Open up chokes or not to open up chokes....

[Rick Riddell]

That is the question!
So with that in mind what are some of the pros and cons using spreader loads as an alternative to opening up chokes? Aside from RST, who else offers spreaders in the safe realm of Damascus pressures?

[Jeff Kuss]

Polywad.

[Brian Dudley]

Spreader loads are known to give erratic patterns at times. So i guess that can be a con.


If the gun is not in collector condition, or if there is no documentation of what the chokes originally were, then open them up. Just make sure the work is done correctly.

[Ed Blake]

Have you put the gun on the pattern board? How does it actually pattern?

[Daryl Corona]

Rick;
Could you tell us the configuration of the gun and what you plan on doing with it?

[Rick Riddell]

12ga GH 30 inch tubes for Woodcock and Grouse over a dog. I plan on patterning it this weekend. The right barrel is at .740 with a choke constriction .045 and the left barrel is at .736 with a choke constriction .035. Both barrels measured .695 at the muzzle (if that's the correct terminology for choke). I know these are just numbers and the patterning board will show more, just wanted to get an idea or opinion/experience on spreaders vs. choke alterations.

[Daryl Corona]

Thanks Rick. If your GH damascus is in nice condition I would'nt touch the chokes. I'd look for another gun for that purpose, one with shorter barrels and more open chokes. But then again I love tight chokes but not for woodcock and grouse, so I see your dilemma. Try the spreaders first.

[Gary Laudermilch]

I have pattern tested both Polywad and RST spreaders in 20 ga some years ago. The pattern work was done with several different guns and the results were fairly consistent. The polywads were passable but barely and the RST's were abysmal. I have no experience with 12 ga, however and the results could be entirely different. Changes to their loads may have also changed since I did the pattern work. The bottom line, if you go the spreader route then a trip to the pattern board is in order.

[Frank Cronin]

I would keep the barrels original. You have to reload. These dispersor wads from BPI are great. http://www.ballisticproducts.com/Dispersor-X-20ga-spreader-wad-bag_250/productinfo/072DX20/


Spreaders do work. Keep your chokes original for the long shots and use spreaders for upland game, close shots on the clays course, and skeet.

Below are patterns from a full choke Remington Model 17 with full choke from 21 yards which is the center post distance in skeet.

20 gauge load with Federal hull, primer, Long Shot Powder.

[Frank Cronin]

12ga GH 30 inch tubes for Woodcock and Grouse over a dog. I plan on patterning it this weekend. The right barrel is at .740 with a choke constriction .045 and the left barrel is at .736 with a choke constriction .035. Both barrels measured .695 at the muzzle (if that's the correct terminology for choke). I know these are just numbers and the patterning board will show more, just wanted to get an idea or opinion/experience on spreaders vs. choke alterations.

Thanks Rick. If your GH damascus is in nice condition I would'nt touch the chokes. I'd look for another gun for that purpose, one with shorter barrels and more open chokes. But then again I love tight chokes but not for woodcock and grouse, so I see your dilemma. Try the spreaders first.

I agree with Daryl's advice. I love tight chokes too and at the distance at 21 yards the pattern would be the size of a cantelope. Fun seeing the "smoke" on clay birds but not good for the real birds with feathers.

I've patterned spreaders from a 12 gauge with full chokes but can't seem to find the pictures of the patterns to show an example. What I've been able to find as well as the NH boys who've also patterned spreaders, it will open a full choke to approximately to IC.

[Daniel Carter]

My results with the BPI spreader were the same as Franks with both 10 and 12 ga. full choke guns. About an opening up of full to light modified, i am going to try removing the wad petals and using deformed shot this winter to see if it will increase pattern size.

[Rick Losey]

My results with the BPI spreader were the same as Franks with both 10 and 12 ga. full choke guns. About an opening up of full to light modified, i am going to try removing the wad petals and using deformed shot this winter to see if it will increase pattern size.

it will increase spread by causing "flyers" - i wonder how consistent the patterns will be

[William Davis]

I use spreaders in 30 inch tight choked guns with good results on very close clay targets. Pull one out of my pouch when the target needs it. Hunting close I want more than open patterns, Fast and light too. Open up a 30 inch gun it's not fast and light.

Better to buy a gun built for the job

Willam

[Daniel Carter]

My first spreaders were made using deformed shot after seeing an ad from Orvis some 30 years ago for their spreader using flattened shot, made a device similar to a washing machine ringer [that dates me]. It deforms or flattens about 30 percent of the shot and opens the pattern one constriction. Used for grouse and woodcock early season but in Repro quail 1 it is to much and leaves to many holes in the pattern, only good in mod. or full.

[Bruce Day]

Maybe it's just me but I would get no pleasure in carrying and using a 7lbs plus G 12ga with 30" barrels on woods grouse and woodcock. I wouldn't like carrying the heavy gun and trying to swing it through the brush. I'd be looking for a 26 " light 20 or 16ga and saving the 30" 12 for pheasant or targets.

[James L. Martin]

I have been using spreaders ,mostly Polywads for a long time, most of the time I reload them in 12,16 and 20ga and they work very well. I have also used there factory loads which are also good, I thinks they still make 12ga 2 1/2 inch spreaders. I also have the RST spreaders but they do not open up as good as the Polywads do. The problem with opening up chokes is it has to be done right, I am at the point that I will not have any choke work done on a original gun. When the gun made it a hundred years I will not be the one to ruin it by having the chokes opened up by a local gunsmith. Even when you have what you think are the right chokes for your hunting you will run into shots that will need more or less choke than you have , so there is no perfect choke, so just live with what choke you have and change shells.

[Rick Riddell]

What might not work for some works for others, I'm young and strong enough to carry a 7lb gun all day, the gun fits and swings well. I'm going to enjoy it as much as I can before lighter and shorter guns become a necessity. I hunt early successional covers early in the season where barrel length really isn't an issue. I was just curious if spreaders were a good option or if it would be better suited to have the chokes opened.

[William Davis]

2nd the local gunsmith comment.

Go down a row of vintage SxS guns for sale look at the muzzles, you can spot the poor open jobs right away. Problem for a gunsmith is the guns were bored then regulated, bent to shoot to point of impact. 100 years later were are you going to index the reamer to open chokes ? Before the spot it was bent, after, one barrel more than the other or perhaps it was not bent at all. Result is out of round at the muzzles a good percentage of the time. Other risk is change in point of impact after. It can be done well by a well equipped shop, not cheap work though.

Modern Gun, Remington 870 for example, barrel is formed on a mandrel straight and all the same and easy to ream out. I have a couple of nice SxS guns that were opened before I bought them, they shoot fine, some of them very hard to tell. But if you can tell it's been altered the gun is worth a lot less than unaltered. However it's your gun open if you like.

William

[Rick Riddell]

I'm going to plan on leaving them as is, Polywad seems to be the best choice, does anyone know if the pressures are suitable for Damascus barrels? I sent them an email, hopefully I'll hear back. In the meantime, are there any other spreader loads available?

[Bill Holcombe]

I have used spreaders from RST in my 30 inch, 32 inch, and 28 inch 12s that are all either full/full or full/modified and they have been consistent and murder on dove and quail and of course clay pigeons.

[Daryl Corona]

I've tried spreaders and I'm not impressed. For clays I just use what chokes are in the gun- usually tight. For birds I switch to a more suitable open choked gun.