parker vh 16 gauge question

[Ed Norman]

I have a friend that just purchased a parker 16 gauge and he thinks it has a 00 frame. Is that possible, or would the 00 frame guns be like a 20 or 28 gauge? He said it has 26" barrels and improved and modified chokes. Sorry if this is a dumb question, I just don't know a lot about old shotguns. I am trying to get a serial number from him. I will post that if I can get the serial number.

[Jay Gardner]

Welcome. 0-frame, possibly. 00-frame, no. Serial number won’t identify the size of the frame but a picture of the lug will.

JDG

[Ed Norman]

Welcome. 0-frame, possibly. 00-frame, no. Serial number won’t identify the size of the frame but a picture of the lug will.

JDG

Jay, Thanks for the response, I thought sure he said it was a 00 frame, I am waiting to hear from him, now I am wondering if he said 0 frame. Its fun getting old:) If it was a 0 frame, is that gun rare in the 16 gauge? I tried to look in here, but cannot figure this out. Thanks again, Ed

[Jay Gardner]

Ed;

Standard frame size for a 16 is 1, standard for 20 is O. There were 16’s built on O-framed but I have no idea the percentage but I would not call them rare. That being said, generally speaking 0-frame 16’s are sought after because the guns are usually a few ounces lighter than 16 ga 1-frames. At the end of the day the size of the frame is just one consideration in terms of “value” or collectibility. There is a lot to learn about Parker’s. I’ve been a member of the PGCA for a very long time but I learn things just about every time I log onto the forum.

Jay

[Randy G Roberts]

If it was a 0 frame, is that gun rare in the 16 gauge? I tried to look in here, but cannot figure this out. Thanks again, Ed

Hi Ed. I would not say that in general terms the O frame is rare in the 16. It is seen on a regular basis. The exception that comes to mind would be the 32"
guns. "Rare might be applicable there, if not rare at the very least "uncommon" for sure.

[Bob Kimble]

Maybe an 0 frame stamped twice?

[Ed Norman]

Hi Ed. I would not say that in general terms the O frame is rare in the 16. It is seen on a regular basis. The exception that comes to mind would be the 32"
guns. "Rare might be applicable there, if not rare at the very least "uncommon" for sure.

Randy,
So, a 16 gauge with 26" barrels in 0 frame would be a normal grouse type gun? The reason I am even looking at it is because of the overall weight and the way it swings etc. I stopped and looked at the gun a couple of days ago, thats why I was sure he said 00 frame, now I am not so sure. The gun was used for hunting, I don't know terminology, the guy called it a "grey gun" there was no finish left on reciever, the wood was in what I would call average shape maybe a little better for being hunted with. The barrels still had some bluing left. I saw somewhere in this forum where people would take a "v" grade gun and do a lot of scrollwork etc. to make the gun exactly the way they wanted it. So that thought crossed my mind some day in the future that might be something I want to do with a gun. I recently purchased a fox "A" grade that had been restored. The parker swings easier, more like my 20 gauge over/under that I use for grouse/woodcock. I am taking the fox out this weekend to hunt pheasants with. I almost never hunt more than a half a day at a time, so I am hoping the added weight of the fox won't be that much of an issue compared to my over under 20 gauge. I am hoping in time to be able to sell my over under, and just hunt with old side by sides. Thanks for everyones input in here and all my other questions I have posted. This is addicting:)

[Randy G Roberts]

In response to your question Ed, yes I would think that the 16 gauge on an O frame with 26 inch barrels could be the perfect Grouse gun. There are other combinations just as suitable but there are a lot of folks that would argue that is a dandy combo.. If that gun is on a double O frame I would have to agree with Bob that it was probably stamped twice. According to TPS there are no 16 gauge guns on the O frame.

[Ed Norman]

Thanks Randy,
I was also trying to make sure that the gun barrels had not been cut down. I doubt I would be able to know by looking. It seems I read in here that combination with 26" barrels was pretty standard, so I was hoping they had not been cut. There is so much in this forum to absorb, it gets kind of mixed up in my head some. One of the other members in here may meet me this weekend and look at that gun with me so I am hoping he can share his expertise with me. Thanks again

[Dave Tercek]

I had a 16ga for a while that had the typical 0 mark with a small o inspectors mark beside it. I saw it listed as a 00 frame on a for sale listing a few years later.
terc

[Kenny Graft]

WARNING.....You are on a slippery slope, do not fall for them sweet little SXS guns or you will be sorry and broke or at least broke!!! I know all too well. SXS Ohio.....(-:

[Brian Dudley]

I cannot imagine any scenario where Parker would have used a 00 frame for a 16g. Even in the event of a multi barrel set that involved 28g. The difference in gauge and normal bolster sizes would just be too great.

Although the 1 frame was considered the standard for 16g, i have personally seen way more 0 frame 16s than 1 frames. A lot more of them were made than some think. So... when you see them advertised as “rare”, know that they really arent.

[Ed Norman]

Terc,
Thanks, you might of figured it out for me. I will look into that too. sxs ohio, I think I already done slipped:) I can't seem to get these guns out of my mind. My wife telling me she thinks I deserve a couple of those "nice old guns" has not helped one little bit:) I am still waiting for a serial number.

[Eric Eis]

Ed, a very simple way to know for sure if it's a OO frame (if it's stamped that way) is to look for the lightening cuts on the watertable of the receiver. If it has the lightening cuts or scalloped frame it's an OO and as Brian has said I don't see how that would be possible.

[Ed Norman]

Eric,
Thank you for your information, I have no idea what a lightening cut looks like:) I will learn though. Bob K. and Terc I think are on the right track. I will look at the gun this saturday and take what I have learned in here and try to make a decision. Thanks again for all your help.

[Dean Romig]

Ed, these long tapered grooves on the action flats (water tables) are lightening cuts.


.

[Eric Eis]

Thanks Dean didn't have a pic to post. Ed, Dean's photo was what I was referring too

[Ed Norman]

Thank you both for all your help. I talked to him earlier today and he said the gun had been opened up to improved cylinder in both barrels. I asked him to take his gun to a gunsmith and have him look at barrels for me. Thanks again for helping me out.

[Dean Romig]

"Opened up" or perhaps cut back a couple of inches??





.

[Ed Norman]

The gun wasn't cut back, I just found out it was opened up and is skeet 1 and skeet 2 in the barrels. A lot of my grouse shots are pretty far out especially after leaves are down. I just decided to pass on that gun. I found another with improved cylinder and improved modified that I am looking at and its in even better condition. Thanks again for everyone's help.