Red root oil vs. Pilkington English red

[keavin nelson]

I think someone asked about the difference, and although this is not a finished example, it indicate that the resulting color imparted is very close. This is a Parker doaner stock with one coat rubbed on each side as marked, topped with one coat of tung oil.

[Dean Romig]

That looks about right. Thanks.





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[John Campbell]

As pointed out in another thread, the depth and "value" of a stain's colour also depends on the character of the wood involved. Some wood needs more stain. Some less. Some a bit of "special blend."

[keavin nelson]

Staining wood is more art than science, with all the variables involved. The post was intended to just show relative color on the same wood, certainly not taken to a finished condition.

[Tom Flanigan]

Staining wood is more art than science, with all the variables involved. The post was intended to just show relative color on the same wood, certainly not taken to a finished condition.

I mix my own stain from powders. I can get exactly the color I am looking for mixing my own. Some have had success with mixing stain with the finishing oil but I don't do that. I believe stain in the finish muddles and inhibits bringing out the full impact of the grain. I stain to get the color I want and then do the iterations of applying the finish. I have found that this works best for me.

[Tom Flanigan]

Many years ago I used alkanet root to bring light walnut stock wood to brown / light red. On my custom muzzle loaders I still use it on hard to darken curly maple. It worked well for walnut also but I went to mixing powders to get exactly the right color for each different stock. It’s easier and you can control the amount of red better or leave it out altogether.

For those wanting to try it, alkanet stain is prepared by compacting the roots in a two pound coffee can to a half full level. Place in a quart of boiled linseed oil (linseed oil is not really boiled, japan drier in small quantities are added). Place it on a stove and bring it to a boil. Be careful to have pliers ready to remove the can at the moment of boiling. If it boils over onto the stove it will create a lot of smoke and a hell of a mess.

The colored oil is put away to cool with the root in it. I store it in a wide mouth canning jar.

[Carl Baird]

I'm late to the game, but where do you get the root to begin with?

[Tom Flanigan]

You can get it on line I believe. I bought a bunch back in the day which came from England and I haven't used it all yet. Purdey once sold the alkanet stock coloring oil that they used on their guns. I prefer to make my own alkanet oil, but Purdey may still sell it.

I also tried the Purdey oil and slackum process of finishing stocks using their oil and slackum. I gave that up on American guns because I didn't see any real advantage to it and it takes more time to get it right. Although it does look great on Purdey guns.

I used the oil and slackum method to refresh a bespoke Harrison and Hussey top grade gun. But I used it only because that is the way the stock was originally finished back in the early twenties in London.

[Carl Baird]

Ever heard of "Trade Secret" from England?

[Tom Flanigan]

Never heard of it. What is it?

[Dean Romig]

.... it's a trade secret Tom.






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[Tom Flanigan]

Geez Dean, I've known you for a long time and you never held secrets before. If I show you how to use a checkering tool, will you tell me what Trade Secreit is? My curiosity is high. I need to know.

[Dean Romig]

I have no idea Tom ... I was messing with you.:corn:





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[Tom Flanigan]

Darn!!

[Carl Baird]

I use liquid Gun Sav'r to do my stocks and it's a tedious process but works well for me. A friend of mine recently told me of "Trade Secret", which is very hard to come by but readily available in England. It's been around a very long time and contains Alkanet root. My friend swears by it and will be finishing a stock for me, using it.
You can get the product from a gentleman in Pa. That is the only way you can get it in the states.

[Carl Baird]

Google it, and you can read up on it.

[Tom Flanigan]

Ah ha! Thanks for clearing this up Carl. Sounds interesting. I'll bet someone from Purdey or the like came up with it.

[Carl Baird]

You're right Tom, I think it's an old standard. There are actually 3 main products offered in the complete package, one is a colorant which is the Alkanet root, another is called "Rapid Oil", which I believe is a form of linseed oil with a dryer in it, and the last product is a wood sealer. Anyway, my friend, the stock maker, knows how to use the combination to produce what he calls... the best finish ever. I'm anxious to get the stock back and see for myself.

[Tom Flanigan]

Sounds a bit like the slackum and oil process used by Purdey and other London makers. Please send a picture of the stock when it is finished. I'd like to see it. I've used slackum and oil on my best Harrison and Hussey gun because that is what it was finished with originally. The finish the London gunmakers used on their wood provided superb and classic results. I image that Trade Secret produces a similar finish.

[Carl Baird]

Will do, I should have it back by months end