Parker 16 gauge hammer gun help

[nicholas sham]

I bought a collection of guns which included a Parker, serial 01686. That's all I know and this gun is completely out of my wheelhouse so any info for identification and value would be appreciated. It appears operational and spacing between barrel and receiver is tight.

[Dan Steingraber]

It’s a very early lifter. A quick serial number check indicates no Parker records for the gun in the immediately available data base. You should consider spending the $40 to join our organization and you will quickly find it the best $40 you ever spent. The incredibly vast body of knowledge about all this Parker (and other guns) is mind boggling.

[Dean Romig]

It's an early Back Action Lifter. Lucky guy!!





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[edgarspencer]

Nicholas, what leads you to believe it's a 16ga.?

[Brian Dudley]

The gun is in decent condition and appearingly complete and operational.
The breech balls look on the small side, so I would suspect smaller than 12g. But maybe not 16g. It could be 14g. With this one, careful measurements of the bores and chambers would be very important.

[nicholas sham]

I know the person I purchased the estate from who told me it had been his grandfathers gun and it was 16 gauge. I do not know for sure but I am assuming he knew based on the other items I bought.

[edgarspencer]

I agree with Brian that the breech balls appear small, and while experience says never say never, a quick scan of the serialization book shows no 16ga guns for many thousand serial numbers. The very first entry says 16ga but I think that may be an error, since no 16 shows up until the 16,000 range. You may have a gun which was returned at a later date for new barrels. I think if it turns out to be a genuine 16ga back action gun, serious students of early Parker’s would love to put eyes on it.

[nicholas sham]

I live in the Dallas, Texas area so if there is someone local to me that knows what they are doing I would certainly like to meet them!

[Dean Romig]

Edgar - Robin's 16 gauge B Lifter ( 15566 ) was the first graded 16 ga Parker but he discovered there were a couple of earlier 16's.





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[edgarspencer]

Edgar - Robin's 16 gauge B Lifter ( 15566 ) was the first graded 16 ga Parker but he discovered there were a couple of earlier 16's.

Right. I was going from memory, and lately my CRS has flared up. I have 13563 highlighted as the first 16ga Parker.

[nicholas sham]

Anyone for a novice to be able to tell from home what gauge it is?

[Dean Romig]

Impossible to do with the pictures.





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[Dean Romig]

The PGCA has no records whatsoever of that serial number.
In fact, as stated earlier in this thread 1844 (probably a typo) is the earliest gun in the existing records.

You’ll need to have the chambers and bores accurately measured in thousandths of an inch.



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[Mike Poindexter]

Take a ruler and hold it across the muzzle to measure the inside diameter. If its around 3/4 " =/- 1/16 its probably a 12 ga. If its closer to 5/8" its probably a 16 ga. If you have more sophisticated measuring devices, the muzzle diameter of a full choke 12 ga. is usually around .700 and a 16 ga. around .635, ususally within 10 thousandths either way. FWIW

[Dan Steingraber]

Grab some spent 12 and 16 hulls and start trying them on for size.

[nicholas sham]

Hopefully this helps, I removed the forend and took a picture of two different areas that have markings/numbers, the serial on the receiver, and numbers under the forend. What I found interesting is the serial number under the forend is in the wood and matches the receiver but there is also another number in the metal.

[Dean Romig]

The number on the barrel flat is the order number, not the serial number.





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[nicholas sham]

pics of the markings

[Dean Romig]

Try taking other pictures. The only one in focus is the one in the wood.





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[edgarspencer]

Regardless what gauge it turns out to be, it appears to be in very nice condition, and very early.
As I recall, Jay Oliver has a couple of the earliest known. He’ll chime in here, I’m sure.

[Mills Morrison]

A very interesting example of an early Parker in any event. Never say never and hope you can verify the gauge

[Jay Oliver]

Nicholas, that looks like a nice early back action lifter. My “guess” is that it is chambered for the Parker 12B cartridge, which was rather short lived. It is about the same as a 14 gauge paper shell if I am remembering correctly. I am showing 2 different guns below. The first is serial# 97 that is chambered in 12B. You can see the inside measurement of the bores.

I did put a 16 gauge shell in and it is loose but fits. It almost will slide past the extractor. If you have access to 16 gauge shells you can test this. I could see someone who was not as addicted to Parkers as some of us, quickly putting a 16 gauge shell in and assuming it was a 16 gauge. This would be very dangerous to shoot.

I also posted some pictures of an early 16 gauge lifter serial# 16247 measuring it the same way and you can see it is slightly smaller.

The 12B shell is obsolete and you likely won’t find any 14 gauge paper shells either. I did have Rocky Mountain Cartridge make 50 - 12B shells copied from an original I sent them.

I hope this helps. Let us know what you find out.

*Quick Edit...I know I need to get some better measuring tools, it's long overdue!

[Mills Morrison]

I bet Jay is right. As you can see, he knows hammer guns