Stork delivered a new 5lb 10oz baby today

[Andrew Sacco]

More details if you like but an honest bird chaser.

[Andrew Sacco]

Three more

[Brian Dudley]

Was it a breech birth?

[JAMES HALL]

Boy or girl?

[Garry L Gordon]

Fess up. I'll bet you talk baby-talk to it. (I sure would!)

[Mike Franzen]

That’s light. What length are the barrels?

[Harold Lee Pickens]

Wow, 2lbs 13 oz unstruck barrel weight for a 16, are they 26"? That is one light gun, never had one under 6 lbs. Great find, looks like a solid gun. I'd like to feed that baby some of my nice light 3/4 and 7/8 oz loads.
How is it choked?

[Andrew Sacco]

Thank you for the comments everyone, very funny! Harold, yes, it's 26" even though I've been looking for a year for one with 28" barrels on an O frame. Matches the serialization book and appears to be honest. There is a small stock repair, but looks like someone may have put a swivel in for a sling, so there's a plug. It's choked IM/F and damn I wish it was more open. Took it out an hour after I got it and did 19/25 at skeet (RST Falcon Lite #8) which for me is about what I do with my clays gun on many days. LOP is 14 1/8" a tad short but with bird hunting gear it's going to be a dandy. Shooting that round I kept forgetting it was a 16, sure handles nice for me. Anyone care to help with how to develop a "spreader" load in 16? I don't find spreader wads, only the Polywad thumbtack thingy.

[Randy G Roberts]

I don't find spreader wads, only the Polywad thumbtack thingy.

Andy I have used that Polywad Thumbtack Thingy and patterned at least 3 different guns with them. I have actually been quite impressed with the results. All 3 were 12 gauge guns. They are a PITA to reload admittedly. Now I probably have 10 boxes or more loaded for clays and I don't even take them to the shoots. I need to use them up.

[James L. Martin]

I have been using the polywad in 12,16,20 and 28ga. They really work,give them a try.

[Harold Lee Pickens]

Ballistic products make their Spreader X insert, seems to work well. Takes up the space of 1/8 oz shot, so I use 7/8 oz recipe wit 3/4 oz shot plus spreader x insert.

[Andrew Sacco]

Thank you. I've used the Spreader X with 12 gauge with some success. I'll look at the thumb tack thingy too : )

[Mills Morrison]

Very nice! 28” are a dime a dozen. I am a fan of 26”

[Andrew Sacco]

Very nice! 28” are a dime a dozen. I am a fan of 26”

Thank you Mills. My Trojan 16 with 26" barrels just seems to point and handle so well, this is lighter but not a waif so I am starting to see the appeal of 16's on an O frame. Two things I do not have are a hammer gun and something with a damascus barrel. I feel like getting twisty and hammered if I can find one. In 16 of course... : )

[Dean Romig]

My Grade 1 T/A 16 on the 0-frame with 26" Laminated Steel barrels is the only known Parker produced in this exact configuration. It is a wonderful woodcock and grouse gun.

.

[Andrew Sacco]

Dean that looks incredible. I wouldn't expect to find one in a hammer on an 0 frame. Excellent : )

[Dean Romig]

They are out there Andy - keep looking.





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[Harold Lee Pickens]

Indeed they are, 16 ga , O frame with lightening cuts, 26"

[CraigThompson]

More details if you like but an honest bird chaser.

20 or 28 ?

[Jerry VanHorn]

They are indeed out there..My 16 hammer is also an "O" frame with the lightening cuts....28"............ I bought a 16 hammer from Jim Hall 20 years ago..long since gone..and I don't recall the frame size..

[Andrew Sacco]

20 or 28 ?

16 Craig

[JAMES HALL]

0 with light cuts

[todd allen]

I picked up a 28" BBLd 16 ga hammer gun years ago. SN# 72105 An "0" frame with lightening cuts, fish tail top lever, and pistol grip stock.
It is a project gun, despite having been apparently used very little. (wood and metal are in fantastic condition) Some clown cold-blued the barrels, and put some kind of shellac or cheap clear coat over the stock wood.
I very carefully removed all of the barrel blue, as well as the incorrect wood finish. Stock dimensions are wrong for me, with 3 1/2" DAH and would need to be bent upward. LOP is perfect for me, @ 14 1/4".
I spoke to Brad Bachelder about a mild restoration, and had a price established for the work, but unfortunately Brad passed away before I pulled the trigger on the job. My bad!

[Andrew Sacco]

That sounds like a nice gun Todd.

[Frank Srebro]

[snip] ...... It's choked IM/F and damn I wish it was more open ..........

I've got several vintage smallbore "bird guns" that are honest but not high end collector pieces and they've all been properly opened to IC or Light Mod and Imp-Mod. And if the new chokes are properly done (tapered to the muzzle for Parkers) they’ll pass for factory work except with the very closest scrutiny. One less thing to think about when out in the covers. I do use handloaded spreaders in tightly choked 12-gauge for in the face clays during COMPETITION SxS events but that's about it. JMO of course.

[CraigThompson]

I used to be real big on bird chokes in quail/grouse guns meaning open . And I think I got that way from shooting how many 100’s of thousands of rounds of skeet . But now I find myself feeling more comfortable with tighter choked guns on sporting clays and of course I shoot the same guns at skeet now as well as live birds . I suspect THE most open gun I’ll take to the Koneski Extravaganza will be M&F with most being full and full . I find anymore with open chokes I tend to try and shoot to fast thinking the target or feathered bird will outrun the capabilities of my choke . Where as if I’m shooting a tighter choked gun I shoot more relaxed and I suppose in a more comfortable state .

[Craig Larter]

Frank I know you have done much study and shooting research with respect to chokes so I value your opinion. I have a 20 ga Fox that I want to make into a grouse and woodcock gun (now M&F). I was thinking of .006 (IC) and .010 (light modified). Your input appreciated.

[Dean Romig]

Craig, in my opinion those would be too open and your shooting would suffer in the late season when leaves are down and the birds flush farther out.

I would open them to about .010” and .020” and then pattern them. You can always open them a tad more but you can’t put metal back.




.

[Frank Srebro]

Craig, thanks for your vote of confidence. Here in northeast PA the days of close flushing grouse are distant. IMO hunters have culled the "dumb ones" and the current gene pool makes for wary birds that will generally flush much farther out than even one human generation ago. Then you’ve got avain and land predators galore, more so than in days past and making for spooky birds. As you know I mainly concentrate on grouse and will take woodcock and pheasants on opportunity. When opening a tightly-choked 20 bore for the uplands I'll make the chokes about .010 and .018 (Light and Improved Modified with modern plastic shot cup ammo). But if I were concentrating on woodcock with the occasional grouse I'd go for about .003 and .013. Of course these constrictions aren’t absolute; a thou or two either way won’t make that much difference in patterning and with any choke you ‘ll get some variability from use of different shells.

[Andrew Sacco]

I set up a paper target in my back yard and from 20 yards with my M/F 16 GH and RST Falcon Lites the pattern was slightly high but more evenly uniform and spread than I would have dared imagine. I repeated it, and the shot pattern wasn't too awful tight again and I think for Grouse and woodcock flushing a bit further out (a la Srebro..) it will be just fine as is. I have yet to do other guns.

[Stan Hillis]

Frank I know you have done much study and shooting research with respect to chokes so I value your opinion. I have a 20 ga Fox that I want to make into a grouse and woodcock gun (now M&F). I was thinking of .006 (IC) and .010 (light modified). Your input appreciated.

Craig, I would trust Frank's judgement on choking a bird gun without question. I did the same thing you're considering about a year and a half ago. I have a sweet Fox 20 Sterly Ejector that I wanted to be my dedicated quail and woodcock gun. Dean Harris opened it to .006" and .016", at my request. Used it last season on several hunts and found it to be perfect for my needs. He also lengthened the chambers to 2 3/4" for me while he had it. I have been pleasantly surprised at how hard the .016" barrel hit some wild flushing, rather long quail.

I know quail and woodcock won't be the primary game for yours, and I freely admit to knowing less than nothing about grouse. If I were to be "building" a grouse gun I would feel perfectly suited to follow Frank's lead.

[Brett Hoop]

Grouse gun chokes are interesting topic for me also. Much depends on how and when you hunt them. My choice being hunting with pointing dogs, and young ones almost exclusively, I don’t shoot wild flushes. No matter how much experience a dog has with grouse some birds are going to get bumped, but when all goes well the experience is up close and personal. With both grouse and woodcock I would be confident in saying inside 25 yards for the open first barrel. And although being sick with “ the next ones the best one”. The gun that’s first out and most successful is a 20 ga with .005/ .010 with 7/8 oz of 8s in the right and 7 1/2 or 7s in the left.

I also have a very fine and great handling flushing dog that I could brag on his large number brought to hand birds. For his work I require a bit tighter chokes, even though I can read him well and know when he’s hot. The distance to first shot is frequently a bit longer.

[Gary Laudermilch]

I would suggest you borrow an open choked gun and shoot it some at clays to get a feel for what it will do. A Q1/Q2 repro would fit the bill quite nicely. You just might be pleasantly surprised. Make sure you use the ammo you intend to hunt with as the shell alone can make a huge difference in pattern performance. When it comes to woodcock and grouse it depends what dog you are hunting behind. It does not matter much what choke you have at 10-15 yards. Even a cylinder bore will blow a bird to bits if centered.