Frank E. Malin & Sons, (Canada)

[Hal Sheets]

Can anyone, offer any information on Frank E. Malin & Sons? I believe they are or were gunsmiths in Canada.
Any information would be helpful, Thanks!

Hal

[Bill Murphy]

In 1980 (some reference), Frank Malin acquired the rights to the Osborne name. Osborne was a famous British maker of pigeon guns and others. Malin took the name and made guns under his and Osborne's name and, as time went on, moved the operation to Canada and continued to represent the guns, now made in Spain, as British made guns. Google would be the best reference to determine more facts, and maybe more accurate facts, about the Malin saga. As an active collector through the Malin years and before, I remember that North Carolina dealer, Ronnie Roberts, promoted the Malin guns, but I am not sure what banner he promoted at what time. Roberts was a prolific dealer in NC and VA, and ended up leading the gun paper and gun memorabilia empire, SoldUsa, that still exists today. I haven't closely examined a Malin gun in decades, but I am sure there are some good ones. Rumor has it that some, although of good quality, have proof marks from a country other than that where it was actually proved. I would love to see a book written about the Malin-Osbourne story.

[Hal Sheets]

Thanks Bill,
That's a good deal more info. than I could find on the computer. But, I'll keep trying. The Osbourne connection may help.
I've been looking at a Malin gun, that seems to be built on a Webley & Scott action.
Now, I wonder if a Spanish made gun could have Birmingham proof marks?
Hal

[Bill Murphy]

When using google on your search for information, be sure to spell "osborne" correctly.

[Hal Sheets]

Will Do. Thanks

[Bill Murphy]

I got snakebit with my spelling because the computer was arguing with me.

[Ken Hill]

Hal,

Malin guns were discussed on the doublegunshop site http://www.doublegunshop.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=424772&Searchpage=1&Main=15796&Words=Malin&Search=true#Post424772

Ken

[Hal Sheets]

Ken,
Thanks! That's some interesting Info.
Hal

[Jon Sheets]

I did indeed purchase the gun Hal was referencing. Now I am looking for a Malin trade label. Besides being scarcer then Hen's teeth, I can't even find a complete picture of one. (The closest I've come cuts off the bottom line of text.)
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Jon

[Bill Murphy]

Check with Ronnie Roberts at Sold USA in NC. He was a player in the Malin saga.

[Jon Sheets]

I have an email out to him now. Thanks Bill
Jon

[John Allen]

I got burned on a Malin gun several years ago.They were Spanish guns with fake English proof marks.I think Malin did some jail time in Canada over it.In the late 80s they were very hard to sell.

[Jon Sheets]

Sorry to hear that John. All the more reason to evaluate every gun for what it is, not what the name on the side says. (Parkers included) A Malin gun might not be a first choice for an investment piece. As a hunting gun, as long as it goes 'BANG' each time the triggers are pulled, then what more does one need?

My research indicates that while there was some controversy over Malin accepting deposits on guns that where not produced (charges later dropped), he never "did jail time in Canada over it". However, like everything with Malin, the history is shrouded in uncertainty, rumor and conjecture.

It's unfortunate, considering many of his guns are fine examples of craftsmanship - regardless of the controversy surrounding them. Facts show he employed some of the best English craftsman to make them.

[John Allen]

The gun I had looked great on the outside.The locks were lower grade Spanish locks that failed within 200 rounds.When it went to the gunsmith,we found that the gun was entirely Spanish and of poor quality.I was told when I bought it that it was completely English,and it had English proofs.I did hear the Malin went to jail in Canada,but that is just rumor I guess.

[Jon Sheets]

John, that gives me pause to wonder. Are you saying yours was a sidelock? If I may ask, did you acquire it directly from Malin & Son?

[John Allen]

It was a sidelock 20ga.It has been a long time since it happened,but I think it may have come from Ronnie Robert's old shop Carolina Sporting Arms.Just the one gun and I stayed away from them after that.I saw several sidelock guns with the Malin name in the late 1980s and early 1990s at shows.They have gradually disappeared as I have not seen one in years.

[Jon Sheets]

Then I would have to agree, it probably was of Spanish origin. Being a fan of Spanish sidelocks (AyA, Arrieta, Grulla are the ones I have first hand experience with), I see a lot of "Spanish" in his sidelocks.

The Malin I reference above is a boxlock. To date, all my research indicates the boxlocks were made by W&C Scott (on their action) for Malin, at their works at Tame Road, Birmingham.

But as I said, everything is shrouded in uncertainty, rumor and conjecture.

[John Allen]

At the time there were all sorts of rumors floating around.The bottom line is that the guns were not exactly what they were advertised to be.I think the boxlocks were OK.The gun I had did not come from one of the better Spanish houses.The outside wood finish and engraving were good,but the metal work and interior mechanics were awful.

[Jon Sheets]

Refresh my memory, weren't there a lot of quality issues with some of the lesser Spanish guns back in the '80s and '90s?

[John Dallas]

I've heard that there were problems with heat treating (or lack of) resulting in a lot of soft internal parts.

[Jon Sheets]

Thanks to a fellow Malin owner, I now have a good picture of Malin's Trade Label.
Thanks everyone for the interesting conversation.

[Jason Hyland]

Hello Gents
A friend of mine inherited a pair of Malin 12GA sxs 7 pin side locks. Beautiful engraving by Peter Cook. Unfortunately we discovered upon a cleaning by our local Gunsmith that Gun 1 had nice parts gun 2 on the other hand had different parts (shotty locks) and a different barrel as well as file marks and shims to make it all fit. I know there are many rumour surrounding F E Malin and perhaps I have proof that there is some truth to them. The good news is they shoot great! Anyone else have first hand intell on Malins?
Cheers

[Martin Foss]

Several years ago at a gun show in Renfrew Ontario I bought a 16 ga. SxS that was purported to have originated in the Malin shop. The words " H.O. Heimbecker Gunmaker" are engraved on the barrels. A note accompanying the gun states:
Stock - Dave Catchpole
Engrave - Ron Collins
Case Colour - Art Troth
(Malin Group)
The action is clearly a German box lock - scalloped with cocking indicators and German proof marks. Barrels marked Krupp steel. The stock is very well made and attracted my interest in the first place.
I could find no reference to H.O. Heimbecker through extensive internet searches. Then I researched the above names and came up with a phone number for Art Troth. Here is what I learned from Art - a Cockney gunmaker brought over to Canada along with several others in the late 70's early 80's
H.O. Heimbecker was "Harry" - a gofer who hung around the shop doing menial task. He was there because of his father who was a rich and famous heart surgeon who likely commissioned gun(s?) from Frank Malin. Harry was barely tolerated in the shop but Daddy's money kept him there.
David Catchpole was a master stock maker now deceased. Ron Collins was an actioner not an engraver. According to Art he was a genius gunmaker last heard of living in retirement in southern California.
Frank was overwhelmed with orders for custom guns and made delivery promises that were unrealistic. This led to the use of cheap spanish parts to the utter disgust of the experienced guys in the shop like Art. A fraud charge against Frank was the beginning of the end.
Art had lung cancer and could now well be deceased since I spoke to him.
Precision Arms and Gunsmithing in King City Ontario have a Malin sidekick for sale. I believe that the earlier Malin guns are very good. Frank gave one of his creations to Charles, Prince of Wales - good advertising for Frank.

[Jason Hyland]

Thank You for your response Martin!

[Jason Hyland]

Martin
How does your 16 bore shoot? Well I hope.
Jason

[Jason Hyland]

Martin
Upon further inspection by another gunsmith he assured us of their high quality. They shoot great after a tune up!