shipping question

[calvin humburg]

Do people without an FFL, (nondealers) have to use dealers to send guns if I sell you a gun can I ship it to you? Gun in qustion is 1892 parker, it is old enough a dealer could send it to you directly? Can he send it to me the 1892 parker? Thanx ch

[Harry Collins]

Calvin,

I send shotguns (US Postal Service) and receive them without FFL to gunsmiths and stock makers It is my understanding that an FFL has to ship to an FFL or Curios and Rllics License.

Harry

[Dave Suponski]

Harry is correct...:)

[calvin humburg]

So I could send you a shotgun ups without getting in trouble. ch

[John Mazza]

Yes, a pre-1899 gun is considered antique under federal law. I've received antique long guns via both UPS and USPS without any problem. (But if something ever goes wrong, I'm sure either entity would be an absolute pain in the *ss to deal with !)
I was once overcharge by UPS, and it quickly becaame clear to me that NOBODY that I spoke with/dealt with had ANY IDEA what their own rules/policies were ! I learned more in 10 minutes on their website than any of their people did via their training program.

It's sad that so many people don't know their own job, don't do it well, and/or plain just don't give a damn !

So - again - Calvin, the answer is "yes."

[Harry Collins]

Calvin,

There have been horror stories involving UPS and guns. Most agree that USPS is the best bet on shipping shotguns. I ship here with them and as rural as we are I still have to wait for them to check their rules. It is OK to ship a shotgun and not ok to ship a pistol or rifle as they need to be shipped by an FFL. Be sure to take the barrels off the receiver when packing otherwise you will almost be guaranteed to have damage.

Harry

[Pete Lester]

I have encountered what I view as an anti-gun culture at my local UPS depot. I have seen, heard or read of more damaged guns shipped via UPS. Of course maybe more are shipped by UPS, but personnally I use USPS.

[John Mazza]

I wonder why USPS balks at shipping antique rifles ? (I know they won't ship modern handguns...) UPS will ship ALL antique arms.

Last time I shipped a shotgun, I wrapped the barrels in bubble wrap & slid them into a rigid cardboard shipping tube. I removed the locks (it was a sidelock hammer gun) and bubble wrapped the heck out of the action/buttstock. Then, in a small cardboard box, I placed the forearm and the locks, each one bubble wrapped. Then, all three parcels were packed into a typical shipping box (firmly packed with packing peanuts).

I would have loved to had seen the look on the person's face when they opened it - I'm sure they thought I was nuts ! It was sent to a gunsmith - to repair hammer damage (probably caused during a previous shipment) and lock work.

It certainly arrived safely !

[Pete Lester]

Last year I had a gun I purchased on the west coast shipped to me using USPS. This is a valuable piece so I shipped the seller a Browning hardcase to use to mail it back to me. Thank God I did. The case was well packed but the package was struck by something that punctured the cardboard box, went through the bubble wrap and damaged the hard case (broke the wood or fiberboard under the faux leather) but did not strike the gun.

Cardboard and bubblewrap and peanuts ain't always gonna be enough!

[John Mazza]

True, Pete.

Years ago - when I was into longrifles (long-barreled muzzleloaders), I bought one from an outfit in Oregon. They shipped this thing in a 6 foot long pine box ! NICE !

That's the most care I've ever seen a seller take !

[George Lander]

Calvin: I ship every gun that I sell by Fed Ex Ground and have never had a problem (knock on wood) in over 300 shipments. If the gun is going across the pond I use USPS.
Harry is correct, the is no FFL required for a pre-1898 long gun. It is considered to be an antique & not a gun.

Best Regards, George

[Bill Frech]

I have received 3 guns that were damaged in transit to me. I had to sue UPS on one claim, FEDEX on another. They both eventually paid the amount of insurance. I just received one via USPS that was insured. We'll see how that goes. Bill Frech

[Dave Purnell]

This will probably raise more questions than it answers, but from:

ATF Online- Firearms-FAQ-Collectors

Q: What qualifies as an antique firearm?

As defined in 18 U.S.C. 921(a)(16) the term "antique firearm" means-

A. any firearm (including any firearm with a matchlock,flintlock,
percussion cap, or similar type of ignition system) manufactured
in or before 1898; or



B. any replica of any firearm described in subparagraph (A) if such replica-

i. is not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional
centerfire fixed ammunition, or

ii. uses rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition which is no
longer manufactured in the United States and which is not readily
available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade; or

C. any muzzle loading rifle, muzzle loading shotgun, or muzzle loading
pistol, which is designed to use black powder, or a black powder
substitute, and which cannot use fixed ammunition. For purposes
of this subparagraph, the term "antique firearm" shall not include any
weapon which incorporates a firearm frame or receiver, any firearm
which is converted into a muzzle loading weapon, or any muzzle
loading weapon, which can be readily converted to fire fixed
ammunition by replacing the barrel, bolt, breechblock, or any
combination thereof.


Dave

[Dean Romig]

No questions from this quarter. That is very easy to understand and needs no further explanation.

[Dave Purnell]

Dean,
The only further explanation I can give is as I understand the law, as a C&R License holder. Anyone who can legally own a gun can ship a gun within their state, with no license at either end. To ship a gun to another state, it must go to a FFL or C&R license holder. The shipper does not to have a license. Our Parker shotguns are not listed as antiques, but they are listed as Curios and Relics, and can be received by a C&R license holder, or a FFL holder.

I highly recommend purchasing a C&R license. For a little paperwork and a thirty dollar fee for three years, it allows the Parker collector to acquire any original production Parker made, and have it shipped direct to you.

Dave

[Dave Suponski]

As an aside...Parker Repro's are NOT covered under a C&R and must be shipped to an FFL.

[calvin humburg]

THANKS!
It's to bad so many people don't care any more a bought there job and don't care about others stuff that is being mailed. Typical liberalism running wild in R country. Godspeed ch

[Dean Romig]

Dave P,

I am a C&R holder.

Dean

[Dave Purnell]

Thanks Dean,
I thought you were. I addressed my response to you to keep up the conversation, as I thought there was some misleading posts earlier in this thread.

Dave