Join the Club...The Duck Club That Is

[Bobby Cash]

California Fact

Acre for acre, the Central Valley of California supports more wintering waterfowl than anywhere else in North America. At peak times, this region hosts 5 to 7 million wintering waterfowl—more than 60 percent of the Pacific Flyway’s ducks and geese. As you would expect, the high ratio of birds to habitat results in some superb waterfowl hunting. This is especially true on private duck clubs in places such as Butte Sink, Suisun Marsh, and the Grasslands. Good public hunting is also available on several intensively managed national wildlife refuges and state wildlife areas in the region, which also support large numbers of wintering waterfowl.

Abundant species: pintails, mallards, wigeon, green-winged teal, Aleutian cackling geese,
white-fronted geese, light geese

Club Fact.

The Tulare Duck Club (a 12 Gun order of DHE 20’s with 32” barrels, 156100 serial number range) and the Wigeon Gun Club (a 10 Gun order of long barreled subgauge Parker’s)
share almost identical longitude and latitude.

Widgeon gun club
Latitude 36.78
Longitude -119.44

Tulare Duck Club
Latitude 36.42
Longitude -119.48

The Tulare guns (1911) predate the Wigeon guns by over 1 year.

Perhaps it’s true what they say,
“If it looks like a duck, and walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck...

Once again HUGE thank you to Chuck Bishop :bowdown:

#154247 predates the Tulare guns by 6 months.
Advertised as 16 gauge, 32”, straight stock, 2 7/8” chambers.

https://i.imgur.com/j5s3mdr.jpg?1

https://i.imgur.com/NzVB3s4.jpg?1

https://i.imgur.com/upF4nSf.jpg?1

https://i.imgur.com/NO3E2OH.jpg?5

https://i.imgur.com/KlDUt2G.png?2

[Craig Larter]

SWEET!!!

[Chris Travinski]

Sweet is right!! That gun looks like it has a good stout wrist too, you won't have to sweat so much about shooting heavy loads through it.

[Kevin McCormack]

Bobby, over time (a LONG time) there have been a number of fairly lengthy, detailed, documented and very enlightening threads regarding Central Valley CA duck clubs and the 'specialty' smallbore guns ordered for them, particularly the 32" guns. If you search thru these threads you will find a treasure trove of references and historical documentation, mostly from knowledgeable members and, of course, PGCA letters .

[Dave Noreen]

This all sounds like a great Parker Pages article for Dean. Get writing!!

That 3 dram, 1 ounce load was hot!! Our North American ammunition companies weren't offering any 16-gauge loads heavier then 2 3/4 drams of bulk smokeless powder or 22 grains of dense smokeless powder such as Infallible or Ballistite pushing 1 ounce of shot in 1910.

[James Palmer]

I have been fortunate to hunt "the oldest duck club in California" over the last few years. The Suisun marsh north of SF had numerous duck clubs at one point. Unfortunately most were not cared for and shot out. Luckily...a good group of hunters and conservationists has brought this one back to life.

The Teal Club

www.tealclub.com

If anyone has any gun which may be tied to this club please let me know.

[Rick Losey]

cool- thanks for the link James

have there been any good books about the California clubs? i have found a few good books either about or with chapters about clubs in the midwest or east. The history is usually interesting

[Jeff Kuss]

They Came to Shoot by Frank Hall. Unfortunately it is out of print.

[Rick Losey]

They Came to Shoot by Frank Hall. Unfortunately it is out of print.

Thanks Jeff

I'll search around for a copy

[Bobby Cash]

Another couple of ICBF's (Interesting Chuck Bishop Factoids)

https://i.imgur.com/2v9Ac1v.png?1

In the same order was an identical 20 gauge VHE.
All the same specifications and configuration.

[Mills Morrison]

That is awesome! I hope you are able to come to the annual meeting and bring that gun. Our theme is waterfowl guns and that would be a great addition to the display

[Bobby Cash]

Yesterday, the gun was inspected by one of the best gunsmiths in the country.
Les Pitman headed up Pachmeyer Custom in the day as well as is the Perazzi warranty gunsmith here in the United States
since Luccio's exit.

I got the call at about 3pm,
"We're sending it back to the seller".
You can hear my heart sink.
"I've never seen a 20 gauge with the barrels honed out to such an extent
that the bore diameter now measures .664 both barrels".

Ha Ha, funny boy.

Chokes in both barrels at .029
Minimum barrel wall thickness of .032
Perfect bores with 2 7/8" chambers
Ejector issue will only require a good cleaning.
Extremely low mileage.

To quote Les, "This gun is a Screamer".

https://i.imgur.com/G0nA4s1.jpg?1

[Bobby Cash]

.
.
https://i.imgur.com/TfYmoGk.jpg?1

[Carl G. Bachhuber]

Fascinating stuff. When I was a kid I spent some time roaming around that country. We had a couple of places to hunt doves in that area and for a few years my dad belonged to a duck club just a bit south of there. Frankly, I am surprised that hunting is even allowed in California today.
C.G.B.

[Robert Brooks]

I have a California 20 gauge 32 inch LC Smith field grade ejector but know nothing about it's history. Bobby

[Mills Morrison]

I have a California 20 gauge 32 inch LC Smith field grade ejector but know nothing about it's history. Bobby

The L.C. Smith Collectors Association does research letters and I would give them a try.

[Destry L. Hoffard]

There was a fella I corresponded with from Concord, CA several years ago about the ammunition these guns fired. His name was Tom Weynand, he had a lot of information about the small ammo companies that made the early 3 inch 16 and 20 gauge shells available. If you'll message me privately I'll give you the last address I had for him. No idea if he's still there as that was probably 10 years ago. One of the Smith boys had a 3 inch 16 gauge, I put he and Tom together so he could get a couple original shells for it.

[Dick Miller]

Destry,
I'm the one you hooked up with Tom, and I still have those shells. However, the shells are factory and not custom shells. One is a Peters and the other an Ajax--- both unfired.

[Bill Murphy]

My old 3" VH 20, #153,333, was tested at PB for 3 drams, 1 ounce loads. Yes, it's hot in a 16, but real hot in a 20. I no longer have the gun, but I have the order.

[Destry L. Hoffard]

There were a couple companies out in California that were loading for them special. Seems like one was called Selby? If Tom is still kicking he's a wonder for information on this kinda thing. I've got some shells too, I'll have to try and find them to see what I've got.

[Destry L. Hoffard]

P.S. to Dick: Check your overshot cards, a lot of the shells I'm talking about are loaded in regular company hulls, only the overshot cards say the name of the ammo companies I'm thinking of.

[Bobby Cash]

Overshoot these

https://i.imgur.com/Ossh1Ks.jpg?1

https://i.imgur.com/lQ0Vh0e.jpg?2

https://i.imgur.com/JCe4RJa.jpg?1

https://i.imgur.com/PaOxRjp.jpg?1

[MARK KIRCHER]

Selby - San Francisco
3" #5 - 7/8 oz.
I may attempt a duck with these someday.......:whistle:

[Frank Srebro]

Pic showing difference in length between a 16 gauge 2-9/16" Winchester Ranger and a 3-inch Winchester Leader, both roll crimped.

The overshot card on the Leader shows: 2-3/4 drams DuPont - 1 - 6 W.R.A. CO. I assume the powder is DuPont's "bulk smokeless".

I'll have this shell with me at the Northeast SxS (Hausmann's) next month. It's the only one I have. See me there if you're interested in getting it.

[Dick Miller]

P.S. to Dick: Check your overshot cards, a lot of the shells I'm talking about are loaded in regular company hulls, only the overshot cards say the name of the ammo companies I'm thinking of.

Destry,
My curiosity got the best of me. The Ajax ( black shell) has an overshot card marked Selby, and the Peters (faded red shell) is marked Peters Smokeless on the card.

[Dave Noreen]

Most cities had their local loaders that did provided ammunition put up in NPEs from the big companies, Winchester, Union Metallic Cartridge Co., Western Cartridge Co., and U.S. Cartridge Co. In California in addition to Selby they also had California Powder Works, In Oregon the big one was Honeyman Hardware in Portland. I don't recall the Seattle names as I'm on the road, but in Spokane it was Ware Bros. Here is a 1901 REPEATER No. 10 loaded by them --

62597

From 1901 until just after WW-I, Winchester headstamped their NPEs 1901 and the cases they loaded themselves WINCHESTER or WRA.

Similarly, UMC used different names on their NPEs than on their factory loaded shells --

62598

62599

62600

[charlie cleveland]

love looking at these old shells and reading the pro mo.pages...i have several old shells that i like to look at from time to time.....it id doutfull that any collection in the world has all theshells in it...rarest one in the shotshells is the 15 gauge i have never seen one of these not even on ads...next is the 18 ga i have seen a few of these for sell....charlie