"Fish Tail" barrel release lever.

[Greg Crockett]

Some Parkers have an artistically curved barrel release lever, which I think is called the "fish tail." I was wondering if the membership would consider a few questions about them:

1. When did Parker start offering this curved style of barrel release?

2. Was the fish tail release lever a special order item?

3. How desireable, if at all, is this lever style to Parker collectors?

Thanks,
Greg

[Robin Lewis]

"Fish tail" release levers were used on hammer guns to allow the gun to be opened when the right hammer was in the full cock position. Their use on hammerless guns is also seen and is probably the result of their trying to use up inventory.

[Greg Crockett]

Thank you for the answer.

The "fish tail" I have is on a hammerless action made in 1889 (first year of hammerless production). The curved metal appeared to have no purpose on this hammerless gun other than ornamental. Your logical answer now places the curved release lever in proper prospective.

Best regards,
Greg

[Dave Purnell]

Another unintended benefit of the fishtail, is that it makes it easier for a lefty like me to open the gun.

Dave

[David Dwyer]

The fishtail is an added plus on a toplever and IMHO adds to the desirability of the gun. How much it adds to value ?? maybe a little
David

[Dean Romig]

The Fish Tail top lever is rarely seen on the larger frame Parkers as the frame is wide enough on these guns to allow the opening of the gun with the right hammer at full cock without any interference between the right hammer and the straight lever. It is my experience that guns of frame size #1 and smaller more often have the Fish Tail top lever.

[Austin W Hogan]

Look at pages 25 and 26 of current Parker Pages. The B on pg 26 is a two frame, and the D on page 26 is a 3 frame.

Best, Austin

[James T. Kucaba]

Another unintended benefit of the fishtail, is that it makes it easier for a lefty like me to open the gun.

Dave

Dave, I'm a lefty as well ... I never gave it any thought, but now that you mention it, fishtail guns really are easier for me to open.

Best regards Jim Kucaba ... AriZOOna Cactus Patch ... Email: JimKucaba@aol.com

[Stephen Hastie]

My Parker 10 gauge No3 frame has a fish tail again as a lefty it makes things a little easier.

Steve

[Patrick Lien]

The fishtail is an added plus on a toplever and IMHO adds to the desirability of the gun. How much it adds to value ?? maybe a little
David

And lets not forget that it loooooks gooood!!! Show up at the double gun shoot and all the other little boys have straight top levers and you got the "fishtail".

My current favorite Paker is an 1892 1 frame gh with 32" tubes and a fishtail toplever. Every time I pick it this gun up I admire that top lever. IMHO it would look good on any Parker and I wish I could have it on all of them.

Patrick

[Dave Suponski]

Dean, I don't think I agree with that "small frame theory" I also have a 3 frame 10 with the fishtail top lever. Serial 75,something.

[Robin Lewis]

Dave, you may not remember this, but when you were younger you could have told us the whole serial number from memory. 75 something....... they do say the the mind is the SECOND thing to go.

[scott kittredge]

i too have a 3 frame with a fishtail,s/n ? well it was made in 1891 that i do know, my mind was the 1st to go , most all the other things work just fine:rotf: scott

[Dave Suponski]

Seems to me you and I aren't that far apart in age Robin....so if your memory is so good.....well you know......:whistle:

Scott, Not to worry... The mind thing is an symptom of Parker-Fever...

[Robert Rambler]

I also have a 3 frame 10 with the fishtail top lever. Serial 75,something.

Same here, serial# 51xxx

[Dean Romig]

Gentlemen and 'Doubting Thomases"; Please consult your "Bible" Vol. 1, pgs. 112 & 126 for a full explanation of the "Hooked Top Lever". As stated, Parker Brothers had a surplus of hooked top levers and used them on more and more guns including hammerless guns (and may I add 'larger frame' guns as well) so, as I stated before, it isn't an absolute to a specific frame size, but an observation of mine.

[Stephen Hastie]

here is a picture of the top lever on my Parker 10

http://i397.photobucket.com/albums/pp51/Sundodger1/sarahspics041.jpg

[Dean Romig]

Nice picture!

[Gary Carmichael Sr]

Gents, check your hammers I have a couple guns that have the hammer on the right side ground out! but yet they still have "fishtail levers". This work was obviously done at the factory because they are identical in location of the indentation. and several thousand serial numbers apart. I will check further to see the frame size both are 12 ga.

[Austin W Hogan]

Serial Number Frame Size Lever Type Opens When Right Hammer Cocked?

26145 1 Straight Yes

31747 1 Straight Yes

39315 1 Straight Yes

46024 3 Straight No

51702 3 Fishtail Yes

55036 2 Fishtail Yes

59569 2 Fishtail No

69017 1 Fishtail No

159157 2 Fishtail No

Best, Austin

[Dean Romig]

Austin's ser. nos. 59569 and 159157 just exemplify that we can 'never say never' about anything Parker.
The Fishtail lever was developed specifically to facilitate opening the gun with the right hammer fully cocked.

This is really getting to be FUN!

[Dean Romig]

Gary, will you please post pictures of your find?

[Dave Suponski]

Dean and I have discussed this at the Vintager's. I would like to find the earliest hammerless gun with a fishtail top lever. I have 68805 and I think Dean has one a little earlier. Dean please post your gun's serial number. We could give this info to Josh for "Parker Found".

[Bill Zachow]

I would have to say that the fish tail levers were most likely used on all frame sizes. I have a 6 frame 8 gauge with such a lever. It is a hammer gun made in 1892.

[Austin W Hogan]

Serial Number Frame Size Lever Type Opens When Right Hammer Cocked?
I often cite the big safety factor of the Parker lifter gun is that it can be safely opened with live rounds in the chambers, and the hammers cocked. It appears that this feature
was continued through early top actions, but ceased somewhere around s/n 40000.

Serial Frame Lever Type Opens With Hammer Cocked?

26145 1 Straight Yes

31747 1 Straight Yes

39315 1 Straight Yes

46024 3 Straight No

51702 3 Fishtail Yes

55036 2 Fishtail Yes

59569 2 Fishtail No

69017 1 Fishtail No

159157 2 Fishtail No

Best, Austin


I will add two notes to the table: 59569 does not have its original hammers; it does not open with grade three hammers, but does open with the hammer from 55036.
There was a change in hammer design and profile around s/n 30,000. 26145 has the same hammers as all lifter guns; 31747 has the later t/a grade 0,1,2 hammer profile.
This table is a small sample but it seems to counter all the rules; the three one frame straight lever guns do open, but the single three frame straight lever does not; Two fishtail lever guns open; three made after the beginning of hammerless production do not. It may be that changes to the bolt retraction bell crank mechanism may acount for the problem, and the fishtail was a partial cure.
I have just re read Charlie's pages 112 -113 and 126. His quote of the C customer's request for a bent lever verifies that Parker owners were aware of the problem and that the fishtail bend was the percieved cure. Get well Charlie; your caveats cover all of the deviations in this table.
Best, Austin

[Dean Romig]

Dave, my GH 12 1-frame with the fishtail lever is ser. no. 67,669 but as we discussed at the Annual PGCA Banquet I saw two hammerless guns there with fishtail levers that have lower serial numbers.

[Austin W Hogan]

What is the greatest serial; I have a GH two barrel set 73201

Best, Austin

[Stephen Hastie]

here is the serail #73228 of my frame 3 10 with fishtail

[scott kittredge]

mine is a 3 frame 30 inch, round knob. NH 71474 not older but FYI

[Dave Suponski]

My fishtail 10 gauge NH is 73066

[George Blair]

BH 73303 #1 frame 12ga fishtail

[Gary Carmichael Sr]

Gents, I have found some interesting differences in my fishtail lever guns, below find that list with findings.

1-C-grade hammer, 12ga #2 frame 30" Ser# 36491

2-P-grade hammer, 16ga #0 frame 26" Ser# 53516

3-0-grade hammer, 12ga #1 frame 28" Ser# 53890

4-G-grade hammer, 12ga #2 frame 30" Ser# 55541

5-P-grade hammer, 8ga #6 frame 34" Ser# 74619

6-B-grade hammer, 12ga #2 frame 30" Ser# 91632 "Titanic barrels hammer filed"

7-D-grade hammer, 12ga #2 frame 30" Ser# 156982 "Titanic barrels hammer filed"

Notice that both the hammer guns that have "filed hammers" are titanic barrels, I have a couple other fishtail guns but can not get to them very easy. does any body else have filed hammers. on any guns with or wiyh out fishtail levers. The list above runs from Ser#36491 to 156982 REgards Gary

[Gary Carmichael Sr]

I am unable to post pictures right now!

[Austin W Hogan]

Gary; My big two frame P hammer, 159157 does not have the hammers filed, and does not open with the right hammer cocked. You have seen this gun, it is the 32 inch 2 frame P grade I brought for the waterfowl gun display at the banquet a few years ago.

Best, Austin

[Dean Romig]

1-Frame GH 30" # 67669 weighs 7 lbs., 11 oz.

[Gary Carmichael Sr]

Austin, Yes I remember the gun, I have all my guns put away since I am leaving to go to Fla. so I can not provide photo's now. Have been snowed in here for 2weeks have not been able to leave in my motor home, will be back here in April if all goes as planned. If I am stuck here for several weeks I will dig them out. The info posted is from my records. Regards, Gary Merry Xmas!

[Bill Zachow]

Hammergun, my 8 gauge is serial 74622, part of a consecutive 4 gun order that includes your 8. All went to California. How mine made it back to central NY, I do not know.

[Gary Carmichael Sr]

Bill, You were tracking the other two did you ever find them? Merry Xmas!

[Bill Zachow]

H'Gun, I believe one is upper Michigan with the good Doctor Boukamp. Where the other is, I do not know.

[Robert Dillon]

Hello, sirs. Thanks for a website about a great gun. I've been a lurker for a while, but completed registration info. to be able to post. My PGCA dues plan to be mailed in the a.m. I was "Parkerless" for a while, but recently ( like last week ) have aquired a pair of GH's, and I don't ever want to be "Parkerless" again. What caused me to post here was the request for early fishtail lever hammerless gun info. Here's mine : GH, #1 frame, 30" uncut bbls, serial #66448. Hope this helps.

thanks, redoftx.

[Dave Suponski]

Welcome Robert and thanks for the info....:)

[Dean Romig]

Hi Redoftx, I've seen your posts on the doublegun website. Welcome! That's an early serial number but I'm not sure it's the earliest for a hammerless with the fishtail lever. I think I remember seeing one in the high 50K range.

[Robert Dillon]

Thank you Autumn Daze, and thanks Chilled Shot. Still finding out how to navigate this bbs. Otherwise I'd have put "thanks" at the bottom of your posts. I am looking forward to learning alot more about Parkers and acquiring more of them too.

thanks.

[Robin Lewis]

Robert, to put the thanks at the bottom of a post, just click the little "thumbs up" symbol at the bottom of a post you want to ack with a thanks.