L.C. Smith Skeet Gun

[Dean Romig]

What are the things to look for in an original LCS 20 ga. skeet gun?

I think I've found one... a 1927 production with "Trap" on top of the right barrel (26") and engraved depictions of a group of shooters with a 'low house' in the background.

Can anybody confirm this and possible relative value??

[Brian Dudley]

That should be a trap gun by how you describe it.
The actual skeet guns would be marked so on the barrels and would have a bird with clay pigeon engraved on the lock plates.

I cannot comment on factory standard features.

I have had one example of each in my shop for work before. Both the trap and skeet guns had ejectors, wadsworth BTFE and vent ribs. The trap had double triggers and the skeet a hunter one. Both were regular frame guns.

[Dean Romig]

his gun defies it ever having been made as a "Trap" gun even though it is clearly stamped "TRAP" on the top of the barrel.
It has 26" open choked barrels (very little choke judging by the wall thickness at the muzzles) and is a 20 gauge.
It has a very clear depiction of a skeet shooting squad on the left lock plate.

I'll be going back to the shop today to take better pictures of it.

[Russ Jackson]

In the book " L C Smith ,The Legend Lives " ,it states on Page 254 about the barrels on a TRAP Grade ,The barrels were made by hunter Arms Co. by Sanderson Steel ,Syracuse NY. and stamped on the underside with the famous " Crown Steel " trademark . The Breech end of the barrels had a small amount of engraving adding to the attractive appearence of the gun !The Barrel was roll stamped ,Hunter Arms Co. ,M'F'R's Fulton ,NY. USA . If the small amount of engraving on the Breech end is miossing Dean ,possibly the Barrels have been cut ???? Just a Thought, Hopes this helps ! The section on Skeet Guns is too much to type ,if interested ,give me a call and I will be more than happy to read it to you ! Best ; Russ

[Dave Suponski]

Dean, Scan's of Brophy's book pages 116 and 117 Hope this helps.

[Dave Noreen]

When the new "name" grades were introduced in 1913, one of the grades was the "Trap Grade", between the "Ideal" and "Specialty" grades. What Dean is describing is a "Trap Grade" gun. According to Houchins there were 356 20-gauge "Trap Grades" produced. By the late 1920s, I'm sure L.C. Smith guns of every grade were being ordered configured as skeet guns. Hunter Arms Co. introduced a gun called the L.C. Smith Skeet Special in 1929. It had a skeet logo on the right lock plate and a bird in flight on the left with a few flourishes at the corners of the plates. The L.C. Smith Skeet Special was offered through 1944. In the last couple of years, 1949-1950, they offered a bit fancier L.C. Smith Premier Skeet Gun. These are the ones to watch out for as many unfinished guns and parts were sold off and assembled/finished by who knows who.

[Dean Romig]

I went back to the gun shop and took some better pictures of the gun. Terrible lighting in the shop... the only pictures that came out well were the ones I took with a flash.

The border engraving at the breech end of the barrels is quite apparent and the muzzles appear to be uncut.

I finally understand that the L.C. Smith Trap Model is actually the grade and not necessarily the type of shooting that gun was intended to be used for.
Also, in looking closer at the engraving on the left lock plate the shooters are shooting trap and rather than being in a squad are actually at the ready in their positions at the line and the little house in the distance is more likely the trap house.

Nonetheless, it is a very nice little twenty that would be ideal for skeet and upland birds.


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[Christopher Lien]

Researcher has covered the subject very well...

Dean, I would be taking a very hard look at the ends of those barrels again, especially on a "Trap Grade" 20ga.

With a little bit of choke, I would not be surprised to find they have been cut. Back in the day, turning long barreled tight choked guns into short barreled Skeet and open choked Grouse/Quail guns was more common than some people might think. Especially if the barrel ends had been damaged at some point... If the serial number is in the books, there is a possibility original barrel length could be confirmed.

Best, CSL
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[Dean Romig]

Thanks Chris, I understand all that about cut barrels on old guns and the reasons so many were cut

The serial number is in plain view there on the water table. Who can I ask about verifying the original barrel length?

Dean

[Christopher Lien]

Dean, Check your PM's.

CSL
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[Bill Murphy]

Jim Stubbendieck on the L.C. Smith board should give you professional courtesy and look up your number if you give him a shout. The T on the water table means "Trap Grade" and a Trap Grade 20 is a coveted gun in the condition this one seems to be. Are you sure the barrels don't have some choke? Straight grip, double triggers, what's not to like?

[Bill Murphy]

Dean, now I've sent you a PM.

[Craig Larter]

130 20ga Trap Grades were made with 26" bbls out of a total of 348, so they do exist.

[charlie cleveland]

dean you have found a purty rare little 20 ga from what i see looks to be in good condition..i would venture this little gun is in the 2500- to 2800 range...charlie