Trying to find info for Shotgun

[Mike Davis]

i just purchased a Parker and Company Black Powder Shotgun. Does anyone out there know anything about these? It has a Number 17 on the under side of each barrell.
I am new to the site and stumbled upon it while looking for info for the Parker Shotgun.
Thanks
Mike

[Mills Morrison]

We could help you more if you post photos. From what you say, it does not sound like a Parker Bros shotgun

[Rick Losey]

agreed-

the 17 is likely a Belgium proof mark for bore size

pictures will verify it-



do the marks look like any of these?

http://parkerguns.org/forums/picture.php?albumid=548&pictureid=6156

[Brian Dudley]

The gun is not a Parker Bros (of Meriden, CT) shotgun.

Parker never built a Muzzleloading shotgun.

[Bill Murphy]

???

[Mike Davis]

Please see photos and advise. And i would like to say thanks to all who have taken of their time to respond. Any help would be greatful. I am not looking to say i have a "million" dollar gun, i just am looking for it's history from a era of time that is gone by. Will be displaying it in my home.
THanks
Mike

[Dean Romig]

The advice you have been given is basically correct.

Yours is not a Parker Bros. shotgun and we are not about such a gun as a Parker & Co. gun.




.

[Rick Losey]

what you have is a late Birmingham England proofed muzzleloader of modest quality

it is not a Connecticut made Parker Brothers gun

[Mike Davis]

Does anyone know anything about it or where i can find any info on it? Gauge, dates, etc.
Thanks
Mike

[Bob Brown]

Mike, the 17 stamp is the gauge of the bores. On breech loading shotguns the bores were measured 9" from the chamber, on muzzle loaders they were measured at the muzzle. Your shotgun doesn't have chokes. The rules of proof say that muzzle loaders with more than one barrel have to be proof fired twice, both a provisional and definitive proof firing. If the maker applied in writing at the time of submission they could be granted an exemption so it only received a definitive proof firing. Your Parker had that done. The VBP under a crown is the single proof stamp the Birmingham proof house used to show that. Otherwise it would have both a provisional and definitive proof mark.

There were several gunmakers named Parker in Birmingham and the Provincial trade that could have made yours. Take a close look at the top of the rib and see if there is an address and maker name there as well. From that we should be able to give more details and a time range the business was operating. Then again, maybe not. Sometimes the name was put on by makers for retailers.

[George Lander]

i just purchased a Parker and Company Black Powder Shotgun. Does anyone out there know anything about these? It has a Number 17 on the under side of each barrell.
I am new to the site and stumbled upon it while looking for info for the Parker Shotgun.
Thanks
Mike

Mike: You may want to find a copy of "British Gunmakers Volume II Birmingham & other cities" & Geoffrey Boothroyd's "British Gunmakers" They may give you the information that you're looking for.

Best Regards, George

[Barry E. Scheetz]

Greetings. I have been reading some of the posts and have been impressed with the depth of knowledge of the responses that I have seen. I have gotten into the Parker collecting through the back door. A few years ago, a former colleague of mine left an early production back lock hammer gun to me in his will when he passed. the serial number is O1677. Recently I was fortunate enough to find and purchase another early manufacture back lock hammer gun, serial O925. Both of these I understand were the lowest quality guns manufactured as designated by the "O" prefix on the serial number.

I am particularly interested in the latest purchase since it carries 20" barrels and is marked "Penn RR #29" and has the name "Fred Gren" inscribed on the trigger guard. I am assuming that the name is the PRR railroad policeman use used the shotgun.

How common on these coach gun? The gun has a "T" stamped above the serial number on the water table. Is there any significance to this marking?

Thanks in advance for any input that you all can provide.

Barry

[George Lander]

Greetings. I have been reading some of the posts and have been impressed with the depth of knowledge of the responses that I have seen. I have gotten into the Parker collecting through the back door. A few years ago, a former colleague of mine left an early production back lock hammer gun to me in his will when he passed. the serial number is O1677. Recently I was fortunate enough to find and purchase another early manufacture back lock hammer gun, serial O925. Both of these I understand were the lowest quality guns manufactured as designated by the "O" prefix on the serial number.

I am particularly interested in the latest purchase since it carries 20" barrels and is marked "Penn RR #29" and has the name "Fred Gren" inscribed on the trigger guard. I am assuming that the name is the PRR railroad policeman use used the shotgun.

How common on these coach gun? The gun has a "T" stamped above the serial number on the water table. Is there any significance to this marking?

Thanks in advance for any input that you all can provide.

Barry

Barry: A word of caution is needed here. Shotguns marked in the way that you describe are more often than not counterfeit. Cheap Belgian made doubles from the late 1800's & early 1900's were sold by companies such as Sears Roebuck, J.C. Penny, Western Auto & others. These often had names on them that were similar to Parker Brothers (Bros) and were sold for ten or twenty dollars. They were most serviceable for the hunter who had not a lot of money to spend.

Unfortunately many of these later were used by those with no scruples to defraud the buyer. They often did this by cutting off the barrels and placing names on them such as you describe. The only way for us to tell you for sure if what you have is a genuine Parker Brothers is to post some close up pictures. I hope, for your sake, that I am wrong.

Best Regards, George