Congress and new gun laws

[Robin Lewis]

:cuss:Today I received in the mail, a letter from the NRA-ILA asking that I contact my Congressman and Senators and oppose:
1. S. 843 and H.R. 2324 – Close “the gun show loophole”.
2. H.R. 257 – Hold gun owners responsible for crimes committed with their stolen guns.
3. H.R. 2159 and S. 1317 – gives the Attorney General power to create secret list to “black list” gun owners, prohibiting them from owning/purchasing guns without due process.
4. H.R. 45 – Fingerprint, photograph, test and register all gun owners.
5. S. 2820 – National registry of all gun buyers.

I have written voicing my disapproval.:banghead:

I hope others do the same.

[Richard Flanders]

It's started it seems. The last American Hunter talked of it being not if but when as to when the dems would attempt this kind of crap. Everyone better start emailing their congressman, especially in the blue states. It never ends, eh? They just want to take as many of our freedoms away as possible as rapidly as they possibly can.

[Bob Kimble]

Robin, everyone on this site should be voicing their opinions about this bad legislation. If we don't all get involved soon, we'll all be collecting Parker pens.
Bob K

[Dean Romig]

....or Monopoly.

[Bruce Day]

Any member of congress can at any time congress is in session introduce a bill about anything that member wants, or is forced to introduce by his/her constituents. Some of these anti gun bills have in the past not even had a co-signer and most are dead on arrival and never acted upon in committee, or the committee even holding hearings on them. While there is a need to remain vigilant, one should not take the mere introduction of a bill as an indicator of passage. Hundreds of bills for every kind of special interest are introduced every year and only the rare ones with substantial backing pass.

This is nothing new, these anti-gun bills are introduced every year and they die. The NRA does a good job of killing them off.

[Francis Morin]

As our POTUS has made his choice for the Supreme Court seat about to be vacated by Mr. Justice Stevens, his second such appointment since he took office, I wonder what the outcome will be. long range for the Second Amendment interpretation.:duck:

[C Roger Giles]

My remark to this is and old saying "here we go again"

I get tired and bored with this type of scare the gun crowd with someones pipe dream.

We already have a form of gun control, ie non toxic ammo with a price tag that keeps most casual hunters at home. The only ones that still hunt are the hard noses like Destry and I.

Roger

[Jack Cronkhite]

Sometimes, pipe dreams are realized............

[Mark Vollinger]

I took the trouble to actually read the bills to see what the details are.... according to govtrack.us

A man only learns in two ways, one by reading, and the other by association with smarter people. Will Rogers

H.R. 257 – Hold gun owners responsible for crimes committed with their stolen guns.

Also known as H.R.257 -Child Gun Safety and Gun Access Prevention Act of 2007
1/7/2009--
(1) raise the age of handgun eligibility to 21 (currently, 18); and
(2) prohibit persons under age 21 from possessing semiautomatic assault weapons or large capacity ammunition feeding devices, with exceptions. Increases penalties for:
(1) a second or subsequent violation by a juvenile of Brady Act provisions or for a first violation committed after an adjudication of delinquency or after a state or federal conviction for an act that, if committed by an adult, would be a serious violent felony; and
(2) transferring a handgun, ammunition, semiautomatic assault weapon, or large capacity ammunition feeding device to a person who is under age 21, knowing or having reasonable cause to know that such person intended to use it in the commission of a crime of violence


S. 2820 – National registry of all gun buyers.

Also know as S. 2820 12/1/2009 Preserving Records of Terrorist & Criminal Transactions Act of 2009

Amends the federal criminal code to require: (1) the retention for a minimum of 10 years of criminal background check records for known or suspected members of terrorist organizations who attempt to purchase firearms or apply for a state permit to possess, acquire, or carry firearms; and (2) the retention for at least 180 days of other criminal background check records relating to firearms purchases. Repeals certain provisions that require the destruction within 24 hours of identifying information for individuals who legally purchase or possess firearms.

H.R. 2159 gives the Attorney General power to create secret list to “black list” gun owners, prohibiting them from owning/purchasing guns without due process.

Also known as H.R. 2159 Denying Firearms and Explosives to Dangerous Terrorists Act of 2009 -
Intro by Peter King R-NY Referred to sub-com. 6/2009
4/29/2009--Introduced. Amends the federal criminal code to grant the Attorney General the authority to deny the transfer of firearms or the issuance of a federal firearms and explosives license to any individual if the Attorney General:
(1) determines that such individual has been engaged in or has provided material support or resources for terrorist activities; and
(2) has a reasonable belief that such individual may use a firearm or explosive in connection with terrorism. Allows any individual whose firearm or explosives license application has been been denied to bring legal action challenging the denial. Prohibits the sale or distribution of firearms or explosives to any individual whom the Attorney General has determined to be engaged in terrorist activities. Permits the Attorney General to withhold information in firearms and explosives license denial revocation suits if the Attorney General determines that the disclosure of such information would likely compromise national security Authorizes the Attorney General to revoke firearms and explosives licenses and permits held by individuals determined to be engaged in terrorism

I would prefer to focus on Parkers and learning more about them.....

[John Mazza]

In some states, "handgun eligibility" is already age 21, and has been for quite some time...
It's still a joke - so many gun crimes are committed by minors, so what good will it do to raise that age ? (They're still illegal)
Plus, so many times, when they finally catch a perp. they have a rap sheet a mile long - filled with felony charges & convictions. My big grip is this: WHAT IN THE HELL ARE THEY DOING OUTSIDE OF PRISON WALLS ?????? They are weeds - pull them or they'll take over the garden.

[Richard Flanders]

Michigan was 21 for handguns when I bought my first one 38yrs ago.... must be why the crime rate in Detroit has always been sooooo low, eh?:banghead:

[Phil Leggett]

Not to rub it in but I'm so glad I live in Arizona. With the overshadowing of the "new" immigration law, no one noticed our other new law that allows law-abiding citizens to carry concealed weapons without a permit. Shhhhh! It's our secret. There's plenty of room here if you're tired of the BS where you live.

[James T. Kucaba]

Any member of congress can at any time congress is in session introduce a bill about anything that member wants, or is forced to introduce by his/her constituents. Some of these anti gun bills have in the past not even had a co-signer and most are dead on arrival and never acted upon in committee, or the committee even holding hearings on them. While there is a need to remain vigilant, one should not take the mere introduction of a bill as an indicator of passage. Hundreds of bills for every kind of special interest are introduced every year and only the rare ones with substantial backing pass.

This is nothing new, these anti-gun bills are introduced every year and they die. The NRA does a good job of killing them off.


Bruce and others ... I'd like to reinforce what Bruce said previously ... While it is certainly true that the NRA and other pro-second amendment, pro-gun organizations do a good job of getting anti-gun bills killed, just belonging to the NRA and other pro-gun groups is NOT an excuse for pro-second amendment, pro-gun people to sit on their dead ass doing nothing ! ...

There are far too many anti-second amendment, and anti-gun people currently serving in the US House of Representatives and US Senate, and to put the proverbial icing on the cake, President B-HO just nominated a woman to serve on the Supreme Court who wrote that she was "Not sympathetic" to a man claiming his right to keep and bear arms had been violated by police when she was a law-clerk for Supreme Court Justice Thurgood Marshall ...

So it is the absolute duty of every freedom loving, pro-second amendment, pro-gun person in America to continue calling and writing state, local, and federal officials to prevent the Sarah Bradys of the world from getting their anti-gun bills passed behind our backs when nobody's looking or as an amendment to the next Congressional Pay Raise bill that gets passed in the dead of night ...

Sir Winston Churchill Said: "Never give in--never, never, never, never, in nothing great or small, large or petty, never give in except to convictions of honour and good sense. Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the enemy." in 1941 ...

And Thomas Jefferson had it absolutely nailed when he said: "THE PRICE OF FREEDOM IS ETERNAL VIGILANCE." ...

Nuff Said.



Jim Kucaba ... AriZOOna Cactus Patch ... Email: JimKucaba@aol.com

[Dean Romig]

Thanks Jim, you're absolutely right!

[Richard Flanders]

And I've been getting emails on O's just having Clinton reverse the US decision on whether to sign, with caveats, the UN firearms treaty. It would need senate ratification but is at least a beginning for the antis. Not sure if this is legit but it sounds so. I'm sure they would like to get this done before the hopeful blood letting in the fall elections.


Now I've received a reliable clarification from a senator that this is not true, that they have merely agreed to 'talks', not to any signing and that there is not support in the Senate for signing it. Good to hear that.

[Bruce Day]

My youngest son, age 23 and a May 2009 graduate of the University of Kansas, obtained a position on the Hill as the executive assistant to a Kansas congressman, a member of the Blue Dog Democrat Coalition. These are Democrats who are pro life, anti more gun laws and are about as conservative as most moderate Republicans. This is a sizable group within the Democrat Party, yet the uninformed group all Democrats as the same, mistakenly believing that all support the same programs. Nothing could be further from the truth. Yet, I am told, every time some crackpot files one of these bills, his office gets constituent calls about how the Democrats are taking away gun rights and how the Democrats are anti American. They have to explain that they do not support these bills, they have no support and no chance of getting out of committee, much less making it into law.

These crackpot bills get filed every year by the few true anti gun activists in Congress and they die there. The sky is not falling.

[Bob Kimble]

Bruce, I know you don't think the sky is falling, but what would you have done with your precious Parkers if you were in the wake of Katrina? The authorities didn't care if you had Parkers or Sears Roebuck shotguns. I know a lot of gun owners say it can't happen here, but look around, it already has.
Thomas Jefferson was spot on; The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.

[Bruce Day]

Same thing happened in southern Kansas 100 years ago when two factions were fighting it out over where the county seat was to be. The local sheriff decided to confiscate all guns, finally the case went to court and the court pointed out that there was such a thing as the Second Amendment to the Constitution and ordered the guns returned. By that time, many were lost, strayed or stolen by the lawmen. So the Katrina situation is not new and vigilance is necessary. But that has nothing to do with bills that are introduced without support. The Katrina matter was simply an outlaw chief of police who forgot about the Constitution.

[Dean Romig]

It's not Democrats but left-wing liberal socialists we need to be careful of and vote out of whatever office they might presently hold. A great number of our ranks are good Democrats who cherish our second amendment so we need to be careful of our finger-pointing.

[calvin humburg]

Boy, thats a lot of reading.

[Bruce Day]

Calvin, I know its so much reading it hurts the head, but if I read poster's comments correctly, we've had some of them tell their congressmen, without reading the bills, that they oppose, for example, an effort to maintain records to track gun purchases by known or suspected members of terrorist organizations. Now I don't know, but I think it might be important to know if Mustafa of the International Muslim Front has been buying handguns and .50cal BMG's for the past several years. Just my thought, and I'm probably way off base, as one of our members tells me at every opportunity.

[John Mazza]

I find it hard to believe that too many "terrorists" are buying their ammo at Walmart or their guns from Fred's Firearms down the street... (Have any "terrorists" used a gun here yet ???)

In the same vein, many left wingers have claimed that Mexican drug lords are buying their full auto weaponry at US gun shows.

...like they got that Russian-marked full auto AK 47 here - and not on some international black market.

Just like the kids & grandmothers on the "no-fly" list - all the gov. needs to do is make the claim (with or without cause) that you are a "terrorist" and BINGO - no more guns for you.

People on the left would say I'm a whiner & that such laws are needed (ie: tuff sh*t if they may affect me or inconvenience me). Of course, these same people think the new law in Arizona may make life difficult for ILLEGAL aliens !

WTF ??? It's already a law that immigrants must have "papers." If I'm pulled over, I'm asked for my license, registartion & proof of insurance. It's the LAW that I provide those documents when asked !!!!!!!!!

[John Mazza]

Plus, why in the world is an elected "lawmaker" allowed to propose an "illegal" bill (law) ?

Here's one for them to propose: "Ban idiots from voting...or holding elected office."

Also, why is it a city council can pass a law (ordinance) that is illegal (in violation of state law) ? Then, nothing can be done about it (it can't be challenged legally) until someone gets their **** in a wringer by breaking the illegal law ?

What a crock !!!!!!!

Sorry - woke up on the wrong side of my bed this morning...

[Dean Romig]

No apology necessary John. This country is spinning out of control with all these new bills and laws proposed for every little thing that offends someone.

[calvin humburg]

All I now fellows is evil dosen't prevail in the end. And we an't getting out of this alive so forget all this political crap and go stroke you parker and think about hunting season! ch

[Dean Romig]

Sorry Calvin... most of us are constitutionalists and believe the Second Amendment is for all of us and needs to be defended in these troubling times. If that rubs you the wrong way, I'm sorry but we need to talk about it so everybody stays informed. I don't think any of us are spouting anything that can be labeled as 'inflammatory' and if you haven't the stomach for "political crap" there's no reason you should continue to read this particular thread. I, for one, enjoy reading your posts and consider you to be 'one of us' and would never think of asking you not to post something just because I didn't want to read it or didn't agree with you. Under the First Amendment you have every right to speak your mind but remember... the only thing that guarantees the First Amendment is the Second Amendment...

Thanks for reading my thoughts.
Dean

[calvin humburg]

Thats not exactly what I ment. But the stuff they r shoving down my throught is crap and a feed lot full. I'm probably not 1 of u. No stomach u got a lot of nerve Mr. Romig.

[Dean Romig]

Calvin, I sent you a PM.

[calvin humburg]

Well I can c I haven't lost my gift of upsetting people accidently. You all have a capital day and don't hold it against me ch

[Dean Romig]

Nobody's upset Calvin. We're all in this together.

[James T. Kucaba]

Gentlemen ... Sorry for the lateness of this reply ... Bruce Day is certainly correct in saying that Democrats are unfairly blamed for a lot of things they aren't responsible for, but Bruce doesn't mention that President BHO has been blaming George W. Bush for every negative thing on God's green earth since he took office on January 20, 2010 ... It's called the "Blame Game," and both political parties engage in blaming everything under the sun on the opposition on a daily basis ... And that being said, it's pretty well known that most, BUT NOT ALL anti-gun legislation originates from the Democratic side of the aisle in both houses of Congress.

As to the "Blue Dog" Democrats, only 54 members of the 435 member US House are "Blue Dog" Democrats and there are 0 Blue Dogs in the US Senate ... This equates to only 12% of the US House and only 10% of the 535 total members of the US Congress ... So, how much "clout" they wield within the Congress is a matter of conjecture at best ... A list of the 54 "Blue Dog" Democrats in the US House is attached below.

Respectfully ... Jim Kucaba ... AriZOOna Cactus Patch ... Email: JimKucaba@aol.com

Jason Altmire (PA-4)
Mike Arcuri (NY-24)
Joe Baca (CA-43)
John Barrow (GA-12)
Robert Marion Berry (AR-1)
Sanford Bishop (GA-2)
Dan Boren (OK-2)
Leonard Boswell (IA-3)
Allen Boyd (FL-2)
Bobby Bright (AL-2)
Dennis Cardoza (CA-18)
Christopher Carney (PA-10)
Ben Chandler (KY-6)
Travis Childers (MS-1)
Jim Cooper (TN-5)
Jim Costa (CA-20)
Henry Cuellar (TX-28)
Kathy Dahlkemper (PA-3)
Lincoln Davis (TN-4)
Joe Donnelly (IN-2)
Brad Ellsworth (IN-8)
Gabrielle Giffords (AZ-8)
Bart Gordon (TN-6)
Jane Harman (CA-36)
Stephanie Herseth Sandlin (SD-AL), Blue Dog Co-Chair for Administration
Baron Hill (IN-9), Blue Dog Co-Chair for Policy
Tim Holden (PA-17)
Frank Kratovil (MD-1)
Betsy Markey (CO-4)
Jim Marshall (GA-8)
Jim Matheson (UT-2)
Mike McIntyre (NC-7)
Charlie Melancon (LA-3), Blue Dog Co-Chair for Communications
Mike Michaud (ME-2)
Walt Minnick (ID-1)
Harry Mitchell (AZ-5)
Dennis Moore (KS-3)
Patrick Murphy (PA-8)
Scott Murphy (NY-20)
Glenn Nye (VA-2)
Collin Peterson (MN-7)
Earl Pomeroy (ND-AL)
Mike Ross (AR-4)
John Salazar (CO-3)
Loretta Sanchez (CA-47)
Adam Schiff (CA-29)
Kurt Schrader (OR-5)
David Scott (GA-13)
Heath Shuler (NC-11), Blue Dog Whip
Zack Space (OH-18)
John Tanner (TN-8)
Gene Taylor (MS-4)
Mike Thompson (CA-1)
Charlie Wilson (OH-6)

[Bruce Day]

I was a McCain guy, but there weren't enough others who felt the same. I'm not an apologist for Obama, and am looking forward to voting Republican again in the next presidential elections. However, truth is better than making up lies in politics as in everything, and conservatives hurt the cause by making up implausible tales and outright falsehoods about Obama. I have my eye on Romney and am impressed so far.

[calvin humburg]

What implausible ( I think that means untrue) tales and outright falsehoods. I would like to b informed. thanks ch

[Dean Romig]

I'm also looking for Romney to be on the ballot as I too, am impressed with him. We need a good businessman in there who knows how NOT to spend the taxpayer's dollars on insane bailouts.
Problem is, with Tea Party and other 'fringe' candidates in the pool it will thin the conservative vote...

[James T. Kucaba]

I haven't been much of a McCain fan for close to 10 years but he did a HUGE favor for a very good friend of mine a while before my friend had a incapacitating stroke and I thought B-HO was a dufus, so I voted for McCain out of gratitude ... That being said, AriZOOna Republicans are currently "fixin" to give Arlen McCain what Pennsylvania Democrats gave Senator Specter in our August primary, and,in all probability, we'll elect former AriZOOna Congressman J. D. Hayworth to replace McCain in Barry Goldwater's Senate Seat come November.

Jim Kucaba ... AriZOOna Cactus Patch ... Email: JimKucaba@aol.com