Super glue in wood stocks?

[Bill Holcombe]

I am still getting the oil out of the VH. It is on it 2nd soak in Danatured alcohol after a 2nd soak in acetone. It is getting there, oil doesn't buble out anymore on the car dash, but the color still comes up in the head.

Anyway, a gentlemen the other day mentioned how he uses a super glue wood glue product to put a light coating on the inletting of his wood to give it some protection from potential cracks.

Part of me sees the potential benefit from this, but is this a legitimate thing to do?

[Brian Dudley]

This subject will get you very mixed opinions.

If you are just looking to seal the inletting, either use a penetrating sealer or do some glass bedding.

[Bill Holcombe]

No, was more just curious to his claim that it protected the stock from cracking.

[Rick Losey]

my impression is that it is done to seal against oil not to add strength to avoid cracking

I know some muzzleloader builder use it.

it should seal the fibers - as i understand it- fresh wood will soak up a lot of it, until you stop- then the seal is complete since it dries so quick

[Bill Holcombe]

Brian,

I have seen many of ya'll talk about glass bedding, but I haven't been able to find any info on how someone would do it on their own gun rather then sending it off?

[Bob Hardison]

Bill: I have done glass bedding on several bolt guns. I have glass bedded one VHE. The VHE pukker factor was 100 times what the bolt guns were. I would not recommend anyone doing this to a double gun without experience. You could wind up with a ruined stock and a receiver full of steel hardened Acraglas. Bob

[Bill Murphy]

I would keep sucking oil from the stock until no more comes out, before I went to step two. What do the experts say about that?

[Bill Holcombe]

I am definitely going to get all the oil out 1st. I was just curios after that conversation.

[allen newell]

I've used tri-sodium phosphate to de-oil with great results. The oil pours out of the wood like coffee. And there was no damage to the wood when done.

[William Davis]

I use a lot of superglue wood turning. You can take "splated" wood with worm holes and fill so it won't come apart when turned. Interesting patterns when finished. Wood that crumbles in your hand can be solidified.

However when we apply the superglue we turn down for a fresh finish outside. Gunstocks trying to save original finish it's not a good choice. Seeps through spots you did not expect and impossible to remove.

Recently thought I could get away with it on a Hunter Arms forearm that pulled the screws out. Drilled punky wood out and superglued plug to hold better. Superglue found a very small crack leeched through to the outside. Now it has a ugly drip in the checkering. Only cure is a full refinish and checker.

So it depends on the job. Good stuff in the right spot.

William

[charlie cleveland]

if youre gun stock is a shooter grade stock and you shoot lots of heavy loads the super glue will help from starting new cracks and old ones from running and re opening...it works for me...charlie

[Kevin McCormack]

I would keep sucking oil from the stock until no more comes out, before I went to step two. What do the experts say about that?

I am the current expert on removing oil from stocks, and I have the cancelled checks to prove it. To wit:

I finally received the buttstock and action of my HE Fox back after it required THREE incredibly complex de-oiling and extraction procedures, each of which took weeks to completion. The exasperation of the stockmaker was near complete when he finally identified the oil he was trying to remove as none other than Sperm whale oil! Perfectly natural that it would be that given the vintage of the gun (1923). It was a common lubricant back then, and of course, in the true spirit of the American way, more was better!

The extraction solvents used ranged from denatured alcohol to acetone to MEK to aromatic C9 hydrocarbon liquids. The original intended repair of the stock to correct a very old pre-splintering glue job that of course did not hold due to the oil soak had to be completely redone after the extensive de-oiling series.

Only last weekend, yet another oil-soak related saga will result in my having to have a new ejector forend made for another beautiful graded smallbore. Those of you who have been there can feel my pain in the wallet!

I don't have any experience in using Super Glue in sealing/reinforcing stocks and/or forends, but I can tell you unequivocally the VERY first thing I would do with these 100+ year old guns is to have the actions glass bedded by someone who knows what they are doing. It will save lots of headaches later on from cracking, splitting, chipping and splintering of the wood.

This simple but detailed process involves using accurately mixed epoxy, suitable release agents, due diligence in application and curing, and above all, attention to detail. But first you have to get ALL of that oil out!

[Bruce Day]

Sperm whale oil is indeed difficult to get out and defies easy combination with solvents. Dennis Smith ( The Stockmaker) had that problem with this C. A new finish will not adhere until the old oil is out, and it will take months with sperm whale oil.

Many refinishers, professional and amateur, use a dilute solution of isocyanide glue ( Superglue) to seal the inside of a stock head. If full strength, it will be too thick and may cause fit difficulties. I don't, instead using grease, not oil, on an action. Grease better stays put without running like oil.

[Bill Holcombe]

I am actually surprised to hear that Bruce. I had never even heard of greasing a gun until I got my 1911, best baby shower gift ever, but everyone in your part of the world swore that in your area grease would gum up when it got cold. I have used rem oil on shotguns for ever and would have never considered using grease on a shotgun action....

[Bill Holcombe]

BTW, I am fairly confident mine isn't whale oil, just some stuborn oil up in the head of the stock that hasn't all come out yet.

[Kevin McCormack]

The primary drawback to using grease on an action is that it can and will trap any small particles of dirt, grit, unburnt powder and the like, effectively creating a lapping compound-like paste that if not removed can act very similar to a grinding compound on sensitive bearing surfaces and joints.

[Bruce Day]

I use Pro-Shot Pro Gold grease. Not a lot, just a little on the hinge surfaces. I wipe it off at the end of the day so that any dust does not accumulate in the grease for very long. Rag and q tip.

I have hunted at down to -6 F without gun difficulties. Me yes, the gun no. I just think oil runs, maybe if only a very small amount was used, it would be fine, but people tend to squirt oil into the action. Everybody has their way.

[Bill Holcombe]

Yes oil does have a tendency to run. Rem Oil isn't so bad. Now when I have gone hog hunting with the boys back home and they all break out their milspec gun oil for the ARs you have to spend half the hunt wiping oil off their guns as it comes out everywhere.

[Richard Flanders]

I never use grease on the inside of a gun but I'm sure there are greases that work. I use Ballistol which sticks like a very thin grease and never seems to harden up badly or run off. I hose Parker actions with it then let them drip dry before assembly. As for stocks, I use Mini-Wax wood hardener on punky inletting. It works very well. It's essentially a poor mans PEG treatment and similar to a super glue soaking. I've also used super glue to repair a lot of seriously smashed violin tops and backs and it works great. Much quicker than waiting for Tite Bond or hide glue to dry and holds very well. It's great for putting the small chips you get when you pull a tight tang or something out back in place; just put in a drop and the chip/splinter and hold it in place with a toothpick till dry. Model airplane builders use super glue on their balsa frames. Super glue comes in a variety of viscosities and I'm sure the thinner varieties would soak into a stock very well. Any supplier that supplies the jewelry industry or fossil preservation folks has super glue in bottles of at least a quart. I'll always prefer the wood hardner. It stabilizes punky wood. I've used it on violin and other stringed instrument fingerboards that had gotten punky from sweaty hands over long use. I apply it with a q-tip or small brush. I've mentioned this stuff on the forum a number of times and have never gotten any comments from anyone. Once you've tried it you'll never go back to anything else. It's a specialty product made specifically for stabilizing punky wood and is the best I've used for that. It soaks in better than super glue.

[John Dallas]

Richard - Sounds similar to "Get Rot" an epoxy product from the Gougeon Brothers in Bay City, MI. It's used to stabilize rotted areas in boats

[William Davis]

If you want to try "super glue" get it from your local Woodcraft supply store. They keep it locked up, very dangerous stuff if misused. Also better to get small bottles, No matter how hard you try it will harden up before you have used the whole bottle. It's available in different viscosity's. I keep the thin and thick on hand.

Having said all that, it's not something you want to experiment with on a nice shotgun stock. Very short working time and hard sets, nothing gets it off.

Real Glass bed job better to use slow set epoxy that can be mixed with powders to give the required viscosity. I keep two quarts of West System in my shop one fast cure. 30-60 minutes, other slow cure hours, and several different filler powders to build up any possible thickness or hardness. Some are easy sand for fairing after it sets, some are hard can be drilled and taped.

Pay particular attention to coating all metal surfaces with release agent. Good tip is to make a test puddle after glassing removing the metal when the test drop is sticky not set.

As has been said nice shotgun stock is complex fits are much more critical than a bolt action rifle. Much glass work as I have done I would not bed a Parker Shotgun Stock with Glass. Some can and do it well, not me.


William

[Bob Brown]

Richard, I use a product similar to what you use for punky wood. Its called PC-Petrifier Wood Hardener. It comes in 4 oz. bottles. It was only about $10 or $11 per bottle last time I bought it. It soaks in well and adds just a bit of a layer to affect the fit. Scraping it back to the wood leaves the adsorbed hardener below the surface. The label says they have a new heavier duty epoxy based consolidant called PC Rot Terminator, but I haven't found it or tried it. I also haven't seen the Min Wax hardener on the shelves, but if it is as good as their other products it should be high quality.