Remington 1894 CEO

[Joe Graziano]

I was fortunate to win this at a recent auction. It’s my first Remington double. I don’t know much about Remingtons but from what I’ve been able to find, it seems to be a C grade but with checkered flats and engraving I haven’t seen yet in pics of other Remingtons. It has a straight grip and could be a CEO trap, but chokes are Cyl/Mod. Serial number is in P125K range. I would love to learn more about it. Can’t wait to get it and take it afield on pheasant!

[Brian Dudley]

No better to start off with. Graded 1894s are beautiful. Any graded guns that Remington built were proof positive that they could really put together a nicely finished gun.

[Rick Losey]

has an English look to the box

very nice

[Phil Yearout]

Great looking gun! Congrats!

[Dave Noreen]

That gun was discussed over on Doublegunshop.com

Most agreed that it started life with a pistol grip and was converted to straight. I also noted a couple of anomalies. Here is my post from there.

Couple of out of period things for that CEO-Grade Remington. That is far and away the lowest serial number I've seen with the "P" inventory code prefix to the serial number. Normally I haven't recorded that until into the 132xxx range --

https://i.imgur.com/uj8Xt7K.jpg

Also, haven't recorded a one-screw trigger guard that low. Normally the front screw which is also the rear tang screw, is present into the low 132xxx range when the new-style action was introduced changing the sear pin location. Also, don't normally see that style safety slide until much later, and with the concave (Remington called them hollow) rib.

That is some of the nicest engraving on the sides of a C-quality Remington I've seen. The bottom is quite standard.

78840

78841

[Joe Graziano]

Thanks, all! Dave, that is great information. I will check out the discussion on Doublegunshop. I really love unique guns like this. The auction started very low and the bids moved quickly. But, that gun just spoke to me and I had to take it home. Whenever I feel that way about a gun, it usually works out well. Once I have it in hand, I’ll post more info. Here’s a few more pics.

[Brian Dudley]

Not all guns are candidates for straight grip conversions.

[Dave Noreen]

Through the first 11 years of the Remington Hammerless Double there is quite a bit of variation in the C-quality engraving. For comparison, here are some pics of the nearest C-quality gun I have on file, 124712 --

78855

78856

78857

With the introduction of the new style action, most notably the relocated sear pin, they pretty much settled into the "banner" style engraving on the sides of C-quality guns.

78858

78859

[Dave Noreen]

One in the 135xxx range --

78861

and one in the 139xxx range --

78860

[John Dallas]

Did Remington ever make a SBT?

[charlie cleveland]

remington doubles are fine guns i have a b grade with ordance barrels and a a grade 10 ga with steel barrels... your gun is really nice....charlie

[Joe Graziano]

Great pics. I enjoy seeing the varying engraving patterns in the early guns. The change is notable as Remington standardized the grades. Beautiful guns.

[Dave Noreen]

Did Remington ever make a SBT?

Not until they made Parker SBTs.

The 1909 Remington Arms Co. catalog was the last to include break-action guns, and there was a 1909 catalog without the break-action guns. Remington had a clear view of their shotgun future, and it was with their John M. Browning designed Remington Autoloading Gun (later Model 11) and their John D. Pedersen designed Remington Repeating Shotgun (later Model 10). In February 1910, Remington Arms Co. struck a deal with Norvell-Shapleigh Hardware Co. for their entire inventory of break-action guns.

78865

[Dean Romig]

Wow - What an important document Dave!





.

[Brian Dudley]

Then there was a later time (the late 50s I believe) when a boss at Remington instructed that all invoices, sales orders and paperwork related to double gun manufacture (except production records) be destroyed. Oh the value of information that was in that...

As an aside, Remington did consider getting back into the Double business in the early 50s, but they acknowledged that they could not make a Parker (as they knew it mechanically) at a profit. So they did design an economy type boxlock that was to receive the Parker name. (Much like Ithaca did with Lefever). At least one prototype was built. Bit it never went anywhere, obviously.

[Dean Romig]

Then there was a later time (the late 50s I believe) when a boss at Remington instructed that all invoices, sales orders and paperwork related to double gun manufacture (except production records) be destroyed. Oh the value of information that was in that...


Then how do we explain the survival of the Parker Stock Books and Order Books? They contained reams of recorded sales orders and records of double gun production.





.

[John Dallas]

Remington introduced their 3200 in 1973 as a counter to the Citori which was becoming a big success. In order to compete with the Citori, which was being made in Japan with cheap labor, Remington developed a highly mechanized process which did not rely on a lot of labor. I shot one of my 3200's yesterday. Still one of my favorite guns.

[chris dawe]

Then there was a later time (the late 50s I believe) when a boss at Remington instructed that all invoices, sales orders and paperwork related to double gun manufacture (except production records) be destroyed. Oh the value of information that was in that...

As an aside, Remington did consider getting back into the Double business in the early 50s, but they acknowledged that they could not make a Parker (as they knew it mechanically) at a profit. So they did design an economy type boxlock that was to receive the Parker name. (Much like Ithaca did with Lefever). At least one prototype was built. Bit it never went anywhere, obviously.

Are there any existing photos of the prototype?

[Dean Romig]

Art Wheaton donated his to the NRA Museum in Fairfax and to the best of my knowledge it is still on display with the Peterson collection.

....if that is one of the prototypes....



.

[Jack Huber]

Researcher, that letter from Remington to Norvell-Shapleigh Hardware is a fascinating document. I hope you will post in on the Remington Collector's forum.

[Brian Dudley]

Are there any existing photos of the prototype?

The prototype that I refer to is in the Remington museum. It is unmarked. And has no description or label.
I was not aware of one that Art owned. I would be interested in seeing that.

[Dave Noreen]

Full disclosure. That Norvell-Shapleigh letter came from Roy Marcot's book Remington "America's Oldest Gunmaker" on page 125, credited to the Ken Waite, Jr. collection. A shame it didn't get in to Charles Semmer's book Remington Double Shotguns.

The first of the Crawford C. Loomis patents, Patent No. 1795223 granted March 3, 1931, that Remington attributes to the Model 32 actually shows a trigger-plate action side-by-side double. A couple or three decades ago, Dennis Sannita at the museum at the factory at Ilion hauled out such a gun for me to examine.

[Joe Graziano]

I’ll check out the prototype in the NRA museum and post a pic.

[Brian Dudley]

Based on a google search I just did it looks like the NRA museum prototype is from the late 80s attempt at bringing the Parker back.

[Dean Romig]

I think you're right Brian.





.