Barrels cut?

[Kurt Sauers]

The book says 28 " They are 26 " cyl/imroved . In your expert opinion have they been cut or is the book wrong? Is the right barrel tighter than the left?

[Rich Anderson]

It looks to me that they are uncut. You have the solid line at the muzzle where the matting ends. The right barrel should be the more open choke.

[Kurt Sauers]

It looks to me that they are uncut. You have the solid line at the muzzle where the matting ends. The right barrel should be the more open choke.


To me it looks like the right is tighter. Which would be the opposite of normal.

[edgarspencer]

Reversed choke arrangements are not unheard of, nor are they particularly common.
The picture would certainly say to me that they are uncut.

[John Allen]

The barrels are definitely uncut.The line at the muzzle and the barrels touching at the muzzle show it has not been cut.As to the chokes,they could be from the factory that way. However,my guess is that the gun was originally IC and Mod and the mod barrel was opened to cylinder.Check the chokes with a dial indicator gauge not a plug gauge.That will tell you what your constrictions really are and how long the chokes are.

[David Noble]

Well, I'm not entirely sure that they are original length. I don't see the keels at the end and the picture is not clear enough to tell if the line on the rib is original. I have seen the matting on cut barrels polished down and a new line lnscribed. Two inches cut from a 28" modified & imp.cyl barrel could leave it imp.cyl and cyl.
From the pictures provided, and I'm on the fence on this one.

[Bill Murphy]

John Allen gave you a good explanation. Get a letter.

[Dean Romig]

The rib appears to be uncut. The top of the rib is not polished down and you can see where each matting line terminated as the matting machine was lifted.

As for the barrels being cut or uncut... who knows...?
Get a bore micrometer and measure the bore diameter and the constriction in thousandths of an inch.

If the serialization book says the barrels were originally 28" I would order a letter... I think the book has been wrong once or twice before.




.

[Kevin McCormack]

I owned 3 Parkers over the years that had no horizontal line scribed across the end of the ribs at all. The milling cuts ran right out to and through the face of the standing rib; extremely shallow at the ends but there. All 3 guns "lettered", had intact muzzle keels,& etc. One was a 28", the other 2 were 30" guns.

[Drew Hause]

Not the best images, but the left barrel appears to have a dent (or had a dent removed) at 1:00 and remains slightly out-of-round.
At the time of your 3 day inspection measure the choke length of the reportedly IC barrel. The length of the choke constriction of a 16 or 20g should be 1 1/2" - 2" with a short parallel section at the muzzle; longer if a 12g.

From the late Austin Hogan
Parker chokes prior to sometime during Remington's ownership were cut with the adjustable nut borer and had the characteristic "OGEE" shape, with a parallel section 1/8 to 1/4 inch long. Late Remington barrels were reamed from the muzzle end, and have longer parallel sections.

The gun should be viewable at The Gun Shop in Olathe. Possibly a member could swing by with a bore gauge.

[Kurt Sauers]

I've stopped in there once. I was lucky to get sent to kc. Only a portion of his guns are actually in the shop. The rest are at his house I think. He's harder than heck to get a hold of I don't have the experience or knowledge you guys have when looking at parkers I'm always hesitant to put my money down. I'd certainly appreciate it if someone could check it out.
Thank you

[edgarspencer]

. The length of the choke constriction of a 16 or 20g should be 1 1/2" - 2" with a short parallel section at the muzzle; longer if a 12g.

The attacched photo shows J.P.Hayes' personal choke reaming tools, the 16ga., 20ga.,and 28ga. attached to their rods. The taper sections of each of these reamers is approximately 3 1/2" long. The more open choke the machinist desired meant the barrels, attached to the lathe carriage, were moved further inward. The greater diameter of the choke, which is obviously the inside, is largest dimension of the reamer.

From the late Austin Hogan
Parker chokes prior to sometime during Remington's ownership were cut with the adjustable nut borer and had the characteristic "OGEE" shape, with a parallel section 1/8 to 1/4 inch long. Late Remington barrels were reamed from the muzzle end, and have longer parallel sections.

I'm at a loss to understand how Remington performed the choke reaming operation from the muzzle end, unless the reamer, inserted into the breach end, was drawn inward from the muzzle end. It would not be possible to insert the tool from the muzzle end.

[Drew Hause]

Discussion regarding choke length
http://www.doublegunshop.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=466257#Post466257

[edgarspencer]

In England, Teague determined that a straight tapered choke, whose minor dimension was at the muzzle, gave a better, more consistent pattern than chokes which terminated in any parallel wall ending at the muzzle. This coincided with Bert Becker's observation.

Early Remington guns were know to have tapers which began at the barrel midpoint.

I find it hard to believe that choke restrictions as little as a few thousandths of an inch, had a tapered section anywhere near approaching 1 1/2"

I put one of J Hayes 16ga. reamers between centers and any 2.5" section of the reamer, measure from either end, tapers .035" ( .0175" per side) This reamer has a date stamped on it of 1901.

In order for any reamer to have a terminating section with parallel surfaces, it would require a vast number of reamers for the variety of chokes offered, so I have to conclude, that if there is a parallel wall section from the muzzle, going back some amount, it had to have been done with a separate tool. None of the dozen Hayes reamers in my possession have any parallel cutting surfaces. These reamers came from Charlie Parker.

Draw your own conclusion. I am confident in my measurements of this reamer.

[Dean Romig]

I have personally measured choke lengths of more than six inches in length BEHIND the 1/4" parallel section at the muzzle.





.

[Brian Dudley]

I beleive the barrels ARE cut.

The end fill looks suspect. And the matting termination looks off as well. I think the proper look was attempeted (decently i may add) but evidence, and records, suggest otherwise.

[Kurt Sauers]

How hard should it be to find a 16 with 26" barrelsfor grouse and woodcock?

[Eric Eis]

Kurt, they are out there and I agree with Brian the barrels you showed just looked "off" to my eye can't tell you why but I think they are cut also.

[Dean Romig]

But we would need to have the gun in hand or have much better pictures to know for certain.





.

[Harold Lee Pickens]

How hard should it be to find a 16 with 26" barrelsfor grouse and woodcock?

I have a 16 DHE O frame straight grip 26" with factory chokes of Cyl/Mod.
Yes , they are out there. Bought that one around 1990. Wish it had a longer LOP, is 13 3/4", so use a slip-on pad with it.

[Harold Lee Pickens]

16 DHE 26". Weighs 6 lbs even

[Kurt Sauers]

That's sweet

[Brian Dudley]

I owned a 16g trojan with 26" barrels at one time.

[Dean Romig]

I owned a 16g trojan with 26" barrels at one time.

I currently have one too. Very nicely refinished and has IC/Full original chokes.





.

[edgarspencer]

The more I look at those two photos, The less convinced I am of their originality, Though, as Brian says, it is a good job making it look right,

[Dean Romig]

Has Mike paid the courtesy of supplying some better pictures with greater detail?





.

[Rich Anderson]

How hard should it be to find a 16 with 26" barrelsfor grouse and woodcock?

I found a sweet DH 16 on an 0 frame 90% original case color and 26 inch Damascus barrels a couple of years ago. The 26 inch barrels are choked IC/F a combination I was dubious of but have come to like them.