Parker Hinge Pin Removal

[Jerry Andrews]

Howdy all. I have a Parker CHE 16 ga on a #1 frame in for repairs. Someone attempted to add metal with a TIG or MIG possibly to tighten up the barrels on face and they have destroyed the hinge pin. I'm primarily an L.C. Smith gunsmith so the Parker in not all that familiar to me, but...it's still a double barrel. How does the hinge pin come out on a Parker gun? Thanks for any help you might be able to send me way. Respectfully, Jerry

[Bruce Day]

When the hinge pin was removed by Parker to slip on a new guide roll, the frame was supported and the pin pressed out. Not supporting the frame fully can lead to a bent or fractured frame. You'll see a screw head but taking that out only exposes the remaining hinge section. The hinge pin does not engage the hook hinge, its the guide roll that is the engaging surface. Most of these old pins are rusted or in so tight that the frame can be damaged by removal; that's why adding metal to the hook hinge section is the favored approach.

Because the hinge pin is not exposed between the frame arms, its the guide roll that has been damaged and you'll need a new one or to re machine the old one. The old pin can be reinserted.

I have a soft spot for C grade small bores. Barrels fluid, crolle damascus or Bernard?

[Dave Suponski]

Jerry,I have removed a few of the hinge pins.Remove the slotted screw and insert a drill blank or a drift punch the closely fits the ID and with the frame supported properly press the pin out.Use an arbor press for best results.

[Jerry Andrews]

I think they are Bernard steel. I'd have to look to make sure. I've tried to buy the gun for years, I've worked on the single trigger twice and the ejectors once, but he's hanging on to the thing for the time being anyway. Very pretty gun, skeleton plate, PG capped, 28" M/F barrels. Knock out piece of wood. Jerry

[Larry Frey]

Jerry,
Both Bruce and I have 16 gage C's with Bernard barrels and to say there aren’t many around would be a gross understatement. We have posted picture’s here of our guns and would love to see some of your customers gun if he were inclined to do so. If you have watched this board for any length of time then you already know how much we all love pictures.

[Bruce Day]

Yes Jerry, pictures please. If it is Bernard, it will say so on the top rib. If so, it will be the third known.

[Jerry Andrews]

I do take offense, and exactly why would you make such a statement? I have devoted my entire gunsmithing career specializing in returning American double barrels to exact factory specs, in some cases work superior to what was done originally. I'm not tooting my own horn but that is what I have done. So your statement, while not made maliciously I hope, is a pretty offensive statement to someone that holds these guns and their piece of American history so dear

[Bruce Day]

Bill, the statement is inherently offensive and publicly stated is slanderous. Saying "no offense" fails to soften the verbal fist. Just my opinion, which may mean nothing, but those statements are better privately made whether they are right or wrong.

Jerry, my apologies. I don't know you at all and am merely trying to be helpful and encourage proper Parker preservation.

[Jerry Andrews]

Bruce, no apology from you needed, but thank you. You sure hit the nail on the head on the assessement of that statement however! Thank you, Jerry
Again, I'm going to guess that Mr. Murphy was being the insensitive person his statement made him appear, as I find most people in this world are just fine folks and I can get along with nearly anyone.
PS. I could post a long line of very happy customers but I'm not sure that would really make a point here.

[Bill Murphy]

I will apologize and delete my post as well as this one, once it is recognized. However, it is beyond my comprehension that someone would weld up a hinge pin that can't be properly accessed to dress. It is further incomprehensible that someone would try to dismantle a ten thousand dollar shotgun, never having done it before. Even many of those who make their livings "fixing" Parker shotguns don't fool with roll pins. I am aware that Jerry did not weld up the pin. I wish him success in fixing the mess.

[Dave Suponski]

Bill,Please reread Jerry's first post.He stated that"someone"had welded up the pin.I take that to mean it wasn't him.

[Jerry Andrews]

If you read my post you'll find that I didn't weld the gun. It's obviously the wrong fix. What I did this evening is obviously the right fix now that I have the information given to me. The gun is now as tight as it ever was and I'm going to doubt whether anyone would ever guess the thing was an abortion before.
Your apology with stipulations is exactly what I expected. It's superfluous actually. I simply asked a question to obtain information. Your assault was simply useless, in poor taste, an attempt at being condescending ( which obviously didn't work with me ) and not very professional. But...it's America and one great feature of our country is freedom of speech.

[Bruce Day]

So Jerry, is it a Bernard gun? I keep track of these things. I know of two existing and one destroyed----- the barrels were hacksawed to less than legal length, the stock chopped, but a stock and Vulcan barrels fitted----. It would be great if another Bernard 16 was found, or any of the four 20ga Bernards found, none have.

What's the SN? I can't find a match in the SN book if it is a Bernard. Or maybe its not in the books, mine isn't.

Photos please. What is the engraving? Some of these were produced during the rondell period, like Larry's.

In halfway defense of the previous conflagration, Parker collectors see too many botched repair jobs by people who claim to be gunsmiths. They do more harm than good as a result of not having the skills, the knowledge, the patience, or the owner trying to go the cheap. Bill was likely on the way low side in identifying a small bore Bernard as a $10,000 gun(condition dependent of course) and its easy to be protective of these guns.

[Larry Frey]

Jerry,
Here's a pick of my CHE 16 with straight grip and 28" Bernard barrels.

[Bruce Day]

And if anybody finds either of the two Bernard 20ga guns with 32" barrels, let me know.

[Bill Murphy]

One of my Bernards is 33" and not 20 gauge. Will that do?

[Bruce Day]

Oh Boy! Bill, you mean its the long lost 28ga with 33" original barrels??

I knew it. You guys find all the good guns back east and send us out here the dregs.

[Jerry Andrews]

I asked the owner about discussing the gun, he followed this post and really doesn't want his gun discussed here past general studies. I can understand and completely agree with that. I found a gun of mine ( Ideal grade .410 L.C. Smith ) being milled over in full detail, serial number, pics, etc on another site. I allowed pics to be taken at a gun show. Seemed innocent enough. Then the calls started, emails, etc. I really appreciate the help on here with the hinge pin, it made the job much easier than figuring it out for myself. It is an absolutely gorgeous gun, and now the thing will close and function as it should and it looks right. All due to some kind words on here from helpful people. Please pick my brain on L.C. Smith guns if anyone ever needs to do so. Respectfully, Jerry

[Bruce Day]

Jerry, remember that even when a fellow is hiking the high trail, he has to step around a few obstacles.

[Jerry Andrews]

I've not encountered that too much Bruce but seems like when you do, it really leaves an impression! You have quite the sense of humor! Jerry

[John Dallas]

One wonders why someone would waste pixels memorializing road apples

[Jerry Andrews]

True, but you MUST recognize the absurd, dry humor in it and it's relationship to extrapolation that has happened here with the entire thread! Jake ( Jerry )

[Bruce Day]

Its that high price of pixels John.

I'm off in an hour to flog waters with a bamboo stick.

[Jerry Andrews]

www.AndrewsCaneRods.com The only reason I work! Jake

[John Dallas]

Jerry/Bruce - If you're ever in Northern Michigan, would love to float you in my Au Sable riverboat. It's a unique way to see the river and fling a fly.

[Robin Lewis]

Jerry,

FYI - I just went to the link you posted and my Norton anti-virus stopped me with a pop up warning that it had been reported as "an attack page".

I thought you would like to know.

Robin

[Jerry Andrews]

Thanks for letting me know that Robin, I'll have it taken care of now. Jake

[Jerry Andrews]

That's odd too as I have Norton protection! Jake

[John Dunkle]

It's Firefox & Google... It looks like the attached file - and following is a link "about your site" and why it was blocked by Google/Firefox:

Diagnostic page for andrewscanerods.com (http://safebrowsing.clients.google.com/safebrowsing/diagnostic?client=Firefox&hl=en-US&site=http://www.andrewscanerods.com/)

Best to you,

John

[Jerry Andrews]

I had the site completely overhauled. Would you try it again and see what it gives you this time? Thanks so much, Jerry
www.AndrewsCaneRods.com

[Richard Flanders]

I still get the "attack" page

[Jerry Andrews]

I had several folks open it that did not get any warnings that are Norton subscribers also. I then put the question to Norton, they opened it and did not have a problem. Still makes me jumpy however. Jake

[Robin Lewis]

I still get it too. I believe John Dunkle posted that it was a Firefox/Google issue. I am using Mozilla Firefox 3.6.3 as my web browser.

[John Dunkle]

Hi Robin & Jerry!

Robin - it was great to see you earlier today and shoot a few rounds and "break bread" over lunch... Hopefully, we can shoot skeet more often with Bob, Scott, Dave, Pete, Danny, George - if they ever ask us back up there again..?? ;)

Anyway - Jerry - it is a Firefox/Google issue. It does not happen with I.E., Opera, Safari, etc. As well, it will clear out the next time Goggle Bots re-index your site if the re-direct link codes have been replaced..? So - that might be a few days - so no worries!

John

[Richard Flanders]

I use firefox, Google, and AVG instead of Norton

[Jerry Andrews]

Thanks all. I have another post on the Restoration page, could ya'll take a look at it when you have a second and see if you have any ideas on this one? The L.C. Smith thing is my bit, but I sure have had a more calls lately on the Parker guns. Jerry

[John Dunkle]

Google refreshed this morning, so the Firefox Phishing and Malware Protection has been updated.. Jerry - your site should now open just fine in Firefox (If folks are still having a problem, wait for your PROXY cache to expire (typically only 12 - 24 hours), and it will open just fine)..

Looks great Jerry!

John