Capt. Money's stolen Parkers

[Drew Hause]

To not clutter the other thread, and I think we've discussed this before

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1373/6511424/21690841/359853855.jpg

Capt. A.W. "Blue Rock" Money and his family arrived in the U.S. in 1890. He and his wife, Emily, had four daughters and two sons, Noel Ernest Money and Harold Bloomfield Money. Capt. Albert established The American “E.C.” and “Schultze” Powder Company, with works in Oakland, Bergen County, New Jersey, and offices at 318 Broadway in New York City.
On 7 October 1891, Lieutenant Noel E. Money (Princess Victoria’s Royal Irish Fusiliers), resigned his Commission and subsequently joined his Father’s business in the U.S.

Capt. Money was 2nd in the 1894 GAH and used his Greener in the 1897, 1898 & 1899 GAHs; a Parker in 1900 & 1901. He purchased a CH Parker SN 87238 in 1897 which he returned for his discount purchase price of $75 in Dec. 1898. He also used a L.C. Smith in 1897 and purchased a Smith A2 in 1901.

His 1901 Smith A2

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1373/6511424/21690841/333891829.jpg

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1373/6511424/21690841/333891827.jpg

He later had two Parker pigeon guns stolen.
Reward offered for Parker stolen July 20, 1901; SN 90,635, 8#, 30” barrels.
“Captain Money, of the “E.C.” and “Schultze” Powder Company, New York, is mourning the loss of his Parker pigeon gun, which was stolen February 15 (1902) at Paterson, N. J. The gun was taken from the case and shells substituted, giving it the required weight, so he did not discover his loss until some hours later. This is the second Parker gun Captain Money has lost in this manner.”

I believe this is Capt. Money with a Parker, which appears to have a hand guard.

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1373/6511424/19974446/406686109.jpg

(Courtesy of David Noreen)
By at least 1912, Captain Money had returned to England and lived out his years there. Harold, who had been a Professional Representative for Winchester, left the U.S. by late 1910 and by May 1912 was managing a rubber plantation in Ceylon. Noel E. Money returned to England at the end of the Boer War. He married Maud Wood and they had a daughter Mary and a son Gordon. He was the land agent for his father-in-law's estates through 1912. In 1913 they moved to Vancouver Island, British Columbia, Canada, where he built the Qualicum Beach Hotel and golf course.

Both Noel and Harold answered the call of King and Country for The Great War. Harold served with the Loyal North Lancashire Regiment and advanced to the rank of Captain. Noel served in North Africa and Palestine with the 159th Infantry Brigade, 53rd Welsh Division. He was a Major when they were in Libya and a Colonel by the time they were in Egypt. By the time they advanced into Palestine with General Allenby, Noel was a Brigadier General commanding the 159th. After the Great War, Noel returned to his family at Qualicum Beach.

[Daniel Carter]

Is the sn of the other gun known? Was the first recovered? Is there a listing of stolen Parkers that is available?

[Dave Noreen]

Capt. DuBray took Noel E. Money's order for a $400 Whitworth gun on February 9, 1895. The gun was to have 30-inch barrels, a slender grip, no safety, 2 3/4" chambers, scroll and flowers, no birds, trigger pulls 3 and 4, must be done by May 1. Serial number 81122. The 1895 GAH was 3-5 April at Willard Park, and Noel was noted as shooting a 7 1/2 pound Parker using a load of 48 grains of E.C. pushing 1 1/4 ounce of #7 out of a UMC TRAP shell. I don't know why the load was given in grains when E.C. was a bulk powder?!? Forty-eight grains would be in between 3 1/4 drams (47 grains E.C.) and 3 1/2 drams (50 grains E.C.).

[Drew Hause]

Noel was 2nd at the 1st GAH at Live Birds

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1373/6511424/24189170/411000979.jpg

Pressures for 1 1/4 oz. 3 1/2 Dr. Eq. BULK Smokeless were about 11,750 psi

From the 1895 DuPont Trophy report in Sporting Life
O.R. Dickey, of Boston, Mass., (winner the 1896 GAH) used a very handsome Parker Bros, hammerless gun, of the Pigeon model, and his load consisted of 50 grains, or about 3 1/2 drams by measure, of American “E.C.” powder, 1 trap wad, one 3/8 inch pink felt, one 1/4-inch pink edge, and 1 1/8 ounce of No. 7 chilled shot in the United States Cartridge Co.'s “Rapid” shells, 2 3/4 inches in length.

$500 was big money in 1896, esp. after the "Panic of 1893"

Harold and Capt. Money both used Parkers at the 1901 GAH at Live Birds but Harold later became a Winchester Professional Representative using a 1897 Repeating Shotgun, and competed primarily in the South.

More from Dave
http://foxcollectors.com/My%20Forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1116

The Greatest Hunting Stories Ever Told edited by Vin Sparano
https://books.google.com/books?id=fBsQCwAAQBAJ&pg=PT49&lpg

May 18, 1912 Forest & Stream
https://books.google.com/books?id=lUkcAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA637&lpg

[Dean Romig]

This is a really good thread. Thanks very much for sharing.





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[Drew Hause]

Albert William Money, Arthur Corbin Gould, Pigeon Shooting: With instructions for beginners and suggestions for those who participate in the sport of pigeon shooting, 1896
http://books.google.com/books?id=qkEEAAAAYAAJ

In the course of the last twenty-five years, I have met and known intimately most of the best known trap shots. I am one who believes that the longer I live the more I can learn, and that other people's opinions are always worth considering, and perhaps adopting, if, on careful consideration they are found to be based on facts and good judgment.
Stand with the left foot thrown forward, the body upright, and the feet slightly apart; in fact, very much in the attitude of a boxer. The higher the gun is held, the quicker you will get your aim on the bird; therefore, hold it as nearly up to the shoulder as you can, the left hand well extended, but not to its full length, or you will be hampered in shooting a bird coming straight toward you. Take care that there is nothing stiff or rigid about your body, arms, legs or head; grasp the gun very firmly with both hands.

Capt. Money's Position at the Traps

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1373/6511424/21690841/359853857.jpg

I would lay great stress on the necessity of concentrating your whole thought and attention on the shot. I have for many years past, known all the best pigeon shots, both amateur and professional, who have made their mark on either side of the water, and I have seen the very best of them miss comparatively easy birds, because their thought for the moment was on something else; some one, perhaps, having made a remark as they went to the score and so called off their attention from what they were doing.
Next to this I would advise keeping a cool and equable temperament. Never allow yourself to be upset or put out by anything that may occur. If a miss comes, take it philosophically; we all miss at times. Don't lose your temper and blame your gun, or shells, or anything but your own want of holding straight. Note in what direction the bird was flying when you missed it, and what trap it came out of, so as to discover your weak point as soon as possible, and take measures to correct it. If you keep on missing, and cannot account for it, get someone who is an old shot to stand directly behind you when you shoot, and tell you where you shoot. Strange as it may seem, he can see the direction of your gun at moment of firing better than you can. Do not, however, believe what everyone tells you in that respect. Many men who are not standing in a proper position to see, or are not carefully noting the direction of your gun and the bird at the moment, will say, “You shot over or under, behind or in front of that bird.” They are false prophets, and sometimes are wolves in sheep's clothing.
The question of cast-off in the stock of a gun is a most important one. When a shooter throws his gun quickly to his shoulder, pointing it at some near object, and finds, on closing his left eye and glancing with the right along the rib, that he is looking along the center, he may consider that he has a gun with the right amount of cast-off; that is to say, the heel of the stock has a slight bend away from the body. Few guns are made with a perfectly straight stock. I have, however, advocated them for many years, and I see that gun makers are putting far less cast-off to the stocks now than formerly.
The Winchester, Burgess, and Spencer magazine, or pump guns, as they are generally called, which in the hands of such men as Rolla O. Heikes, Van Dyke, Jack Parker, Capt. B.A. Bartlett and scores of others, are doing such wonderful shooting, are all built without any cast-off whatever.
There is a matter of the very greatest importance that I should like to urge upon all pigeon shooters, old, experienced hands as well as the young beginners; that is, care in handling a loaded gun. At all good clubs there are rules regarding this, which are in the right direction, but they do not go far enough. I advise pigeon shooters to make these rules: First, never to snap your gun shut, but close it gently; secondly, lift the stock up to the barrels, not the barrels to the stock; thirdly, while closing your gun after putting in shells, hold it firmly, so that if one barrel should explode, the gun will not fall out of your hands.
Every shooter should study to get both to perfection, and nothing but practice will do it. As the gun is thrown to the shoulder, instinctively the shooter moves or swings the muzzle, to keep pace with the flight of the object at which he is shooting; but if he does no more, when he pulls the trigger his shot will pass behind the bird. He therefore must make the muzzle, pass ahead of the bird at the moment of firing, and he must take care that in pulling the trigger he does not stop his swing.
As regards the cheek, there is nothing like having a small pad of soft, smooth leather, with some stuffing underneath, let into the gun stock at the spot which touches the face. In many cases I have known this pad to very much improve a man's shooting, even when his face had not been hurt by the recoil, as it takes off the jar caused by recoil of first barrel, and enables a man to use his second quicker and with greater precision.
There are three arguments used by many trap shooters in favor of the smaller charge, which is usually put at 1 1/8 oz. First, that the full charge of 1 1/4 oz. does not travel so rapidly through the air as 1 1/8 oz. of shot, and therefore the shooter has to lead a crossing bird more, and has not such a good chance with a fast direct driver; secondly, that the full charge causes too much recoil, and by throwing the gun off the line of flight of the bird when first barrel is fired, makes it harder to put in as speedy and efficient a second; thirdly, that the outside pellets of the charge with the heavier load have little penetration, travel up slowly, and are practically useless. All of these objections are urged by men who have had much experience and are good judges. There is also a fourth argument, which, however, does not always apply, and that is, that some guns shoot a poor pattern with 1 1/4 oz. of shot, while making a good one with less.
He will most likely shoot better if he watches each bird that his opponent shoots at, so as to keep his eye accustomed to the flight of the birds, as well as the light. If any one of my readers happens to be a cricket player, he will know that leaving the wicket, and especially leaving the ground when he is batting, takes his eye off and makes him far more likely to miss the next good ball he gets; and so it is with pigeon shooting; the eye gets used to instinctively following the flight of the birds, and gauging the direction and velocity of each one. He will also, if he is a good shot himself, see why his antagonist has missed, and avoid, perhaps, committing the same error.

[Drew Hause]

Capt. Money accompanied the U.S. Team to the 1901 Anglo-American match, for which most of the competitors used Parkers
https://docs.google.com/document/pub?id=185YOyQl7GIB9OYLs9Hr3tnMLHqs4rjEdR4j_E9l4HL w

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1373/6511424/19974446/406284252.jpg

[Drew Hause]

Broadway was Gun & Sporting Dealers row:
American "E.C." & "Schultze" at 318
Schoverling, Daly & Gales at 302-304
H&D Folsom at 314
Von Lengerke & Detmold at the corner of 5th Ave. and Broadway
W. Fred Quimby Co. at 294
Hartley & Graham 313-315
Remington Arms 313

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1373/6511424/19974446/413037474.jpg

Sporting Life Feb. 13, 1897 "Hunter Arms N.Y. Showroom"
The Hunter Arms Company, Fulton, N. Y., have removed all their stock and fixtures from their temporary quarters at 300 Broadway, N. Y., to No.310, where they occupy one-half of that large, light store with Thomas Conroy. The premises include basement and sub-cellar. They will have plenty of room here to display the Hunter wheels, as well as Smith guns. This wheel is fast, coming to the front, in fact all it needs is advertising. This is the first time the Hunter Arms Company have ever had a good show room in New York.

[Dave Noreen]

The Greatest Hunting Stories Ever Told edited by Vin Sparano
https://books.google.com/books?id=fB...AJ&pg=PT49&lpg


John Olin was obviously thinking of someone else --

“John Olin described Harold Money to me as he first saw him in 1913, after John had left Cornell and was working at his father’s Western Cartridge plant at East Alton, Illinois: “Money was tall – six feet four or five – and he had been loading and handling the Velox smokeless powder, which we obtained from his father. It was made with picric acid and he was as yellow as a Chinaman.””

By 1913, A.W. Money was retired and living in England, and Harold had left the U.S. circa 1910 and was off managing a rubber plantation in Ceylon in 1913.

In the back of a thin, 1941, Scribners edition of De Shootinest Gent’man which contained only that one story, is a second part titled “Recessional.” “Recessional” was a sort of 10-page mini-biography of Harold Money – de shootinest gent’man. Nash wrote “Harold Money was just under six feet, a graceful, well muscled middleweight with a keen mind, delightful smile, superbly rounded educationally, and one of the most adaptable chaps I’ve ever known. With a gorgeous sense of humor and polished by the contacts of high birth, he could put all hands at ease on any occasion."

Velox Smokeless Powder was manufactured and sold by The Economic Smokeless Powder Co., of Hammond, Indiana, while Harold’s father, Capt. A.W. Money had operated The American “E.C.” & “Schultze” Gunpowder Company, Ltd., with works in Oakland, Bergen County, New Jersey, and with offices at 318 Broadway, New York City, up to 1904, when Laflin & Rand took over those brands.

[John Davis]

I have CH 87238, referred to above, as part of my collection. It was actually ordered by Noel in October of '97 and was for two identical guns, 87237 and 87238. Presumably one for Noel and one for his dad, Capt. Money. The order specified they were to duplicate George McAlpin's gun. George was a top shooter and he and A. W. were good friends but later got into fisticuffs over some rule changes at a shooting club. Capt. Money returned 87238 in December of '98, so it is assumed that one was his.

The gun was later sold to M. H. Hogan of Torrington, CT on May 3 of '05 and returned on May 8 of '05. Must not have been what Mr. Hogan was looking for. The gun was then sold to SD&G in July of '06 as part of a 38 gun order. It now resides in Vienna, Ga., where it continues to give good service.

[Dean Romig]

John, have you done any research on M. H. Hogan as there may be a connection to Austin Hogan?






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[Drew Hause]

George McAlpin at the Larchmont Yacht Club Jan. 30 1897 from Harper's Weekly 2-13-97

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1373/6511424/19974446/407115946.jpg

http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?_r=1&res=9903EFD6133DEE32A25757C0A9679C946097D6CF
George McAlpin assaulted Capt. Money Dec. 28, 1900 related to a disagreement over handicapping

Sporting Life
The trial of Geo. S. McAlpin for assault on Capt. A. W. Money was called January 10 in New York. The defendant's attorney argued for a postponement until February 18, stating that an important witness for his client could not be on hand until that date. The Magistrate granted the postponement and McAlpin was held in $300 bail, having previously been paroled in the custody of his attorney.

Sporting Life
Geo. S. McAlpin has resigned from the Carteret Gun Club, of New York. His resignation is a result of his attack on Captain A. W. Money some few weeks ago. Two factions were immediately formed in the Carteret Club one demanding McAlpin's resignation and the other fighting to keep him in the club. This fight became so bitter that it threatened the very foundation of the organization. At a stormy meeting on last Monday night McAlpin withdrew from membership of the Carteret Gun Club.

[John Davis]

Dean, I have not.

[Randy Davis]

Here are a couple 1903 Live bird cups from Capt. Money`s monthly shoots
at the Carteret Gun Club...

Trap3

[todd allen]

Captain Money's book is a must read for anyone who has participated in the art of "Trap Shooting".

[Randy Davis]

Etching from 1894 Live Bird Shoot at the Larchmont YC...

Trap3

[Christopher Lien]

I have been continuing some research on a couple of original early photos in our collection, and was wondering if there are any known surviving images of Noel Money out there?... This would be very helpful for comparison.

I have an original old photo of A.W. Money at a club shoot with a Parker, and also have an earlier Tin-Type photo of a shooter holding a Parker under-lifter that looks like a younger version of A.W.... Thought perhaps it might be Noel?

Best, Chris ~ CSL
___________________________

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[Dave Noreen]

Noel looks a lot like the Old Man in this picture --

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v316/Ansleyone/Money%20Family/Jun%207%201894_zpsejpu1hwk.jpg

June 7, 1894

[Bill Davis]

Very interesting thread! Thanks all for sharing this information.

[Christopher Lien]

Below is the old Tin-Type photo I mentioned previously, early shooter with a Parker under-lifter.

Looks much like AW, and thought it might be a young AW, or perhaps Noel?...

Best, CSL
______________________________

[Dean Romig]

He certainly has a 'family resemblance.'





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[Drew Hause]

Capt. DuBray on Messner’s victory at the 1895 GAH at Live Birds. Sporting Life reported that Noel used a Parker; A.W. a Greener
https://books.google.com/books?id=GEYQAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA31&lpg

Now Gen. Noel Money
https://books.google.com/books?id=yUIaBgAAQBAJ&pg=PA83&lpg

[Drew Hause]

Impressive collection of Parker shooters at the 1900 GAH at Live Birds Queens, L.I. at the new Interstate Park
Won by 25 year old H.D. Bates, using a Parker, of Ridgetown, Ontario after 8 men tied at 25: J. L. Smith, C. F. Ayling, J. R. Malone – 2nd, Col. A.G. Courtney, Dr. A.A. Webber, Tom A. Marshall, and Phil Daly – 3rd.
“The Parker gun which Phil Daly Jr. shot in the Grand American Carnival and won third prize, was one which he borrowed from A. W. Du Bray, the Parker representative. Daly never saw the gun until the day before the big event, when he killed 15 out of 16. In the big event be was shot out on the 32d bird.”

Guns: Parker- 73, Smith- 34, Greener- 19, Francotte- 19, Daly- 12, Remington- 10, Lefever- 7, Scott- 7, Winchester- 5, Cashmore- 5, Purdey- 3, Baker- 2, Colt- 2, Richards- 2, Marlin, Prechtel, Grant, Webley, Stannard, Forehand, Syracuse, Churchill, Claybrough- 1 each.

Parker Shooters: H.D. Bates, A.W. Money, J.D. Gay, H.E. Buckwalter, A.H. Fox, F.S. Parmelee, Wilbur F. Parker, A.W. DuBray, R.O. Heikes, and Annie Oakley.
A. H. Fox used a DH SN 88807 ordered on August 9, 1898 by H.P. Collins in Baltimore. The gun was a 12/30 Titanic, with a straight grip and no safety. The gun was returned to Parker Bros. on September 18, 1900 by A. H. Fox to clean and rebrown the barrels and repair the action and the work was completed October 5, 1900.

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1373/6511424/19974446/397098808.jpg

[Drew Hause]

1901 GAH at Live Birds April, Interstate Park New York
Won by E.C. Griffith (Parker), of Pascoag, R. I. He killed 25 straight in the race and finished 18 more in the tie, shooting out twenty one other men who tied him.
2nd J.L.D. Morrison (Winchester), 3rd R.R. Bennett (Parker), 4th J.B. Barto (Parker), 5th Chris Gottlieb (Smith)

Guns: Parker the overwhelming choice – 85, Smith - 34, Francotte - 21, Winchester - 11, Remington - 7. Scott - 6, Daly – 6, Cashmore – 5, Greener – 5, Lefever – 4, W. Richards - 3, Purdey - 2; 1 each - Saxton, Clabrough, Cogswell, Churchill, James, Lang, Baltimore, Ithaca, Young, Reilly, Boss.

Harold & Capt. Money both used Parkers; I did not find Noel's name on the list of competitors

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1373/6511424/19974446/410294481.jpg

[Dave Noreen]

Noel was long gone to the Boer War by then. He was already in South Africa by the time of the first GAH at targets in June 1900. From what I've been able to find, Noel returned to England in the fall of 1897. From the New York Times, Dec. 13, 1897 --

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v316/Ansleyone/Money%20Family/New%20York%20Times%20Dec.%2013%201897_zpsiqpxt1nq. jpg

From the November 26, 1898, Sporting Life, “Harold Money, son of Capt. A.W. Money, of the American E.C. and Schultze Powder Co., killed 25 live birds straight in a sweep, at Singac, NJ, on Nov. 16, taking first money alone. John L. Brewer and Captain Money were in second place with 24 each.” And, from the same issue “Noel E. Money, late secretary of the American E.C. and Schultze Powder Company, is expected to visit this country shortly. He is on a business trip which will take him to California. His stay in this country will be a short one, but his many friends hope he will have time to give them a handshake before he returns to Europe.” Noel's journals show him on a hunting trip in the Atlas Mountains in North Africa, and then on a Bear hunting trip in Siberia. The bridge across the Ural River was just completed in 1898 and the Trans-Siberian Railroad reached Irkutsk that year, giving European "sports" access. And, then he was off to serve Queen and country.

[Dave Noreen]

Just found what I was actually looking for --

The January 27, 1900, issue of The American Field carried – “Noel Money, eldest son of Captain A.W. Money, of the E.C. and Schultze Powder Company, a gentleman quite well known on this side of the Atlantic, as he spent some years here and was quite a good trap shot, has secured a commission in the Imperial Yeomanry of Great Britain, and has started with his troop to South Africa to fight the Boers. The Imperial Yeomanry is 1500 strong, and is a body of men somewhat similar to the Rough Riders in the Cuban campaign. The men are all gentleman farmers, who are accustomed to riding after hounds across country, and are members of various hunt clubs. Their ability to handle firearms has also been considered, and all in all, it is expected to prove the crack light cavalry troop of the campaign. The officers and many of the men have furnished their own equipment. The Prince of Wales has been elected Honorary Colonel of the troop.”

[Bill Holcombe]

Just found what I was actually looking for --

The January 27, 1900, issue of The American Field carried – “Noel Money, eldest son of Captain A.W. Money, of the E.C. and Schultze Powder Company, a gentleman quite well known on this side of the Atlantic, as he spent some years here and was quite a good trap shot, has secured a commission in the Imperial Yeomanry of Great Britain, and has started with his troop to South Africa to fight the Boers. The Imperial Yeomanry is 1500 strong, and is a body of men somewhat similar to the Rough Riders in the Cuban campaign. The men are all gentleman farmers, who are accustomed to riding after hounds across country, and are members of various hunt clubs. Their ability to handle firearms has also been considered, and all in all, it is expected to prove the crack light cavalry troop of the campaign. The officers and many of the men have furnished their own equipment. The Prince of Wales has been elected Honorary Colonel of the troop.”

His impression of the Rough Riders and my impression of the Rough Riders are two entirely different beasts. While it is true there were some blue bloods in the group( Roosevelt himself, one of the Tiffany sons, among others) the majority of the soldiers that TR acquired at the Menger Hotel in San Antonio were from Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, and Oklahoma. While all were used to being a horse, few were gentlemen, and fewer still road after hounds. He is correct though that they were calvary and knew how to handle firearms. Good info all the same!