8 ga. shoot @ The Southern

[Walter Bohomey]

Thank you Mills Morrison for the use of your shotgun,the balance was perfect for a gun that big,also thanks for all the work you put in this shoot. Tom Archer also did a great job. It was really nice to put a face on the people you only ever read. Thanks again from NYS and vote Trump.

[Mills Morrison]

You are welcome Walter! I am glad you enjoyed it. Also thanks to Jimmy Hall, Eric Eis and Gary Carmichael for making their Parker 8's available as well.

[Mark Ouellette]

Gentlemen,

Once again on politics on this forum!

Mark

[Paul Harm]

Mark, with all due respect, Walter was just saying he believes in the 2nd Amendment but in a different way. HooRaa.

[John Truitt]

I got to use the big Parker eight bore hammerless gun with a single trigger in her. Nice piece. I don't know whose it was but thank you for offering it for us to use.

[Mills Morrison]

That was mine. I am glad you enjoyed shooting it.

[John Truitt]

Nice gun. Darn thing is a beast. She shoot great. (5/6) I missed the very last target or else I would have been in the shoot off.

Thanks again Mills.

BTW does anyone know the loads we were shooting? FPS etc. I am just curious.

[John Davis]

John, I was right there with you. Think I was shooting Jimmy's gun. Weighed as much as I do. Hit 5 and missed my last target. What a blast. Thanks guys.

[Mills Morrison]

Jimmy Hall and Jim Stahl donated the shells. I am not sure what the specs on the loads are though.

[wayne goerres]

Mills. Did you ever get your 8ga press up and running.

[Mills Morrison]

Not yet

[Eric Eis]

I'm glad you guys had fun with the 8 bores, I was lucky to even be able to pick up my gun with my left hand. I'm glad George did well with it but he should have had the first chance to shoot it in the final since he was the caretaker of it (and he returned it to me as he received it) but he was a gentleman about it and let someone else shoot it.

[George M. Purtill]

The loads were superb. Factory quality. We were darn lucky to have that ammo.

[John Truitt]

2 oz of shot, 2 1/2 oz, what I don't know anything about 8 gauge loads.

FPS? anyone know
pressure/ PSI?

[Eric Eis]

"FPS? anyone know
pressure/ PSI? "

John not sure if I want to know now........

[Mills Morrison]

You all should try Charlie Cleveland's turkey loads. . . . . The turkey last year never knew what hit him

[Craig Larter]

Mills: The 8 gauge shoot was BIG BIG fun!! I shot the two trigger PH with I think 34" bbls. The green shells seemed to have more punch than the clear Winchesters. 4 for 6 and I was happy. Thanks all for making this happen, as a life long waterfowl hunter and lover of big guns this was a real treat. Maybe a 10 gauge challenge so more members could participate with their own guns. Craig Larter

[George M. Purtill]

Craig- maybe we should buy some big guns ourselves!!

[charlie cleveland]

i m sure glad all you fellas got to shoot the big 8 s they are a handfull... is their a link on the 8 ga shoot at the southern if it was posted i missed it somehow...would have enjoyed shooting one of those 8 ga lc smiths..all most traded for one of them lc smith 8 bores a few years ago...charlie

[Craig Larter]

George: I agree let's do it!! I have not seen a group of shooter have more fun and more smiles ever! Most just wanted to survive 6 shots but the 8's are big fun however, I would not to shoot a 100 target course with one. It was great seeing everyone, one of the best weekends of the year----right after opening day of pheasants in SD and Ducks at Vanderbilt Marsh!!

[JAMES HALL]

2 oz of shot, 2 1/2 oz, what I don't know anything about 8 gauge loads.

FPS? anyone know
pressure/ PSI?

Mine Had 34grains Universal Clays 1 7/8 of 7 1/2 's 8140 PSI 1215 FPS. They were clear Winchester but not all the clear ones were the ones I loaded. I think I heard Mr. Stahl say his had 45 grains of Blue Dot. Jim

[CraigThompson]

Mine Had 34grains Universal Clays 1 7/8 of 7 1/2 's 8140 PSI 1215 FPS. They were clear Winchester but not all the clear ones were the ones I loaded. I think I heard Mr. Stahl say his had 45 grains of Blue Dot. Jim

I like the sound of that load .

I'll have to scribble it down somewhere in case I ever luck into a Parker 8 . I am not a big fan of shooting that other stuff that makes white smoke when it comes out !

Jimmy I assume you use the Remington SP-8 wad in your loads ?

And with that bit of load data one can use Universal Clays for everything from the 8 gauge to the 28 gauge ! Nice to know !

[CraigThompson]

Nice gun. Darn thing is a beast. She shoot great. (5/6) I missed the very last target or else I would have been in the shoot off.

Thanks again Mills.

BTW does anyone know the loads we were shooting? FPS etc. I am just curious.

So how many went 6 straight ?

And how many shots in the shootoff ?

And finally who won ?

[George M. Purtill]

i m sure glad all you fellas got to shoot the big 8 s they are a handfull... is their a link on the 8 ga shoot at the southern if it was posted i missed it somehow...would have enjoyed shooting one of those 8 ga lc smiths..all most traded for one of them lc smith 8 bores a few years ago...charlie

Charlie
There is not a single PGCA shooter that didn't think you should have been there. In fact, we will come get you next year.
A lot of us talked about you. Its OK we spoke well of you.
But we won't let you shoot a Smith- you are shooting for us!!!!

[CraigThompson]

Incidently is the 8 gauge thing going to become an annual thing ?

[Mills Morrison]

Probably not. We are looking at a 410 event next year, though

[Jerry Harlow]

On Thursday night before leaving for the Southern I dumped the empties out of my bag from last year having not shot targets since then, so you know how my shooting went with two guns I had not shot before.

The highlight of my whole weekend was shooting someone's DH double trigger 8. The gun was in beautiful condition and had a lot of drop (I picked the one with the most drop) that made the gun kick not as badly as my 12 gauges that beat me to death over the weekend. I hit three of the six with the 8 including a double and could not have been happier. What an experience. Thanks to all who loaned their guns and provided shells!

[CraigThompson]

Probably not. We are looking at a 410 event next year, though


The 8 gauge event was "almost" enough to cause me to make the trip . The 410 I'm sorry to say wouldn't be as big a drawing card to me .

[George M. Purtill]

Probably not. We are looking at a 410 event next year, though

In my naïve opinion, based on my own feelings and the reflections of other posters, would be a great loss.

[George M. Purtill]

Jerry - That was Eric Eis' 8 gauge DH. It was sweet and I ran off 6 hits with it.

[Tom Archer]

Gentlemen:
I am very pleased to see these favorable comments on the LC vs. Parker Challenge; and thanks to you all. And to answer some of your questions surrounding how this event came into being, I'm always looking for ways to keep this event fresh and interesting by changing things up a bit; and it occurred to me during the 2015 event that an 8-bore event, if it could be cobbled together, would be lot's of fun. And knowing Jim Hall owned an 8-bore Parker, asked for his opinion. From there I went to Mills and learned he also had an 8-bore Parker; and from that conversation we determined that we'd discuss the idea further in January, 2016 when we seriously begin planning Event details.
To make a long story short, Mills and I worked with Bill Kempffer and Rick Hemingway to create an abbreviated format; then we began the really difficult part, convincing members to loan us the use of their rare and valuable 8-bore Parkers and Smiths. The next obstacle was ammo, and PGCA member Jim Hall; and LCSCA member Jim Stahl agreed to provide same, jointly loading approximately 450 rounds. Jim H. loaded his shells on the light side with 1 7/8oz shot, while Jim S. loaded his a bit heavier with 2 1/2oz shot; with all shells being loaded to vintage appropriate pressures. All the Jim H. shells were clear Win hulls, while the Jim S. shells were loaded in both clear Win and green Rem hulls; the Rem hulls being nicely roll-crimped, with all clear hulls from both sources being star crimped. Each gentleman's shells were kept in separate containers; and when individuals signed up, each participate was given 3 lite and 3 heavy loads to keep the playing field "level". This worked well until the shoot-off, as by that time we had no more Jim H. shells so that the shoot-off was exclusively with the heavy 2 1/2oz loads. As I've noted contributors of Parker 8-bores have already been recognized; the LC loaners, with LC eights being much rarer than Parkers, were contributed by Jim Stahl with two examples, and the other by Mike Harris.
Mills was extremely busy at the PGCA booth and I'm not sure if he had a chance to witness the event personally; but I was there and can testify that I've never witnessed an event that seemed to be more fun to watch, or which generated so much enthusiasm among the participants. I got the biggest hoot from watching skinny little ole John Davis shoot; that big ole Parker was really knocking him around, but he didn't care. Wish you all could have seen the smile on his face afterwards! We actually had a couple of women shoot the event; but the most memorable shooter was an elderly and frail looking gentleman who asked if he could shoot. I don't think this guy was a member of either organization, but saw no harm in his shooting and let him sign up. He shot the event under the direct supervision of Rick Hemingway for safety concerns; and in returning the gun afterwards said the following "I'm 80 years old and have always wanted to shoot an 8 gauge; thank you so much for allowing me to do this, 'cause now I can scratch the 8 gauge off my bucket list".
During event planning Mills had commented that the PGCA had some really good 8-bore shooters and would "dominate", so I should expect a PGCA shoot-off. And yes, this short event lead to a 6 person shoot-off and I apologize for getting so pre-occupied that I failed to write down the names and organizations represented; but there was an LC shooter or two in the bunch. So the shoot-off commenced with traps being reset to increase degree of difficulty, and the format was 2 true pairs from station one. When the smoke cleared, three shooters were tied with 2 x 4 scores; JD Shank for the PGCA, John Liles of the LCSCA, and one other shooter whose name I beg someone recall. From that point the shoot-out moved to station 3, which was adjusted to create a really tough true pair; miss and eliminated. John Liles shot first and broke both clays with an unbelievably long and lucky shot on the second bird. The unknown shooter (whom I believe was also a PGCA member) shot next; breaking the first clay and dropping the long bird. The final shooter was JD Shank representing the PGCA, who remembered the safety slide a bit late and dropped the pair. I don't think John Liles had ever won any shooting event before this event; and the last time I say John he still had that smirk on his face; but he won one heck of a nice unique and one-off trophy!
As to the event itself and it's future, we had a total of 54 shooters; but I honestly thought we'd have 60, so I fell a bit short of my goal in that regard (during sign-ups it was clear many folks were intimidated by the mere thought of shooting the 8-gauge). But the biggest disappointment to me personally was that we had far more LCSCA shooters that we did PGCA shooters. I don't have the final tally, but at one point my tally showed 38 total sign-ups with only 16 of those individuals being from the PGCA. I was literally begging for PGCA entrants; and actually encouraged individuals with joint memberships to shoot for the PGCA.
Bottom line, after the expense of the trophy, $710 will be divided 50/50 between the organizations; much of that fees total was to be paid the Jim H. and Jim S. to cover their costs for providing ammo, but each individual graciously donated their portion of the ammo cost so that each organization received an unexpected $355 to apply towards the cost of providing this event (an expensive event by the way, as the tent rental alone is almost $2K). And as you see and speak with these two "Gems", please don't forget to thank them for their generosity; as had they not furnished ammo, this event would never have been possible!
As to the future of an event of this type, the only way it would be possible is for the willingness of gun owners to share their rare 8-bores, and for the ability to obtain ammo. Mills and I have discussed continuing this event; and although we want to keep that possibility open, am not sure something of this type can be possible every year. This is why we discussed the possibility of a 410 event; but, subject to time and space limitations, we can create other events using a 10 or 20-bore. We could also do something with the 16-bore; although John's 16-bore Thursday event was so successful that it will most likely be a permanent Thursday afternoon event with top shooter award next year, we'll know more later. The main point is that you let Mills and me know what you want and we'll be caught trying to get it done; but by the same token, if we're expected do the work to put an event together, then please be sure to come out and support that effort.
Finally, 2016 marked the 13th year of the LC/Parker Deep River reunion, and marked the first year that Mills was completely in charge of managing the event for the PGCA. I've told him personally, but will now state it here publicly; I've never met a finer gentleman than Mills Morrison. The PGCA is fortunate to have him as your Team and Challenge Event Manager; and having been there and witnessed him in action, can tell you that he worked like a dog to get everything done and make this event flow as smooth as possible for the PGCA; and indirectly for the LCSCA. Unless someone has been directly involved in putting an event of this size together, and was then actually involved in managing and tracking the event; it is impossible to understand and appreciate the time and effort that is required. I thank each member of the PGCA who has recognized his contribution; and have offered him encouragement, as his was and is no easy task. Mills and I have already begun discussions on ways to improve the event going forward, and on ideas that will serve to make the Challenge a bit more enjoyable and memorable for everyone in 2017. And as Team Manager for the LCSCA please allow me to express my sincere appreciation to Mills, and to all the wonderful individuals from the PGCA that I have come to know; and who continue to support the Challenge Event year after year. When this event was started in 2004 I'd not the foggiest idea it'd be the success it's been for the past 13 years; but reality is that interest in the Challenge has shown no signs of diminishing, so who knows how long this great event can continue? Obviously it can survive forever provided it continues to enjoy the dedication and generous support of those wonderful individuals from both our respective organizations who have made it what it has become. Personally I know I can't be the LCSCA Challenge Event Manager forever; but whether I'm involved or not, it's my hope that the annual LC/Parker Deep River reunion continues into perpetuity.

[Mills Morrison]

Thank you for the kind words, Tom, and those feelings are certainly mutual. L.C. Smith has a real asset in Tom Archer. It is a lot of work, but watching this event grow and to see people enjoying themselves is very gratifying.

[John Truitt]

Mr Archer and Mills,

Thank you for all of your hard work. It is men like you and those before you that have turned this stuff into more than just an event. Thank you again for all of your hard work. Anything you guys come up with and do for next year and the many years to come will be awesome and much appreciated.

All my best,

John

[charlie cleveland]

i was not there at the 8 ga shoot but believe me i was there in heart..my thanks to tom archer and mills for being so invoved with this special event the 8 ga shoot...the 8 bore has always been the favorite of mine and will be till only GOD knows...really liked the part of the 80 year old shooting the 8 ga..its a dream of mine to shoot a lc smith and a lefever 8 ga some day...it being i have shot the parker 8 ga many times...and the guy that won that special 8 ga trophy i envey you...my hats off to those fols that supplied the guns and the ammo for this event my thanks to all....i hope the 8 ga event continue in the future....charlie