Guns with vent ribs

[John Havard]

If this has been previously covered or is in TPS (which I have checked unsuccessfully for the desired information) then I apologize ahead of time.

How many Parkers total were built from the factory with vent ribs? Does that slice of information exist anywhere? I know (or at least I think I know) how many "trap" Parkers are reported to have been made.

In full recognition of the fact that we're missing a significant number of records in the serialization book does anyone have a number or an estimate?

Thanks, John

[Dean Romig]

Nice new avatar photo John!!





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[John Havard]

Thanks Dean. I'm usually just the "guide" (taking friends with me each year and putting them in front of the bulls) but once in a while I get to arrow one. The best thing about the new hunting spot I've found is that it's lousy with grouse. Grouse Alfredo doesn't suck.

[Bill Murphy]

Take your trap total and add a few 12 gauge field guns, skeet guns, and a few smallbores. Otherwise, dunno.

[Patrick Lien]

Take your trap total and add a few 12 gauge field guns, skeet guns, and a few smallbores. Otherwise, dunno.

Then add in a bunch of late remington guns in the 242 range. They were putting vent ribs on lots of guns at the end.

PML

[John Havard]

So where would a rough estimate of the above get us to? Perhaps 1000?

[Rich Anderson]

IIRC the grades charts with have a footnote as to the percentage of guns that had vent ribs. They're not that scarce, I've sold several and currently have three, one a two barrel set.

[John Havard]

Based on Rich's note above (thanks Rich!) I finally dug through "The Grades" paying attention to the fine print. Here's what I came up with:

V grade - 201 with vent ribs
G grade - ??? Assume same as V, so 201
D grade - 3% of 9346 = 280
C grade - X% of 697 + 447 = (assuming 3%) maybe 34
B grade - 20
A grade - at least one (pictured in TPS)
AA grade - 1
A1 Special - 2

If my math is correct I come up with 740 guns with vent ribs. There are almost certainly more than this but it looks like (based on all that we can know currently) around 1000 or fewer Parkers were built with vent ribs.

What gives me pause is a case in point. I own a 1927 DHE (link to photo album below) that is not in the Serialization book and for which records (at least on our search feature) do not exist. It seems reasonable as the TPS authors did to project the same percentage of hammerless barrel guns without records to have vent ribs too. Hence, applying the 3% to all D-grade guns and guessing that G-grades have the same number of vent rib guns as V-grades all seems reasonable. But the truth is we'll never know.

I'm not a trap shooter but I'd like to believe the original purchaser of my DHE with vent rib back in 1927 was one. The butt stock dimensions are not as upright as purpose-built "Trap" guns ( 1 3/8" and 2 3/8") and it does not have a beavertail fore end. With 13 3/8" of wood to the pad I'd like to assume the gun was ordered to have a pad and was built that way. Only more recently (about 25 years ago?) the last owner had a new pad and spacer put on and had the pad faced with leather - a nice touch. I'm going to visit the nearest trap club tomorrow and put a box or two of shells through it just because. Anyway, here's the link: http://parkerguns.org/forums/album.php?albumid=805

[Robert Brooks]

I once owned a 16 ga #1 frame straight grip VHE vent rib 2 bbl set but gone down the road.Bobby

[David Holes]

This one was not listed either but did letter.

[Rich Anderson]

John look under the rib sometimes the serial number is there.

[Dean Romig]

On original Parker ventilated ribs the last three digits of the serial number are 'always' there.

Generally between the 2nd and 3rd 'bosses' from the breech.





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[John Havard]

I don't have a dental mirror but wearing my superman specs I can see three numbers engraved on the underside of the rib between the 1st and 2nd post

[Wayne Owens]

I own a documented vent rib gun with no numbers stamped under the rib.

[Dean Romig]

Well, we have learned that when it comes to Parkers to "never say never" but as well, never say always either.





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[Randy G Roberts]

If this has been previously covered or is in TPS (which I have checked unsuccessfully for the desired information) then I apologize ahead of time.

How many Parkers total were built from the factory with vent ribs? Does that slice of information exist anywhere? I know (or at least I think I know) how many "trap" Parkers are reported to have been made.

In full recognition of the fact that we're missing a significant number of records in the serialization book does anyone have a number or an estimate?

Thanks, John

John you stated that you know or think you know how many trap Parkers were made. It appears you are referring to double trap guns, right? If so I am curious, how many ?? Thanks !

[John Havard]

Randy, I'm pretty sure I read in TPS that just over 200 (205? I think?) purpose-built double trap guns were made during the later years when "Trap" guns were so named.

My understanding is that these 200+ "Trap" guns are included in the total number of guns with vent ribs (referencing the numbers I shared in an earlier post).

[Randy G Roberts]

Got it John, thanks. Also I did check out a B grade gun I have that letters with the VR and the last 3 digits of the serial # were there between the 1st and
2nd post.

[Bill Murphy]

Trap guns were made during a period with how many missing stock books? The answer seems to be four, if you consider that traps guns go back to around 1923. This is 12,000 missing guns out of about 36,000 or 37,000 guns. Does that explain why TPS says there are four P Grade trap gun in total when I have owned or seen at least a half dozen, and I don't get out much. I thought the authors were supposed to have "extrapolated" the production numbers based on present and missing stock books. If that is the case, I now own half of the P Grade trap guns produced, according to TPS yet my experience tells me that there are many more. Since vent rib guns were in their heyday during the years that a third of stock books were unavailable for research, I think that we will never know much about vent rib and trap gun production. Your guess is as good as mine. The "Trap Gun" subchapter in TPS made a valiant attempt to explain the difficulty of determining total production of trap guns and vent ribs. Pages 401-2 and some previous pages in TPS.

[John Havard]

Just returned from shooting two rounds of trap with the vent DHE. What fun! First time in at least 5 years I've shot trap and didn't realize just how much I missed the fun. Now I'll need to find a dedicated trap gun. However, being as out-of-practice as I was the gun and I still got along quite well.

And while cleaning up the old gal just now I did confirm that the last three digits are indeed engraved underneath the rib between the first and second post.

[John Havard]

delete because of unintentional double post.

[Bill Murphy]

Not only are a good one third of stock book entries missing during the trap gun era, there are no order books during this period either. Another point to make is the existence of many guns configured and ordered as trap guns that do not have vent ribs. One of my trap guns with solid rib is documented as intended to be used for trap by the work order tag and by the extensive ATA record of the original owner. We are just never going to know.

[Brian Dudley]

Volune 2 of TPS has a list of Vent Rib guns. There are 377 guns on the list. But the earliest serial number is a 1927 built gun. And 1923 was the first year for recorded and cataloged the vent rib option on double guns.
So there are 4 years worth of guns not on the list at the beginning. Not sure why???

[Rich Anderson]

I have serial number 222223 a DHE vent rib 20 which falls into the 1927 date of manufacture.

[Bill Murphy]

Brian, there are four stock books missing between 1923 and 1927 representing at least 12000 guns. After 1935 or thereabouts, there are only IBM cards, with many of them missing and many not fully describing the guns. Therefore, the 377 figure in TPS is only part of the vent rib story.

[Brian Dudley]

I was looking at the list because i had a guy contact me yesterday asking about how many DHEs with vent ribs and 32” barrels may have been made. I told him the list showed 74 out of 377.
But then he told me his gun was in the 213,000 serial range being 1925, so it predated the list. His gun IS in the serialization book. But it is not listed as having the VR option. But i saw photos of it and it is a legit VR gun with the flat top frame.

So i told him that given what is not on the list, maybe 100 DHEs with 32” barrels is more in the ballpark.

[Rich Anderson]

I wonder how many 32 inch vent rib GHE's were produced. I have one in 16ga

[Scott Janowski]

Were there more long barrel guns, 30-32 inch than short barrel guns 26-28 with vent ribs?

[Rich Anderson]

I saw and shot DHE or maybe it was a CHE 28 skeet 26 inch with a vent rib in January. The owner called it his "garage gun" because that's where he kept it.

I have/had more 28 inch vent rib guns than any other length.

[Dean Romig]

What's his address??






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[Rich Anderson]

He's in South Carolina. It was a wonderful gun and would be awesome in the grouse coverts.

[Brian Dudley]

I would personally think that 32” would have been the most common length due to Vent ribs being a popular trap/target option.

[Randy G Roberts]

[QUOTE=Dean Romig;238314]What's his address??






That's exactly what I was thinking ...

[Rich Anderson]

I would personally think that 32” would have been the most common length due to Vent ribs being a popular trap/target option.

I have had two 30 inch vent rib trap gun and one 26 inch vent rib skeet gun. I currently have a two barrel skeet/trap gun with 28 inch vent rib barrels. I have two 32 inch live bird guns neither of which have vent ribs. I have encountered far fewer 32 inch vent rib guns vs other lengths.

[Brett Souder]

I just sold my 12 Gauge DHE 32" Vent rib gun last year. I felt the barrel length brought a premium.
-Brett

[John Dallas]

I thought I got a nice buy on the 32" DHE I got from Josh. I didn't attribute any value to the long barrels. I guess the deal just got better than I thought

[Dean Romig]

I once sold a set of vent-rib 32" Titanic ejector barrels with it's matching beavertail forend for..... probably too little.





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