should I shoot my old Parker or hang it up

[John Yancey]

Hello all,
I am hoping you guys can help me in making this decision. I just inherited my Grandfather's Parker Brothers 12 gauge hammerless double barrel shotgun and was going to take it turkey hunting later this month. My wife thinks I am crazy and that it should just be insured and then put over the fireplace. Maybe I can do both but I wanted some professional advice from you all first. The gun has the serial number 111880 with the frame size of 1 and a weight of 3^6 and I think the grade is DHE as it has the ejector. All the pieces have matching numbers and the barrel says it is Titanic Steel. It also has a silver plate on the stock with a name engraved on it. My Grandfather received the gun as a gift after helping the original owner out during tough times back in the 1930s. the name on the plate is "P.R. Lilly". The gun has never been refurbished and I think some of the old marks, dents and scrapes give it character so here are my primary questions. 1. What amount should I have the gun insured for? 2. What size ammo can I safely use in the gun? 3. Should I continue to hunt with her or just put her on display?
Thank you all for your advise and wisdom.
John

[Rick Losey]

Have it checked for safety

Order a flat of RST shells in 12 -shot size of your choice

Enjoy it both ways

[John Campbell]

Hmmmm.
You might want to do a little digging if it's a DHE. It could be connected to this man and his family:


Here's a start;

The company's founder was Colonel Eli Lilly, a pharmaceutical chemist and Union Army veteran of the American Civil War.[4] Col. Lilly served as the company president until his death in 1898.[5] A stylized version of his signature still appears in the company's red logo.[4] After he mustered out of the Union army, Lilly briefly became a cotton planter in Mississippi, but the venture failed and he returned to the Midwest, where he was a partner in a Paris, Illinois, drugstore.[6] Lilly began formulating plans to create a medical wholesale company while working in partnership at the Binford and Lilly drug store in Illinois.

[bill grill]

I'd shoot it. :)

[John Yancey]

I have some photos but could not figure out how to post them.

[John Yancey]

Think I figured it out... if this works there will be some photos attached to this post.... fingers crossed.

John

[John Dallas]

John - Regarding your pictures - From the FAQ tab, here is a tutorial on posting pix. If this old fumblefingers can do it, I'm sure you'll be fine.

http://parkerguns.org/forums/faq.php?faq=vb3_reading_posting#faq_vb3_attachment s

[John Yancey]

Thank you. I am not the most tech savvy person and usually need assistance in that field.
John

[Bill Murphy]

Your gun is quite valuable and should be looked at by someone who is qualified to do an evaluation. Tell us where you are and we may be able to recommend someone.

[Chris Travinski]

Hi John, I would have the barrels checked out and use it! It's valuable, but too valuable to use, more of a chrime to let it sit on the mantle if you ask me. It's difficult to tell from the picutres but does it have an english/straight grip stock? A desirable feature if it does.

[Richard Flanders]

A straight-gripped #1-frame grade 3 12ga? Oh my! What a great gun to inherit. If it's safe to shoot I'd clean it up inside and and and shoot it a LOT.

[John Campbell]

Ahem.
Before shooting this gun, it would be eminently wise to have it closely checked by an experienced double gunsmith. Barrel condition is one thing. Stock cracks, splits, fouling and other problems are another issue.

I've seen some VERY dirty Parkers in my time.

Brad Bachelder would be the guy I'd send it to for inspection and a professional strip-and-clean.

And… if this gun happens to be connected to the Eli Lilly family, keeping it in one piece might be a wise course of action.

Almost forgot. A gun like this requires that you become a member of the PGCA. It's the law...

[John Yancey]

yes the stock is straight not the pistol grip stock.

[John Yancey]

I am located in Virginia Beach, Virginia.

John

[Bruce Day]

Ahem.
Before shooting this gun, it would be eminently wise to have it closely checked by an experienced double gunsmith. Barrel condition is one thing. Stock cracks, splits, fouling and other problems.......

See why didn't I think of that? Here I am with a bunch of Parkers that I have shot for many years with some up to book max loads and with both fluid steel and Damascus barrels and I have never sent a gun off to one of these gunsmiths to have it checked out. If they looked good to me I loaded it up and blasted away.

[greg conomos]

I don't always agree with BD but I gotta say he's right....why are we treating this ancient gun like it's a has-been?

I'd peek down the bores to make sure nothing is in them. I might even get a 10 year old to do it cuz his eyes are better than mine. Then, I'd buy some non-heavy loads as sold at the local sporting goods place and blast away.

This gun is in no way something that should be relegated to the fireplace mantle. It's a very viable gun in 2015. Just don't put Magnum duck loads through it.

[Craig Larter]

Beautiful example it deserves to be shot and enjoyed--purchase a couple of cases of RST shells and have at it--you are a lucky man----enjoy!!

[John Campbell]

... I have never sent a gun off to one of these gunsmiths to have it checked out. If they looked good to me I loaded it up and blasted away.

I can add nothing to such sage wisdom.

Jus' blow out the spiders and blast away!

[Rick Losey]

but maybe just maybe

many of us don't need a gunsmith because we know how to evaluate a gun
(some of us may even carry wall thickness and bore gauges in the truck just because you never know when you'll need them)

but then again - some one who asks the wall hanger question may not

the odds are - this is a great gun, odds being what they are

[Bruce Day]

Well I don't know anything about sage wisdom but here is a sage grouse in sage shot on the Montana sage brush sea last September. Used an old 1904 Parker 16 ga.

[John Yancey]

Here are some better photos. My father said he last shot the gun about 20 years ago. (He doesn't really hunt) I on the other hand hunt all the time. As far as I can tell the gun looks great and ready to hunt with but, I usually hunt with a Browning A5 in with 3.5" shells. I know I can't use those with this Parker but would I be able to use 2.75" Federal 6 shot? My father can't recall what size shells he used. Turkey Season opens up this Saturday and I would love to knock the spider webs off this old beauty with the beard of a big gobbler... HAHA.

Thanks for all the very fast responses you guys are a great help.

John

[Bruce Day]

Your gun was patterned with a 3 dram 1 1/8oz load. Federal makes one that I shoot in my old beaters.

[Gerald McPherson]

Insure for $4000 plus. Shoot 1 or 1 1/8 loads. # 6 shot will kill old tom. Don't put it on display or someone else may own the gun before long. Put it away safely as the previous owners surely did. After you use it for a while you will see what a Parker is all about. Congratulations.
I am sure someone near you that knows enough about Parkers will turn up to take a look at it for you.

[John Truitt]

John,

I grew up in Va Beach. Most of my family is still there. There are several Parker savy people in the area.

I will be there this Saturday and Sunday for a conference.
PM me if you would like to get together.
I can bring my wall thickness gauge to help evaluate the barrel wall thickness. I am no professional but I can at least look it over and give you my opinion.

[Jerry Harlow]

John,

Your gun appears to be a DH. There are no ejectors (what the E in DHE means), and it has an extractor. Very nice gun, especially the straight stock.

[Mills Morrison]

Looks like a very nice gun. Gerald gives good advice on ammo. Good luck with the turkeys

[Richard Flanders]

Roger that on the ammo. I never shoot heavy loads in my #1 frame 12ga. I stick to loads of 3drams or less. I'm more worried about the stock wrist than the barrels really. And the light guns like this are just plain uncomfortable to shoot heavier loads in. Doesn't make any sense to put a hvy turkey or duck 12ga load into what is essentially a 16 ga frame gun.

[John Yancey]

I already have a bunch of 1-1/2 oz 4 shot for turkey loads and from what I am understanding I should not use this ammo with my Parker so I will definitely go grab some lighter loads. I intend on using this fine weapon as it was intended as I agree that not using it would be a crime. Everyone on this forum has been great with the advise and I can't thank you all enough. I intend on getting her insured but to be honest no amount of money could replace this family heirloom in my mind. I am still a little stunned and downright giddy like a school girl about this gun being linked to the Eli Lilly family and still have some research to do. I checked the serial # against the original bill of sale documents posted on this site and unfortunately I don't think it survived. At any rate I will continue my research and keep you all informed as to what I find out. Once again you guys have been a wealth of knowledge and I don't know what I would have done without your assistance. Thank you very much.
Sincerely,
John

[Mills Morrison]

1 1/2 is a bit strong. IMHO

[John Yancey]

Ahem.
Before shooting this gun, it would be eminently wise to have it closely checked by an experienced double gunsmith. Barrel condition is one thing. Stock cracks, splits, fouling and other problems are another issue.

I've seen some VERY dirty Parkers in my time.

Brad Bachelder would be the guy I'd send it to for inspection and a professional strip-and-clean.

And… if this gun happens to be connected to the Eli Lilly family, keeping it in one piece might be a wise course of action.

Almost forgot. A gun like this requires that you become a member of the PGCA. It's the law...

I am now a new PGCA member... in accordance with the "LAW". LOL

[Dave Suponski]

Congrats on a wonderful family gun. Welcome to the PGCA!

[Mills Morrison]

I am now a new PGCA member... in accordance with the "LAW". LOL

Welcome John!

[Erick Dorr]

John welcome.
Now that your legal. I don't think it was mentioned before but your gun came from the factory with 28" barrels. Do they still measure 28"?
Also the book says that it did not come with ejectors or any other additional features.
As the newest member in good standing you can go to the home page click on the "Research Letter" on the left side and order a letter for your gun for only $40. This might give you more info regarding the Lilly connection or not.
Best,
Erick

[Dean Romig]

1 1/2 is a bit strong. IMHO



1 1/2 oz. loads are way too heavy for your gun!

Use a "standard" or better, a light load of 1 oz. of #6 shot for turkeys. Remember - no body shots! Head and neck shots with no feathers to absorb the shot are what you're taking turkeys with... extra velocity and heavier shot charge won't do it for you - but an accurate head shot at under 40 yards with MOD or tighter chokes will put any longbeard on the dinner table for you.

[Richard Flanders]

Jeez. Dean is spot on; please don't E V E R put an 1-1/2oz load into that nice gun! We have members who kill turkeys with Parker .410's. A decent 1oz load will do just fine for turkey.

[edgarspencer]

The best way to fully understand what these guys are saying is to go get some modern, fixed frame shotgun, and fire a few 1 1/2 ounce loads, after firing a few 1 ounce loads. Notice the difference? That recoil you're feeling is being transmitted through the butt stock. In the case of your 112 year old DH, transmitted through a dry, antique piece of wood. There are two screws, going vertically from the bottom tang to the top tang, and the two tangs themselves. They are desperately trying to split that wood like a log splitter. Using the right choke for the application, that extra 33% of the shot load is just going by old Tom like a bunch of skeeters.

[John Yancey]

Hmmmm.
You might want to do a little digging if it's a DHE. It could be connected to this man and his family:


Here's a start;

The company's founder was Colonel Eli Lilly, a pharmaceutical chemist and Union Army veteran of the American Civil War.[4] Col. Lilly served as the company president until his death in 1898.[5] A stylized version of his signature still appears in the company's red logo.[4] After he mustered out of the Union army, Lilly briefly became a cotton planter in Mississippi, but the venture failed and he returned to the Midwest, where he was a partner in a Paris, Illinois, drugstore.[6] Lilly began formulating plans to create a medical wholesale company while working in partnership at the Binford and Lilly drug store in Illinois.

I have exhausted my ability at trying to find the "Lilly" who owned the Parker I inherited from my Grandfather. I am going to order the original factory slip if one exists and hopefully that may shed some light on the matter. Thanks for the info in your remarks it has got me on a treasure hunt to solve the big mystery.

John

[John Yancey]

Not sure where I should say this and don't think it needs a new thread but...

I just got done meeting with Mr. Fred Verry here in Virginia Beach and wanted to thank him in a more public way. He checked out my Parker top to bottom and taught me a great deal about the wonderful firearm I inherited from my Grandfather. He didn't just give me answers; he helped me understand why. His knowledge and patience with a new Parker owner and a person he has never met was heartwarming and I could not be more grateful. His kindness reflects great credit upon himself and this Parker Gun Collectors Association. Bravo Zulu to Mr. Fred Verry.

Very Sincerely,
John Yancey