something special up and actually get a decent deal on it ! After someone posts about it on the board where those items are collected by everyone on the board ,so much for that idea !!!! I understand if you have the item listed for sale here and there is no interest and you list it on an auction site then pointing everyone to your auction especially since we have to price our For Sale items here and you may have started your item at auction for a penny etc. ! I know personally ,I put a lot of time in searching guns for sale and when I was working ,I would get up an hour early every morning just to check the four or five sites that I frequent in search of guns before the crowd got out of bed and before I was tied up all day at work ! Last week I picked up on Gun Broker ,a super nice VHE 12 Gauge ,Very Late Remington era Parker built on the 1/2 Frame and I sure didn't steal it and even discussed how rare the 1/2 Frame guns are with the seller but every day the gun was on GB ,I kept checking our site and would even comment to my wife ,I wonder when this 1/2 Frame gun will be discussed on our Parker Site and still can't believe it wasn't ! I am not sour grapes and hadn't bid on this gun yet but I sure wish if folks don't own the gun or have an interest in its ending price that this would stop on our Board ! Hopefully I am not the only one that feels this way and maybe it won't ever stop but there are two sides to every story and the guy that's a member here and was already bidding ,I am sure feels beaten already ! Just My Opinion for what it's worth ! Thank You for reading !!!!

This should be addressed by those in charge of this Forum.

The policy could be that there is NO discussion, other than in generic terms, of ANY firearm soon to be auctioned or there is NO link to nor mention of ANY upcoming auction. You can certainly post a photograph of a Parker soon to be auctioned as long as the photograph does not link to an auction site or indicate the full serial number, as searching by serial number will often easily locate a Parker soon to be auctioned off. And the photograph posted gives no indication of an upcoming auction. Posted simply for informative purposes, such as “Is this correct?”, or something similar to that.

The Smith & Wesson forum does exactly that. You post a link to or discuss an upcoming auction, it gets removed from the forum and you receive an infraction. If you find such a posting before the moderator does, there are ways to inform the moderator of this.

There’s no need to “notify” others of an upcoming auction. It isn’t a public service announcement, it’s detrimental to those who diligently did their homework and found the auction on their own.

This is similar to what happened when the internet came out. I used to attend local auctions in person. Failure to get your duff out of bed meant you didn’t participate. Now, anyone with a wallet and internet connection can participate. Takes the fun out of it. The only advantage you might have over an internet bidder, other than being able to see it in person, is you don’t have to pay for shipping. Sometimes this isn’t even an advantage when the shipping destination and cost to get it there is less than what it costs you with sales tax if another bidder in a distant location has lower or no sales tax than you do.

There are few bargains on Gunbroker. Most firearms posted there bring full retail, and then some!

[Bill Murphy]

Without reviewing the rules of this forum, I have to ask, "Is this thread within the forum rules?" Thanks for an answer from someone who is familiar with the rules.

[Jim DiSpagno]

I posted a similar argument agreeing with Russ several years ago. Although not prohibited it is just discourteous to those of us who put in the time and then get shut out. Just my opinion but totally agree with Russ

[Arthur Shaffer]

I find this amazing. For one thing, if you read the OP, I was one of the first bidders, and I posted. I see no difference in this than the plethora of posts about high grade guns being in an auction catalog which is weeks or months from the auction and going on for pages about its history, research etc with absolutely no negative comments about the posting. The participants even discuss their bids.

I would like to have the gun and have it restored. I won't pay a ridiculously high price that could never be recovered. If anyone thinks that in this day and age, a 32" barreled Parker 20 DHE O frame is going to go unnoticed on a major auction site, they are delusional. The only time this sort of thing happens, in my experience, is when guns are incorrectly identified, incorrectly described or there is too little information. In those cases, there is little interest because most people simply scan the titles of the listings.

I buy 2-4 guns a month on internet auctions and the really good buys are generally the result of this situation. The others I buy because I want them for a particular reason and will pay at or a little above the value to get it.

If someone thinks this thread is not under the rules, it should be deleted. If it is, then I can easily find 400-500 more that should be.

[Reggie Bishop]

When I was a kid my grandpa would take me along with him to the weekly livestock auction in a nearby community. There was always a group of guys in the parking lot who would approach folks bringing cattle to the public auction. My grandfather called these guys “pen hookers”. He told me that their goal was to buy the livestock from folks before they went to auction for less than what they were worth, then selling them for a profit. He likened them to, well let’s just say these “hookers” weren’t highly regarded.

He said a public auction was for selling at market prices. That was a life lesson for me. Not sure if this has anything to do with Parker guns but I like the memory.

[edgarspencer]

I find this amazing. For one thing, if you read the OP, I was one of the first bidders, and I posted.

Respectfully, Art, you made your post two and a half days after it was obvious that PGCA members were already bidding.

[Mills Morrison]

This is one of those things that seems like you are helping people out by pointing out a good gun / good deal, but you are not.

[Bill Davis]

In todays market, people get a little bit crazy over smaller bore guns with longer barrels—32 inches in particular. This gun is going to need a lot of work to make it right and those barrels look pretty beat up to me. Think hard on this one before bidding crazy money.

[todd allen]

It's all about whose ox gets gored.

[Craig Larter]

I posted that a 8 gauge shotgun was for sale at the small auction and received a few PM's calling me out. I never realized how sensitive others were to my attempt to be a nice guy. I find it hard to believe it is possible to keep a desirable gun quiet in this internet auction era, but I keep my mouth shut.

[Jim Wescott]

I see value in sharing the listings as more knowledgeable members often point out obscure defects that assist fellow members in their decisions. Folks have been able to dodge an overpriced and/or abused gun. Naturally the sharing also could put more horses in the race and drive the price up. I confess I’m not a collector and if I truly value a particular gun I reach out to trusted members for their insight.

[David C Porter]

Personally, I appreciate it when a member shares a listing that may be of interest to me and/or other members. The gun will go for what ever the bidders feel the gun is worth. So, if the bidding is more than it's worth, or more than you want to pay, stop bidding.

[tom tutwiler]

LSB does get some really nice guns and I like their method of selling vice some of the big auction houses that literally hammer you with their Buyers Premium.

[Jay Oliver]

I think for the most part the sharing is always done with good intentions, like this thread. We all get excited about Parkers. There is still that “thrill of the hunt” aspect of finding a unique gun that many of us enjoy and that is why there may be some resistance to this practice. Many of us have years in building relationships in the vintage gun market, which include transactions with various dealers/individuals. The internet has created an efficient market where everyone basically has access so that a first-time buyer(who may or may not be obsessed with Parkers) can bid on a gun we may have been searching for over several years. I guess that could have happen anyway in a traditional auction setting.

I am guilty of doing this myself here on the forum(with good intentions). I have posted links to auctions about certain guns, usually around condition. The “professionally restored” Parker that makes us all cringe, laugh or cry. Or sometimes a gun grade with a unique barrel steel. I have posted a link once to a late hammer gun and said something like “Someone please buy this before I do”.

I once posted a link to a Parker as a warning. It was a gun I had bought previously and returned because it had cracks in the barrels. My post was a genuine warning, then the more I thought about it I wanted to save the gun so I bid and won(and brought it back to working condition). I felt a little guilty about that since I ended up buying the gun. Though it was a process to get it right, which would make a great Parker Pages article.

I think at the end of the day we have a great community here with a lot of passion for the guns we collect. When you see something cool I understand that it may be hard to keep it to yourself and you can’t help but share it…

[CraigThompson]

Something was mentioned earlier about bidding against other folks on here , while that’s a very nice I don’t always agree with that . There are four or five folks on here I’ll contact if I’m intrested in something to see if they’re planning on bidding , my thinking being they can all afford a larger bid than I and no need in running each other up . HOWEVER I don’t avail the same courtesy to everyone , it’s quite simple friends are friends people you know are just that “just people you know” . The idea of buying for less then reselling for more should not be lost here , which when I read Russ’s post was my initial thought . Sorry if I’m incorrect but that’s the way I took it .

[Russ Jackson]

Something was mentioned earlier about bidding against other folks on here , while that’s a very nice I don’t always agree with that . There are four or five folks on here I’ll contact if I’m intrested in something to see if they’re planning on bidding , my thinking being they can all afford a larger bid than I and no need in running each other up . HOWEVER I don’t avail the same courtesy to everyone , it’s quite simple friends are friends people you know are just that “just people you know” . The idea of buying for less then reselling for more should not be lost here , which when I read Russ’s post was my initial thought . Sorry if I’m incorrect but that’s the way I took it .

The whole point of my post was ,there are a lot of us probably most of us here that seek out special guns ,sometimes you win and sometimes you lose ,that's an auction ! My only point was this ,if you don't have a dog in the fight ,or If you don't have any skin in the game however you wish to describe it ,Just don't say anything because it always affects some one ! As I pointed out if it is your gun ,by all means bring it to the Forefront and advertise it !!!! As With the initial post and I'm sure with all good intentions ,You may be trying to help someone but on the other hand you could be costing someone else ! That's all I was saying ,nothing to do with trying to get Something for Nothing ,Resale value ,Sour Grapes or any hidden agenda ,and I am not against bidding or being bid against ,I don't believe anyone enjoys buying and selling at auctions more than I do so Good Luck to the High Bidder !

[todd allen]

All I can say is, if I'm selling, you all are welcome to shout it and share it to infinity and back.
If I'm trying to buy something, Shush! Keep it under your hat!

[Aaron Beck]

One thing about all these sites is that the more searches, bids, shill bids or otherwise an item gets, the more the site will promote it. Good for business, of the hosting site and, tangentially, the seller but if you arent on that side I favor keeping it under your hat.

[Stan Hillis]

It's par for the course. This is not the old time way of gun shopping. We are all exposed to more guns for sale in a day than we used to be in a year, because of the internet. And, that's a good thing. But you can't have all the good without some of the inconveniences.

Evidently, the way the forum rules are written as of now it's anyone's right to announce to the forum a gun is for sale, and I have no problem with that as long as it's done with good intentions. If someone doesn't like that, they should get elected and work to change the rules. Sometimes we get the idea we should "have it our way", but this ain't Burger King. Anyone willing to go back to the old days of getting the opportunity to scope out one or two really nice guns a year, at the most? I'm not. If I get outbid on a gun because more of my fellow gun enthusiasts knew about it and bid, so what? There's more fish in the sea. This isn't life or death stuff.

[Robert Brooks]

It use to be fun to buy guns before we had the internet! Bobby

[John Bastiani]

It use to be fun to buy guns before we had the internet! Bobby I agree! It took alot of long distance phone calls and alot of gas but I enjoyed the hunt. I have been in some of the finest gun rooms in this country and met some great people to boot. Now most of the time it seems that you just hit a key on the computer to buy and seldom talk to the seller.

[Ian Civco]

All it takes is any idiot with a computer and a wallet to purchase firearms these days.

[Reggie Bishop]

I believe one of our members won the auction that was causing such a "frenzy". There was very little frenzy actually, with only 23 bids and none placed the final day. Congrats to the new owner and maybe he will share his plans for the DHE 20/32".

[Jay Oliver]

Happy to get this one and my plans are to save this Parker and get it back in the field. I will have a better assessment one I have the gun in hand.

This is going to be a fun project and I could see it becoming a “goto” Parker when all the work is done.

From what I can tell so far It needs the barrels dents removed and barrels re-blued. It needs ejector work, as we know that might be a simple fix or could be more involved. Lastly, I think I will get the stock refinished.

Then I plan to take it to South Dakota and go pheasant hunting :)

[Reggie Bishop]

Thanks Jay for replying and for saving this fine small bore Parker!

[Arthur Shaffer]

Congradulations!

I watched the bidding and was pretty certain you were going to persevere to the end. A bidding pattern on Gunbroker is becoming pretty common over the last several months. For any significant gun, there are vintage gun dealers (three in particular) who list their guns at really outrageous prices and bid these types of guns up to a fair market price before dropping out. I bid on 20-30 guns a month and buy 2-3. The same guys always show up.

[Mills Morrison]

Congradulations!

I watched the bidding and was pretty certain you were going to persevere to the end. A bidding pattern on Gunbroker is becoming pretty common over the last several months. For any significant gun, there are vintage gun dealers (three in particular) who list their guns at really outrageous prices and bid these types of guns up to a fair market price before dropping out. I bid on 20-30 guns a month and buy 2-3. The same guys always show up.

Interesting