more Parkers or more birds ?

[Daniel G Rainey]

Just back from my weekly visit to Steve Barnett's gun shop. Lots of fine guns of all kinds. There are great English boxlocks out there that seem like that they are worth the money. Parkers seem to be a little cheaper to me, but do I need more shotguns ? I have five Parkers plus another that Steve is Trying to sale. With two 12's two 16's and a 20 do I need another gun NO What I need is more birds to shoot at.In Mississippi the quail have been gone since the late 70,s and our doves have been going down hill since the start of morning shooting . 40 years ago I belonged club called the dove club.
a couple of farmers fixed the fields and the members paid for the wheat. In Sept. there were 9 or 10 shoots and members purchased a least a case of shells. What fun we had. In the early 90's the club called it quits because of no birds. We can shoot released quail which is not cheap or travel. Pheasants in South Dakota is not like it was in the late 70's or 80's when we knew the farmers and hunted wild birds. The last time I hunted South Dakota It was kind like being in a whore house you knew you going to get what you came for and there was another SOB waiting for you to finish so he could start and they made sure there were three birds there for him. June I when to Argentina for the first time did not try to take any of my guns because of the red tape. I think the outfitters do not want you to bring your own guns so they can rent you an autoloader that will shoot 4 or 5 times rather you showing up with an o/u or side by side that only shoots twice. After all they are selling shells. But, the shooting was great, I missed my guns. We spend time and money finding the Parkers that fits. works money wise and is eye candy and designed to kill birds and then when you get chance to really use it you can't. Just blowing off steam. I am well aware that need has very little to do with gun purchases and before long another will come along that I can not live without. It could be some English side by side or maybe a German o/u if it has double triggers then the old problem raises it head what am going to shoot at.

[CraigThompson]

I’ve got several shotguns that have become “tree guns” . What’s a tree gun you might ask ? That’s a shotgun I use to trim tree limbs I can’t reach with a ladder and chain saw :rotf: And to date my “tree guns” have been a Parker 12 and three Parker 10’s :cool: I mention this only because my bird shooting is pretty non existent anymore .

[Michael Moffa]

Mr Rainey, you live within spitting distance of Steve Barnetts place and you only have 5 Parkers? Slacker!!! No, really I feel your pain. I too have been to Argentina and shot 6675 shells in 4 days. Could have bought a nice DH for the shell bill. Would I go again? Don't know as I went with Jerry and Glenda Kitto. If Jerry was still with us it would be a pleasant experience. I've only shot Continental pheasants here in SE Alabama. Have not shot a wild bird, yet. Maybe some day.

[Kenny Graft]

Its a sad state of affairs in general....loss of the wild birds that is. I belong to RG/woodcock, PF and support them. They are doing great things for habitat and working with land owners and government, the farm bill that just past is proof. THANK YOU ALL THAT DO THE REAL WORK. I grew up hunting wild roosters and cottontails, the bob white were gone by 1970 here in north east Ohio and the roosters slowly followed. Now even rabbits are hard to find at times! I am a bird hunter, I get my fix on the wild ones but have to travel long days and spend hard saved money from season to season. Even that plan gets messed up by weather like the drought in Kansas that lasted for 3 to 4 years, now west nile is taking the grouse. But I still go in search of wild birds. I'm happy with less, long as we see some birds, get a few shots and if lucky collect a trophy rooster, quail or grouse. They are trophy's….In 2012 we hunted good land in Kansas for 6 full days, three guys and three good dogs to get 6 wild roosters and 3 quail. I got two roosters and a quail and yes they were trophies to me! A 12 point would not make me as happy! Roosters may be down in Kansas this year. I called out there last week and the farmer tells me the hens are on their 4th nesting due to all the rain and the chicks are the size of quail. Its a late hatch and the haying has started...)-: I will go and I will be happy if I get one of them trophy roosters and a couple little gray bullets. If there are any grouse left in the U.P. one of them too! Life is GOOD! SXS Ohio

[Craig Larter]

Life is difficult for the upland bird hunter in western NY. Pheasant numbers crashed after about 1972, grouse numbers are on a multi-decade decline. Habitat has been a big factor. The reforestation of NY is ongoing and modern ag practices make life for pheasants impossible. Turkey numbers are mostly stable to increasing. Dove hunting is forbidden as the morning dove is not considered a gamebird in NY. A multi year effort to establish a dove season is slowly gaining support but the anti forces in NY are fighting it.
Duck hunting has been on a decade long decline with mallard numbers in our flyway falling by half. Finally the feds have recognized the decline and reduced the bag limit by half for mallards.
So I hunt ducks locally and I am OK with the lowered limits (most days we don't shoot a limit of mallards anyway) and travel. The traveling bird hunter is the future for me. It is what it is and hunting birds and collecting vintage shotguns is important to me so I won't get discouraged or give it up. Craig

[Dean Romig]

I’m optimistic about grouse numbers in Vermont this year. Except for turkeys and deer in Ohio, I don’t travel anywhere but Vermont. I have rarely been disappointed in VT and that’s why I never had the urge to travel to hunt.





.

[Ted Hicks]

Grouse hunting in New York's Adirondack Mountains used to be good, back in the '70s and '80s. There was a lot of area available to hunt with relatively little hunting pressure. Through the '90s until now grouse have been scarce. It's hard to tell why since I've hunted private land that is forested regularly. Lots of what looks like prime cover, but few birds. It's been puzzling. I will still hunt for them and have been expanding my hunting areas to see if the situation is the same all over.

Woodcock seem to be in the same situation, but at least you can usually find a flight or two if you can be at the right place at the right time.

We used to be able to find wild pheasants and the state continues to stock them, but the numbers they put out have been drastically reduced. I enjoy a hunt or two on private reserves over released birds.

If I had to choose, I would select more birds over another gun, but I don't feel pressed to choose so I still am looking for the next good cover and the next good gun.

[James L. Martin]

I live in lower New York, last grouse I have seen local was 2007, the cover is pretty much the same, what's different is the increase in hawks, owls, turkeys, and coyotes. There is also westnile virus I guess. Going to Maine and northern New York this year, hope to find some birds. As to Woodcock last year was the worst I have ever seen hope this year is better.

[Ted Hicks]

Good luck up north James. I won't be able to get up to Maine this fall due to work travel but I am looking into locations for October 2020.

[Daniel Carter]

I have followed this thread and others like it over the last few years and it mirrors my experiences. I hunt in Maine and have for 30 years, seeing the ''cycle'' for the first decade then no rebound in the last 15 years just a slow downward trend. Yes I am older but my sons and grandchildren have the legs to find them. We have also seen the woodcock go from a certain 5 a day to 3 now to maybe none. I have seen no change in logging and hunting pressure is less, the road hunters have dwindled to a very few.Going off the beaten path is very little help but we will be again this year and keep looking in different covers. The area is in western Maine in an unorganized township.

[Daniel G Rainey]

Went to the gun club and shot a couple rounds of skeet. Got to get some use out of my bird guns. Enjoyed it .

[Milton C Starr]

Just back from my weekly visit to Steve Barnett's gun shop. Lots of fine guns of all kinds. There are great English boxlocks out there that seem like that they are worth the money. Parkers seem to be a little cheaper to me, but do I need more shotguns ? I have five Parkers plus another that Steve is Trying to sale. With two 12's two 16's and a 20 do I need another gun NO What I need is more birds to shoot at.In Mississippi the quail have been gone since the late 70,s and our doves have been going down hill since the start of morning shooting . 40 years ago I belonged club called the dove club.
a couple of farmers fixed the fields and the members paid for the wheat. In Sept. there were 9 or 10 shoots and members purchased a least a case of shells. What fun we had. In the early 90's the club called it quits because of no birds. We can shoot released quail which is not cheap or travel. Pheasants in South Dakota is not like it was in the late 70's or 80's when we knew the farmers and hunted wild birds. The last time I hunted South Dakota It was kind like being in a whore house you knew you going to get what you came for and there was another SOB waiting for you to finish so he could start and they made sure there were three birds there for him. June I when to Argentina for the first time did not try to take any of my guns because of the red tape. I think the outfitters do not want you to bring your own guns so they can rent you an autoloader that will shoot 4 or 5 times rather you showing up with an o/u or side by side that only shoots twice. After all they are selling shells. But, the shooting was great, I missed my guns. We spend time and money finding the Parkers that fits. works money wise and is eye candy and designed to kill birds and then when you get chance to really use it you can't. Just blowing off steam. I am well aware that need has very little to do with gun purchases and before long another will come along that I can not live without. It could be some English side by side or maybe a German o/u if it has double triggers then the old problem raises it head what am going to shoot at.

Down here in Georgia is extremely hard for our quail to survive in the wild between the farming and predators . I read a article last month claiming that hawks dont kill as many quail as hunters claim. Which I think is false because I raised quail and worked on a plantation and red tails was one of our top problems with keeping birds alive . You could probably release 200 birds the day before the hunt and seed your hunting land with them . At least here last I seen they was only about 3$ a piece so even if you spent a couple hundred $ it would be cheaper be a wide margin than coming to a plantation . However the kind of clients we did quail hunts for wasnt really about hunting but more of a social club to talk business deals since most of our guests were ceos or board members of large companies .


We do have some very nice quail hunting in this part of the state with two very large and quite nice plantations . We also have the Olin Plantation about 45 minutes from here and thats probably one of the nicest ones I have seen .

[Milton C Starr]

Mr Rainey, you live within spitting distance of Steve Barnetts place and you only have 5 Parkers? Slacker!!! No, really I feel your pain. I too have been to Argentina and shot 6675 shells in 4 days. Could have bought a nice DH for the shell bill. Would I go again? Don't know as I went with Jerry and Glenda Kitto. If Jerry was still with us it would be a pleasant experience. I've only shot Continental pheasants here in SE Alabama. Have not shot a wild bird, yet. Maybe some day.

You close to Houston County ? Thats around my tri state area where Georgia,Florida, and Alabama meet .

[Michael Moffa]

I think that the loss of wild birds can be traced to DDT removal from the environment. Birds of Prey numbers have soared because egg shells are not cracking in the nest for eagles and hawks and osprey and falcons. Enviro wackos would lose their collective minds but a limited season on just red tailed hawks might be whats needed. How many of you have seen Red Tails sitting on fence posts next to the highway watching traffic go by in the last decade or so. That never happened when I was a kid.

[Milton C Starr]

I think that the loss of wild birds can be traced to DDT removal from the environment. Birds of Prey numbers have soared because egg shells are not cracking in the nest for eagles and hawks and osprey and falcons. Enviro wackos would lose their collective minds but a limited season on just red tailed hawks might be whats needed. How many of you have seen Red Tails sitting on fence posts next to the highway watching traffic go by in the last decade or so. That never happened when I was a kid.

Here they are basically just coyote with wings . I want to say the % of increase for red tail hawks since 1960 matches the % of decrease in the quail population .
But according to the anti hunters theres no correlation .

[Michael Moffa]

Mr Starr:

I'm in Auburn.

[hugh rather]

Years ago, I did the quail brush pile ,callback bird in a cage,artificial quail covey thing once here in Ms.I grew up in the 60's and 70's hunting quail both with and without a dog and longed to relive this.24 quail were put into this project.I was going to wait 2 weels to get them established in their new home.I began to notice a drop in the quail seen and then I saw the feather piles around the area.Then I saw the hawks.After 2 weeks the only bird was the callback in the cage.That was my last attempt at starting an artificial covey.The last small wild covey has recently disappeared from the area we deer hunt.I havent shot a wild quail in 20 years nor would I if I saw one here.We still have some game preserves with planted quail.And the memories of how it can be.Hugh

[Garry L Gordon]

Here in Missouri we once took 3 million quail a year. Now it's about 300K in a good year, but it should be noted that hunter numbers have taken a proportionate dive. Our Conservation Department has been working hard to both study quail and their needs and to supply those needs on as much land, both private and public, as possible.

When I was teaching a class on hunting and conservation, I required a "service learning" component for all of the students. One of our projects was to work with the Conservation Dept. to survey quail numbers both inside and outside of the Dept.'s designated quail focus areas. These focus areas were on private land where landowners worked with the Dept. to establish quail friendly farming practices. The results were very positive, and we saw (actually "heard" birds, since we were doing dawn covey call counts) significantly larger numbers of birds within the focus area, even during years of poor Spring breeding conditions (cold and rain).

The Dept. also just finished a three year study using, among other scientific means, radio telemetry to study population dynamics in differing cover types. A preliminary conclusion was that quail did better on grassland cover than the typical food plot/agricultural habitat. Part of what they learned was that there was diminished loss of birds to predators in the grassland covers since the travel patterns of predators did not correspond with nesting sites. It was an intriguing study.

If we could replace fescue with native warm season grasses in our cattle pastures, and stop bullldozing fence line cover, we could have decent quail hunting again. Limiting the use of neonicatoids on crops would also go a long way. Other grassland species would be aided by these practices. Even non-hunters like to help birds, a win-win situation if we can get the story out.

I'm guardedly positive about my upland bird hunting, but it sure would be nice if more folks cared. Many days I feel glad I'm not any younger when I think what the future might hold. However, I'm still planting trees even though I'll never sit in their shade, and I still try to help the next generation understand and appreciate our hunting heritage.

[Reggie Bishop]

My feelings regarding the loss of quail here in SE Tennessee have been expressed several times on this forum. I was recently at my dad's home on the golf course which borders the farm I hunted birds on for years. I asked if he had heard any birds calling this summer and he said no. His hearing is all but gone so I am hoping he just isn't hearing them, but I think that is wishful thinking on my part.