Longshot !!!! May be worth taking a look at.

[Kirk Mckinney]

Gentlemen. Although I am new to shotshell reloading it seems for those who shoot vintage doubles requiring low pressure rounds. Longshot may be the ticket. The only thing I could find on the powder were in forms where people complained that it was either to loud or their shoulders couldn't stand up to the loads. Most published loads are way up there. 1350fps and up all the way to 1450fps. And heavy payloads on top of that. Something I don't want going thru my old double. Even read a couple of forms of people claiming these loads destroyed modern semi autos. None the less. I just had tested a 1 oz lead load in a 2 1/2 12 gauge shell. The results were really good. Average velocity 1233fps @6000 psi. Not sure but that sounds great to me. I also tested a 3/4 oz lead load with this monster powder and the results were amazing compared to Longshot's reputation. Although I slowed the 3/4 oz load down to slow. The six shot string only had 29fps difference from the fastest to slowest and the psi rivaled 7625 or what ever that coveted discontinued powder was. Although I need to up the charge to get 1200fps it's looks like it will still be under 5k psi, maybe way under Guys it looks like Longshot slowed down may just be the ticket. It seems to shoot fine down in the normal range. Under the speed of light. Lol Just my 2 cents worth. I placed my order for some. Precision has it on sale at a great price. AnywY Merry Christmas guys. See you in the field.

[Kirk Mckinney]

Correction. 64 fps was the difference from the fasted to slowest on thet small load. The 27 or maybe is was 29 difference was on the 1 oz load

[Bruce Day]

If you are looking at 12 ga loads there are many on the Hogdon site that are 1 or 1 1/8 oz loads at 2 3/4 or 3 dre and that produce 1150 to 1200 fps. These produce pressures within factory working pressures for which the gun was made.

Look at the pressure tables in TPS. Also look at the chamber dimensions in TPS. Most Parker 12s were not 2 1/2 chambers.

There are many commercial loads as well as handloads that fall well under the 10,500 psi working pressure and well under Parker proof loads. A person can always choose to use low pressure or low recoil loads but Parkers are sturdily made,not delicate.

I do not know where a person would get an idea that Parker loads need to be kept under 5000psi unless he has a gun that is somehow compromised, and if that is the case I suggest it should not be shot at all.

[Kirk Mckinney]

I see what your saying Bruce. Good point. I have never liked the Hodgon site. It says choose then doesn't let you. Never been able to get anything good off that site. Anyway I shoot a fox and it is chambered for 2 1/2 shells. I just like to baby it with low pressures and I baby me with low recoil. It seems Longshot provides both. I actually intend to bring that 1 oz load to 1175 to 1200. Should lower the pressure to at least 5500. I think I just like experimenting with this stuff. Lol when I was a young machinist I once made a black powder cannon. It's a wonder I didn't do some damanage to something. I guess to each his own.

[Chuck Bishop]

I don't know where you live but watch out for low pressure loads in cold weather. You may get squib or hollow sounding reports and a lot of unburnt powder in the barrels.

[Kirk Mckinney]

Pa. I've heard about that but never experienced it. How cold are you talking about?I'm in Texas. It got down to 16 degrees the other day but my buddies opted out of going hunting. Lol. Fair weather hunters. But about how cold do u mean???

[Bruce Day]

The less the shot charge and less the velocity, the less the recoil and generally less the chamber pressure. A slow moving target you might get away with 1100 psi or a little less and compensate for less impact energy by using larger size shot.

As stated watch out for cold weather. I've heard that some powders such as PB lose as much as 20 percent energy at temperatures below 32F . Squibs are rare but I have heard of them happening.

[Kirk Mckinney]

Good to know. I've heard about wads not clearing the barrel and getting you into trouble. We went hunting the other day but it was only about 40 degrees but wet. I remember when I was young going and breaking 1/2 in to 3/4 in ice to put decoys out. Just started back duck hunting. It if it's real cold I would probably just stay home now. Lol. My age is catching up with me.

[Richard Flanders]

I've shot a lot of PB in handloaded 1oz target loads. It is far and away the worst powder for shooting in the cold. At 10deg F your barrels look like you've been shooting black powder and you have to check your barrels between EVERY shot and put a factory target load through each bbl when your done just to clean the bores out. I've shot it down to maybe -20F, where it is pretty comical in performance and not worth the squib/stuck wad chance. I will no longer shoot it below -10F under any circumstances. In warmer weather I really like it for use in very light 12ga guns and 24gr loads, which go out at 1150fps and only 4200psi. That load is really nice in my light damascus 1-frame GHE12. It's also a great grouse/woodcock load in hvy cover with that gun.

[Tad Tadlock]

If you are looking at 12 ga loads there are many on the Hogdon site that are 1 or 1 1/8 oz loads at 2 3/4 or 3 dre and that produce 1150 to 1200 fps. These produce pressures within factory working pressures for which the gun was made.

Look at the pressure tables in TPS. Also look at the chamber dimensions in TPS. Most Parker 12s were not 2 1/2 chambers.

There are many commercial loads as well as handloads that fall well under the 10,500 psi working pressure and well under Parker proof loads. A person can always choose to use low pressure or low recoil loads but Parkers are sturdily made,not delicate.

I do not know where a person would get an idea that Parker loads need to be kept under 5000psi unless he has a gun that is somehow compromised, and if that is the case I suggest it should not be shot at all.

For those of us that do not have a copy of The Parker Story, is there anywhere that the pressure tables of which you speak may be looked at?

[Tom Pellegrini]

I used Hodgdon's website. Pick the gauge and it lists recipes with pressures. For my 12ga I use clay dot, 17grs with a CB4100 wad 7/8 oz. of 7 1/2 100 to 1299fps. at 5300psi. When "I am" on it crushes clays consistently.

[Kirk Mckinney]

Thanks guys for all the info. I'm going to adjust my loads for 1200 ft and send to precision for testing. I will let you know the results when they come back in a couple of weeks. That clay dot looks like a great combo. May look into that See you in the field

[Kirk Mckinney]

Gentlemen

I have just go the results back from my second round of tests with Longshot...I really am impressed with the results. It seems to be very consistence in velocity and pressure even at slower speeds. I was looking for a 1200 ft per second load in 1oz. and 3/4 lead loads with low pressure. I wound up with a 1oz load with a avg. of 1182 fps and 5450 psi. Only 28 fps difference in the 5 shot string. Not bad. I also tried to slow down a small 3/4 oz load for skeet, I just wanted to see what this Magnum powder would do under such applications. I was amazed at it also. The first round I under charged the load at 23 Grains of longshot with 3/4 lead over it only gave me 1037 fps @ 2755 Avg. To slow for any use on mine. As I thought what it would take to get it to 1200 fps I pulled my 3/4 load I use now and it is 1185 @ 4900 psi with 700x so I just left it alone. But the Longshot was extremely consistent even at that psi and velocity according to the tests.
I plan on using the 1oz. load for dove,quail and the like.
For anyone needing a 1oz lead load, it goes as follows

2 1/2 Cheddite Hull
Cheddite primer
24 grains longshot
TUWG 2212 wad---- Precision Reloading #
1oz. lead.....
average 1182fps @5450

Note 25 grains of longshot to above combination will give you
Average 1233 fps @ 6038

Hope this helps someone.....Happy Hunting
See you in the field !.

[Paul Harm]

Kirk, Hodgdons doesn't list Longshot for anything lighter than 1 1/8oz. It's 58 on the burn rate chart. Titewad, Clays, Promo, Red Dot, Clay Dot, 700X, American Select, and Green Dot all in the top 20. Powder companies have different powders for different applications, a faster burning powder for light loads. It's nice you took the time and expense to have the shells tested with Longshot, but I think there's many powders more suited to light loads that will burn clean even in the cold weather. Also, 5000psi isn't necessary for our old guns. Probably anything under 8000psi would be safe in any good barrel. And the higher pressures [ 8000 ] aren't going to crack the stock, that would have more to do with pay load. A 1oz load or less at 1200fps would be a low recoil load. Because I shoot just clay birds, all my loads are 3/4oz at around 1300fps for a clean burn and to help get the pattern to open up a bit. I think if you contact the powder companies they will send you a reloading booklet. Then it's easy to compare different loads. I got mine at the state trap shoot from a distributor.

[Paul Harm]

As a side note, I have the Alliant, Hodgdon, IMR [ before Hodgdon bought them out ] , and Accurate reloaders guides. Because we sometimes sub in primers like Cheddites for Win, if you have to use the internet to look up loads it's a PITA, they won't show what you want. And even if you're using data they have it's hard to go from one load to another. You have to go into another screen. A trap shooting friend goes to the state trap shoot and every year he gives me the new reloaders guides. What a blessing. Because he can get them from the reloading dealers, they must still publish them for the public. Durnning this powder shortage it was nice to sit down, look at my guides, and pick a powder my dealer had that would do what I wanted. I find they had all the info I wanted without buying one of the Lyman manuals. JMHO's, have a nice day.