Need Some Help/Advice

[Gary Laudermilch]

I've located Parker #65929. It appears to be a 12 ga. 30" barrel gun in pretty good shape based on what I can see. It is obviously a low grade gun but may make a pretty good shooter. Supposedly the bores a good. What do you guys think and what's it worth based on what you can see.

[Chuck Bishop]

Well, if the inside is as nice as the outside and the barrels are sound, it's a very nice gun. It's worth what you pay for it if you like it!

[David Holes]

I looked at this gun but backed away because of the 3 1/4 drop at heal and the chip out of the toe of the stock and butt plate. If the stock was good that would be a very nice hammer gun. You forgot the most important picture with the chip out of the stock.

[Daryl Corona]

Even with the damage to the toe, this gun screams condition. Very nice.

[Rick Losey]

toes are not that bad to repair, nor are buttplates

[Gary Laudermilch]

I have had difficulty accessing this forum for several days hence the delay in thanking all of you for your comments.

I am not too worried about the wood or stock dimensions. I am concerned, maybe too much so, about the barrels. Their condition looks just way too good for a gun of this vintage suggesting they may have been cleaned up. Perhaps both inside and out. Couple that with barrels that are light to begin with as this appears to be a #1 frame gun and I am a bit skeptical. I wish I knew the barrel wall thickness as I wish to shoot it, not just look at it.

[Bruce Day]

I have a No. 1 frame 12ga Quality G made in 1883 and shoot it regularly with up to 1 1 /8oz 3 dre loads . Looking at the pictured gun, the condition of the wood, finish, and case colors are consistent with a little used gun. It would not be inconsistent that the bores are shiny and walls are original thickness. You would not be able to tell for sure without you measuring the bores. If nominal ID of .732 , wall thickness should be around .030-.035 if this specimen is like others of the same configuration.

For value, people will have their own opinions, but I can tell you that I know of four Quality G Top Action Hammer guns , No. 1 frame light upland 12ga's that have sold in the last five years . They were all in slightly higher condition than this ( more case colors) and sold for $3500 to $4500. None had stock toe chips.

The pictured gun looks to be a nice one, light upland hammer guns are hard to find, and ones that would be enjoyable to carry afield are few and far between. As for a drop at heel of 3 1/4", by later Parker standards that is more than usual, but for the standards of the time of manufacture, that is the norm from what I have seen. Lots of guns made then have much more drop. I think for many if not most people, if they throw the gun to their shoulder enough times they can get the hang of it. The old timers did.

[Gary Laudermilch]

Bruce, are you suggesting this gun is a G or 1 grade? I had it pegged for a V or 0 grade.

[Bruce Day]

Good catch Gary and my error. Its not a G, I expanded the photo size and looked again. It is not twist barrels either, they look like laminated steel barrels, if so it is a Quality L. The gun in hand will verify grade.

So that may reduce the value some, but regardless its a nice gun and worthy of consideration.


I looked again, the barrels say laminated. Definitely a Quality L. The lowest grade used twist barrels.

[Bill Murphy]

Anyone who does not own or have access to a bore micrometer or wall thickness gauge should not be buying composite barrel guns, or any old gun for that matter. Two hundred bucks in gauges can save you many times more in your first purchase.

[Dean Freeman]

Where can one find a bbl wall thickness gauge? ...Especially for under $200; the only one I've seen was significantly more.

[Rick Losey]

http://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-tools-supplies/measuring-tools/barrel-wall-thickness-gauges/wall-thickness-gauge-prod20463.aspx


not fancy- and practice with it to get good readings -

use the savings to get the Skeets bore gauge and you have a set to evaluate bores/barrels


PS
I have shown this set before here- I put this together after passing on what may have been a great deal on a hammer gun because the too shinny bores worried me that they had been honed too much

http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg195/setterw/2012-07-12_19-47-53_808.jpg

I bought a couple since then, that without knowing the stats I might have passed on-

[Brian Dudley]

The Brownells manson guage is good. But has some limitations. That is what I used until I bought a Hosford guage.

[Rick Losey]

the Manson is certainly basic but it works if you are careful and it does fit the under 200 criteria -

the Hosford is a great tool - I'd love upgrade someday-

[Brian Dudley]

I used the manson guage as a horizontal gravity guage like the Hosford tool. Not vertical as the manson instructions say to use it. It was much easier and also portable.

The limitations I found was that you can't read the depth of pitted areas due to the large size of the ball. And also it was good for only 20g and up. And even some very tightly choked 20g barrels would not allow the guage to go into the muzzle.

Now for bore guages, I still use the brownells guage for bores. It is VERY good for the money. The only major downside is not being able to do 10g bores with it. Well, if I remember correctly, it will measure modern nominal 10g bores, but if the bore is oversized, the guage is maxed out.

The Hosford bore guage is very nice, but a LOT of money.

I think the Hosford dent removal tools and wall thickness guage are well worth the money.

[Gary Laudermilch]

If I were a collector with the intent on buying many guns over time I would agree. Also, the tools don't do much good unless you have the gun in hand. I can get the barrel walls measured after the fact but then it may be too late. I would much prefer to buy a gun that I can lay my hands on but in my neck of the woods Parkers are rarely seen and when they do surface they are often Trojans. Nevertheless, your comments are appreciated and taken to heart. Thanks!

[Paul Harm]

I have a 12 Parker just like the one you pictured - bought it about 7 years ago for 750$. It's still my go to gun for clays, I've always seem to shoot it well. I've bought many a Damascus barreled SxS without measuring barrel thickness - must be lucky - never had a problem with any, but then I'm not buying guns in the 2000$ and up range. Well, one I did for 4000, but only one. A thickness gauge would be nice if I was going to invest in more than beaters.

[Rick Losey]

ok - not trying to stir anything up- but this confuses me :rolleyes:

why would a beater/shooter not require measuring and that be reserved for collector grades?

a "beater" it would seem is more likely to be shot and maybe shot a lot, so if there an issue of any sort with the gun it's more likely to show up.


If you don't worry about wall thickness - that is most certainly your choice - no matter what the price of the gun.

I shoot more damascus guns than fluid steel and personally - i measure - I have passed on a very few for being thinner than I like, but the vast majority measure up and I am comfortable shooting them, so it would seem the odds are with you if you want to play the odds.

[Dean Freeman]

I suppose one could argue that high value guns are more likely targets for bbl honing by unscrupulous sellers?

[Mike Franzen]

I would put the value of that gun at $1500 max.

[Virginia Hessler]

Just a quick comment on the thickness gauge.
If you have any welding skills or acces to a welder, they are so easy to make and make strong so they don't flex. I picked up a dial indicator at Harbor Freight for around 15 bucks and your in business.
I use mine with confidence , it certainly beats guessing.

Tom

[Dean Freeman]

Just a quick comment on the thickness gauge.
If you have any welding skills or acces to a welder, they are so easy to make and make strong so they don't flex. I picked up a dial indicator at Harbor Freight for around 15 bucks and your in business.
I use mine with confidence , it certainly beats guessing.

Tom

How'd you build it (Ahem... With pictures if ya got em':whistle:)?