Skeuse Parkers, .410 Barrels

[Bobby Cash]

Regarding the Winchester / Parker 2 barrel sets,
How many of these sets were really made ?
Did each barrel have it's own forend ?
Are their examples of each gauge (bore) available in 26" and 28" ?
Were the barrels marked 1 and 2 ?

Regarding after market .410 barrels.
Did anyone other than CSMC produce them ?
How did the barrel stamping (and flats) differ between Winchester / Parker and CSMC barrels ?
How did these barrels fit on the original 28 gauge forend ?
Did the breach end diameter differ from the 28 gauge barrels ?

Thanks,
Bobby

(7/27) All good questions Bob, thanks for playing.

[Pat Dugan]

I bought a set of ,
.410 CSMC BARRELS
THEY HAD TO BE FITTED
28 GA SKEUSE FOREND
WORKED FINE ONLY
PROBLEM WAS EJECTOR
STOP WAS DEFECTIVE
THEY SENT MORE BUT
WERE BRITTLE AND DID
NOT WORK, HAD BILL
SCHWARTZ FIX PROBLEM
SO SUPER SATISFIED EVEN
WITH HAVING TO REPAIR
NEW .410 BARRELS

[Dean Romig]

The other company that attempted it went bust and a few people were left hung out to dry. The quality was inferrior ant they were heavy and unbalanced.
I don’t remember the name of the company but it’s good that they’re gone.





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[Greg Baehman]

Dean, are you referring to the Simmons Co. in Olathe, KS? I know there was some discussion here of them producing barrels to fit Parkers, but don't recall if any were actually produced and sold.

[Dean Romig]

No, it wasn’t Simmons. Wish I could remember the name....





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[Bill Murphy]

We (some PGCA members) examined the Simmons attempt to manufacture Parker barrels. The initial inspection made clear that their present shop employees could not duplicate the quality of past efforts with Winchester and Krieghoff barrels. The barrels were very poorly made and couldn't be fitted to existing Parkers, regardless of claims to the contrary. The Simmons representative could not have been more unaware of the result of their attempts. Nice guy, though. Our one meeting ended the Simmons project. We heard no more from them. I was very disappointed.

[Jim DiSpagno]

Production with proper rib matting and engraving(outsourced) was cost prohibitive

[Dean Romig]

No, it wasn’t Simmons. Wish I could remember the name....
.


I think they were in Louisiana




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[Bill Murphy]

Jim, the Simmons barrels were unacceptable, nothing to do with matting or engraving cost. The barrels were junk. The company that Dean mentions is not familiar to me. Someone should know who they were. Simmons were the only barrels that I am aware of that were presented to us for approval. Simmons thought they were finished. They were not "finished".

[Jim DiSpagno]

Thanks Bill only going on a phone conversation with them several years ago

[Bill Murphy]

Their phone and written conversations with Simmons were very upbeat. The sample gun was not acceptable at all. I believe the presentation of the sample gun was at the Vintage Cup at Queenstown, Maryland. I don't remember the year, but the Vintage Cup was only in Maryland a short time.

[Greg Baehman]

Here's a link to the Simmons barrel discussion from 2010:
http://parkerguns.org/forums/showthread.php?t=1694&highlight=.410+repro+barrels

[joe breda]

Here’s a novel approach.
First I want to state, I’m mostly a shooter! Although I do appreciate the true collectors views, enthusiasm, the hunt for finding original pieces Etc. I also do have a few original specimens etc. and enjoy them for what they are and enjoyed the hunt in finding them, then negotiating a fair price. I love those that I have.
But as I said in the beginning “ IM A SHOOTER FIRST AND FOREMOST “!
My ratio is about 75% shooter & 25% collector.
Hence I combined the two into my 28ga Skeuse Parker and have the best combination of the two.
Long long ago, I sent my 26” barrels to Briley and had fitted 410 tubes manufactured.
The cost was around $750 dollars for the tubes, shipping and insurance etc.
There are those that may say tubes highly disturb the balance of some guns, and I couldn’t agree more, but that’s in MOST guns ! Not true concerning the 28 gauge 26” barreled Skeuse Parkers. In fact, my experience was , it enhanced the balance. What it also did was took the whippy-ness out of the 5.7 pound gun.
Most guns with tubes feel like there is an anchor hanging off the front of the barrels with tubes installed? But like I said, not the 28 gauge 26” Parker’s. To me it was the rare occasion, that it improved the handling. Also the 28 gauge’s light weight had substantial recoil, compared to other 28 gauges, more like a light 20 gauge with full factory loads.
The Briley’s took care of the recoil issue also.
Now I’m not saying the recoil in the 28 gauge is highly substantial, and would be just fine in the field. But like I said, I’m a shooter, and a shooter that shoots mostly clay targets. Hundreds of them at a time. So for me any reduction in recoil make the day more comfortable.
Sooooo, if there are any SHOOTERS, out there that would like to shoot 410’s out of their Skeuse Parker’s, I highly recommend a set of 410 Briley’s !
Everyone that has tried mine with the 410 tubes, have raved over them, and said what a pleasure it was. I recent acquaintances just purchased a Skeuse 28, after shooting his for a round or two, he tried mine. He said what a pleasure and is going to send his barrels to Briley ASAP to have a set fitted!
Again, this post is aimed at the Shooter that would like to shoot 410’s out of his or her 28 gauge Skeuse Parker’s ?
Believe me when I tell you,.... it was the BEST $750 dollars I EVER spent !
And,... nowadays, I rarely take the out !
Side note:
The Briley’s come with screw in chokes, so you can choose any choke arrangement you want! AND, overall you will NOT. be alternating your collector Skeuse Parkers in any way, hence having the best of two worlds, collator and shooter !
I’ll probably get a rash for writing this, and that I’m missing the point etc.
so be it! Please keep in mind, I am 75% shooter , and 25% collector, so if others are in that category as I, have some fun, and go get a set of Briley’s made ?
CHEERS,
JoeB

[joe breda]

Pictures of Briley’s 410 tubes installed in

[Bill Murphy]

And not a word about the Simmons barrel project since April 2010. What's the latest from the few posters who actually committed to them in 2010?

[Chuck Heald]

The other company that attempted it went bust and a few people were left hung out to dry. The quality was inferrior ant they were heavy and unbalanced.
I don’t remember the name of the company but it’s good that they’re gone.

.

Dean,
I only know of Pitty Pat Dugan and myself that received the CSMC 410 barrels. There are likely others, but in the years since I've received mine, Pat and I are the only ones that have surfaced on forums that I've checked into.

I will say that the quality of the workmanship rivals the OEM Repro barrels, I think Pat will support that, but they are indeed heavy. This was due to the need to have the breech ends match the 28 gauge frame. There's just no elegant way to transition from 410 tubes to a 28 ga breech diameter while keeping the weight down and having a practical method of forming a water table on the barrels. They chose to go with an aesthetically pleasing taper on the outside, which makes for a heavy barrel set. While they are heavy, the gun is still around 6 1/2 lbs or less and swings nicely as much of the added weight is between the hands.

regards
Chuck

[Pat Dugan]

I have shot at least
2000 .410 shells thru the barrels,
Both 2.5 and 3 inch after the
Bill Schwartz repair. Some people said it was too agressive repair, its fine and i dont think it will fail

[Dean Romig]

Thanks Chuck for the good information. The name of the company I’m trying to pull from my memory banks is not CSMC and it is not Briley. Maybe some day I will remember....





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[Pat Dugan]

.410 Ejector stop

[Bill Murphy]

Simmons is the company that committed to making barrels but apparently did not. My question was, and still is, "Did anyone who committed to purchase the Simmons barrels ever complete the purchase?"

[Dave Noreen]

How did Parker do the ,410-bore barrels to fit the 28-gauge frame for the J. Cliff Green set?

87215

[Bill Murphy]

Good question, Dave. I assume the .410 breeches are a bit thick on a 00 frame. However, the way it should have been done is to put them both on the 000 frame. Parker made at least one or two 28s on 000 frames and they worked out just fine. One of our members was proud of his AAHE 28 on the 000 frame. We inspected both of his smallbores at the OGCA show when they hosted our organization. These guns were first outed at the Timonium Maryland Gun Show a while back.

[Bill Murphy]

The two 000 frame 28 gauge Parkers were made about the same time as the Cliff Green guns. I don't know why the Cliff Green 28-.410 gun was made on the 00 frame.