English doubles

[Garhart Stephenson]

Does anybody here have experience with guns crafted by the less known British makers? I have noticed that most boxlocks are built on the same Anson and Deeley action. The guns I have looked at seem very well built, fairly lightweight, and often have a straight grip stock. I am considering purchasing my first english gun.

[Rick Losey]

there were many parts makers in Birmingham that supplied the trade, so those parts may be seen in many maker's guns

and some of the name makers would supply actions to other builders

sometime patents can give you a clue

when it comes to the small makers - i would say its best to evaluate each gun on its own merits

[Jay Gardner]

I have an HJ Hussey "Imperial" that in terms of fit, finish and quality, compares to pretty much all well known English makers. Often times these other makers were hired to make guns for the same families who bought guns from Purdey, Holland, Boss, etc, for "lesser" members of their families and that's especially true for boxlocks.

If you are interested in a British gun, you really do need to do research. As much as the market for American doubles is depressed, the market for English guns is even more so and so deals can be found. The biggest challenge in finding a British gun in the US is finding one that hasn't been shot to death or otherwise abused.

[Mark Ray]

I have six or eight English guns, and all but one are hammer guns. I will say this, that compared to my American guns, the English guns are in general sturdier.

[Ken Hill]

Garhart,

The A&D guns are pretty tough guns. When buying a British gun make sure the gun is still in proof. Guns out of proof take a big hit on price. If you are looking at Brit guns, The British Boxlock by Diggory Hadoke is a good book to pick up. Prices for lesser known makers should be a lot lower than well known makers.

Ken

[Eric Eis]

I'm sure John Campbell will chime in soon.

[John Campbell]

Mr. Stephenson:
I invite you to take the plunge and try an English gun!

But please make sure it's in good shootable condition, so you won't be saddled with extra refurbishment expenses to take it afield. Many of the grand English guns have suffered a diet of stout American ammunition, and that puts a great strain on a gunstock that's 100 years old or so.

Barrel wall thickness is another issue. This should be checked by a competent double gunsmith. Be circumspect of any wall thickness under .025 inches, although a bit thinner toward the muzzle might be okay. A reputable seller will be your best bet for all this.

In fact, I've noticed that Mr. Peck has a nice "starter" sidelock for sale on our For Sale forum. It might be one to consider. But generally, a sound A&D box lock is going to be a first-timber's best bet. Good luck!

[Garhart Stephenson]

Ken, please elaborate on "out of proof". From what I understand, in England, a shotgun is out of proof if the internal measurements vary more than .010" from the original dimensions stamped on the barrel flats, correct?

One of the top candidates I am considering is an english 16 ga., originally nitro proofed for 1 1/8 oz./ 900 bar with factory 2 3/4" chambers.

[Ken Hill]

Yes the barrels are in proof as long as they are within 10 thousandths of the latest proof mark. I'm not sure on the 2 3/4" chamber mark. A 2 3/4" 12 would be marked as 1 1/4 oz vice 1 1/8 oz. 900 bar is correct for 2 3/4".

Ken

[Milton C Starr]

Mr. Stephenson:
I invite you to take the plunge and try an English gun!

But please make sure it's in good shootable condition, so you won't be saddled with extra refurbishment expenses to take it afield. Many of the grand English guns have suffered a diet of stout American ammunition, and that puts a great strain on a gunstock that's 100 years old or so.

Barrel wall thickness is another issue. This should be checked by a competent double gunsmith. Be circumspect of any wall thickness under .025 inches, although a bit thinner toward the muzzle might be okay. A reputable seller will be your best bet for all this.

In fact, I've noticed that Mr. Peck has a nice "starter" sidelock for sale on our For Sale forum. It might be one to consider. But generally, a sound A&D box lock is going to be a first-timber's best bet. Good luck!

Probably what happened to the Bonehill 10 ga I had , someone at one point lengthened the chambers to 3.5" .

[Garhart Stephenson]

Ken, it is a 16 ga., not a 12 ga.