Parker identification

[Joseph Moyles]

I am new to the Parker Forum and have a question about my Parker 20 gauge. I believe it is a VH because of the markings on it. When I look up the information it show engraving which my gun doesn't have. How can I tell for sure that it is a VH? It has a Trojan barrel. All the serial numbers match (212800).

[Bruce Day]

How can I tell for sure that it is a VH? It has a Trojan barrel. .


That's because its a Trojan grade gun.

[Joseph Moyles]

Thanks for the info Bruce. Why does it have a V on the water table?

[Bruce Day]

Post photos. The SN book says 212,800 is a Trojan. Does the frame look like a Trojan or like a V?

Both Trojans and V grades are sometimes later altered to the owner's idea of improved engraving. Sometimes its good, sometimes awful.

[Joseph Moyles]

Photos

[Pete Lester]

It is an unmolested Trojan 20ga and there is no shame in that. I see the OV stamp on both receiver and barrel and the frame is the unique Trojan frame. Nice gun, enjoy!

[Joseph Moyles]

Thanks for the info Peter.

[Pete Lester]

Your welcome Joseph. It looks to be a nice gun, what is the barrel length and chokes? The Trojan 20's generally command the higher price compared to 16's and 12's in that grade. There are some who have no interest in Trojans and consider them to be too pedestrian. I really like them and I have personnally listened to Babe DelGrego extoll their virtues especially handling. He also has stated Remington would have done better to reintroduce the Trojan than the A1 Special years back. You own a Parker, that means you own the best there is in doubleguns. Again congrats and enjoy shooting it.

[Bruce Day]

He also has stated Remington would have done better to reintroduce the Trojan than the A1 Special years back.


At approximately $12,000 each new manufactured break even price, I wonder how many they would have sold.

[Pete Lester]

Where do you get the $12k cost to build? Seems a bit high looking at the price of a Browning BSS before it went out of production and the price of the ill fated Ruger Gold Label.

[Joseph Moyles]

Hi Peter,

Here is a description of it, 60% bluing, 60% wood finish, 10% case coloring. Overall condition 60 % per Sportsman Inc. gunsmith.
Stock shorten but reattached with original piece. LOP 15”, D@C 1 7/8”, D@Pad 2 7/8”, DT, SF, SR, PG.
Small chip out of stock at trigger guard, butt plate missing but leather recoil pad added, 26” Modified
and Full barrels per Sportsman Inc. gunsmith. Serial number 212800.

[Pete Lester]

Hi Peter,

Here is a description of it, 60% bluing, 60% wood finish, 10% case coloring. Overall condition 60 % per Sportsman Inc. gunsmith.
Stock shorten but reattached with original piece. LOP 15”, D@C 1 7/8”, D@Pad 2 7/8”, DT, SF, SR, PG.
Small chip out of stock at trigger guard, butt plate missing but leather recoil pad added, 26” Modified
and Full barrels per Sportsman Inc. gunsmith. Serial number 212800.

Joseph I am confused, do you own it or looking at for possible purchase?

PS. If the stock was cut down and reattached that is molested. I thought the line I was seeing in the picture was due to the leather pad. This aleration has a BIG impact on the price or value in my opinion.

[Bruce Day]

I know its high, shockingly high. Its a number I heard or read a number of times. It was based upon Rem doing the work here, not out sourced to Japan or Turkey or becoming a Repro Trojan. But it left no doubt in my mind about what a value the Repros are for a fine gun.
and a factor in why I bought one back then.

If that number is inaccurate, maybe somebody else who was around in the 90's with an interest in Parkers could add in.

But think about it. I tried to order a new base grade unengraved, black, forged, Mod 21 in the 80's at $10,000 and was told they could not sustain production and all production would be engraved high grades at close to 20k or above. Then even Winchester with their custom shop could not be cost effective and stopped production.

[Pete Lester]

I know its high, shockingly high. Its a number I heard a number of times. It was based upon Rem doing the work here, not out sourced to Japan or becoming a Repro Trojan.

Well Bruce if that is the case and it would cost that much to have comparable American craftsmanship produced today then think about what a value a good solid Trojan represents to the sportsman in 2010.

[Bruce Day]

No doubt about it. No doubt at all. Even better when you start looking around at the lower priced Turkish and other foreign guns. A guy who wants a knock about gun that will last and be a great handling and trouble free gun should always consider a Trojan, and that's how Parker sold them. The Remington cost accountants later said that Parker Bros put so much effort in each one that they lost money on every Trojan. It was a great value then and an even greater value today. You just have to be content with no engraving.

If I were a young man today and had limited money to spend on a gun, and wanted an upland gun that I could use for the next 40-50 years and not worry too much about while busting briars and rocks, I'd be looking for a 20ga or 16ga Trojan.


Here is a 16ga that a buddy and I placed with a young hunter a year ago. He's already had it from Minnesota to Montana pheasant hunting with the Benelli and Beretta crowd, and attracting attention and killing birds. It has a few flaws, we called the burn marks "character". Another friend did a high quality re-blue and de-dent job, I disassembled and cleaned it the action, and spent time cleaning out the checkering and did a finish topcoat. Couldn't do much about the stove burns. A couple evenings and not a bad looking gun.

[Joseph Moyles]

HI Bruce,

I own it but it was sold to me as a V Grade. Not knowing much about Parkers, I bought it.

[Bruce Day]

Its not a V grade, which usually has a higher value.

There are four books entirely about Parkers. There is a $35 Serialization Book with lots of pictures and charts. We have this website and forum with a FAQ section showing how people can tell apart the grades. There are chapters about Parkers in all the major gun books.

Members go to major gunshows and often exhibit under the PGCA banner. We have had numerous magazine articles and there have been several TV programs about Parkers.

If there is some way we can get more or better information out about Parkers and what to look for , let us know.

[Bill Murphy]

Tony could build a Trojan for $1500 retail and make money. He knows that no one would buy it. Further, it would take away from his other offerings.

[Bill Bolyard]

Somebody better let Mr. Galazan know how much money he is losing on those RBL guns he is selling!:corn:

[Joseph Moyles]

Bruce, thank you very much. You have been very helpful.

[Larry Frey]

Tony could build a Trojan for $1500 retail and make money. He knows that no one would buy it. Further, it would take away from his other offerings.


Bill I have no idea what Tony's overhead is in his new facility or the hourly wages he pays his skilled employee’s or what his materials(walnut blanks, barrel tubes, frame steel, etc.) cost but being a manufacturer in one of if not the highest taxed state in the country I would think $1,500.00 would be a little low.;)

[Bruce Day]

Particularly since his base grade RBL is $5000 and the base grade 21's and Foxes are each $15,000. There is some nice workmanship in a Trojan. I understand the RBL was designed so that it could be almost entirely machine made without hand fitting, not so the Trojan.

[David Holes]

I think he might get a little busy making trojans if he could indeed make them for 1500.00.I think a 20 would finish my set.

[Pete Lester]

Tony could build a Trojan for $1500 retail and make money. He knows that no one would buy it. Further, it would take away from his other offerings.

There might be demand if there was something unique, such as the gauges Parker didn't make 10, 28, 410 etc. I'd be in the market if there was a Trojan 10ga offering.