new found love for the 10 gauge short

[Milton Starr]

Well I shot my first sxs 10 ga today my bonehill hammer gun with rst 1 1/8 oz loads and it is the lightest recoiling smoothest shotgun ive ever shot. Now im looking at buying another short 10 ga this time a rem 1894 hopefully. I just wish rst would sell them 25 to a box instead 10 but im happy . I cant see why the short 10 ga isn't more popular. 1 1/8 in a 10lb gun is a baby . its ashame most people think you need a benelli to have a light kicking gun :nono:

[Pete Lester]

Congrats Milton, shooting a short ten is fun indeed. Good luck with buying that Rem '94, they are a lot of double gun for what they cost. With regards to the 10's popularity or lack of it I believe it is a combination several things and not the least of which is the scarcity and cost of factory 2 7/8" ammo. Add to that the lack of abundant reloading information, the increased complexity of reloading with hull cutting and filler wads, the heavier weight of 10ga guns on average, and the fact of the matter that it is a specialized gun that shines at ranges of 50 yards and beyond and most people just don't shoot that far and a smaller bore serves them well.

I think if you really want to get into shooting a short ten on a frequent basis you have to reload unless you have deep pockets. When I can buy my components right I can load a box of 25 for about $8.50 a box which includes hulls with an estimated life of 6 shots.

[Milton Starr]

yeah the shells are more expensive than most but it will probably take me 2 months to go through a case . I had wanted a short 10 for a good while but kept findng wall hangers in my price range. Until I ran into this bonehill. It has heavy Damascus barrels I think the original asking price was 800$ or so but he marked it down to 500$ and I bought it . the 1894 is a 1902' gun someone blued the barrels but the seller says it has shiny bores and the wood and metal is in good condition . though I found a Belgium hammer gun in good condition aswell for 300$ less but I think id like to have a hammerless gun to go with my hammergun . MY 10 ga kicks less than any 16ga or 20ga ive owned. I had a 57' Ithaca 37 16ga featherlight it was brutal to me .

[Pete Lester]

It sounds like you have caught the short ten bug to me. They are a lot of fun to shoot. They will also surprise and impress you with their long range performance with those lighter loads too.

[Milton Starr]

heres some pictures she may not look like much but it locksup tight and the bores only have light pitting in the right barrel

http://i968.photobucket.com/albums/ae165/17ms_10ga/1508595_1432805633619237_536331872_n.jpg

http://i968.photobucket.com/albums/ae165/17ms_10ga/1604576_1432805673619233_1595435628_n.jpg

http://i968.photobucket.com/albums/ae165/17ms_10ga/1599232_1433040420262425_95713317_o.jpg

[Pete Lester]

I am not up to speed on English doubles but from what I can see it looks to be a nice stout gun. What year was it built, how much does it weigh? Be careful Milton if you start having too much fun with it the next step will have you spending more money, might be a checkering refresh and or barrel refinish. :-) I would say have fun but I can tell you already are.

[Milton Starr]

I believe the model is a 1886 but I don't no a specific date . It has all matching serial numbers 36,652 I think . It weighs 10lb 2 oz not heavy to me though . 32" barrels choked full/mod . the rib says Damascus but there is no Damascus pattern whatsoever even under the forend . maybe they were polished 50+ years ago and that's why they have so much patina ?

[Milton Starr]

yeah I thought about having the action and barrels rusted blued . But id be just as happy getting the bores and chambers polished

[wayne goerres]

That damascus will come right back if it is treated properly and the frame was mostlikely case colored. I would not blue anything.If I couldnt go the expence I would just gently clean it and use it the way it is.

[Milton Starr]

yeah I actually like the patina it has built up on it .
probably just get the bores polished up .
yes it has a small spot where you can see case hardening .
a lot of c.g bonehills I see are wall hangers so im glad to have this one . If I can find a smaller gauge bonehill one day in my price range I will grab it just to have two . Ive narrowed my next short 10ga down to two guns aswell

[charlie cleveland]

milt i see you have joined the long range gun group..these old tens are sure awsome..looks like you have a nice gun to start with youre rite these old guns dont kick much with 1 1/4 ounce or less they are quite pleasant to shoot...if you decide to reload it will cut down on the price of shells..as pete pointed out youre in the rite crouwd now.... charlie

[Rich Anderson]

There's a nice Thomas Bland 10ga hammer gun with the Jones underlever on the web. I know the dealer and I'm not a big bore guy but if it was a 12 I'd have already bought it. Still thinking but reloading another guage isn't something I want to get involved with right now. Briley 12ga tubes might be an option.

[CraigThompson]

There's a nice Thomas Bland 10ga hammer gun with the Jones underlever on the web. I know the dealer and I'm not a big bore guy but if it was a 12 I'd have already bought it. Still thinking but reloading another guage isn't something I want to get involved with right now. Briley 12ga tubes might be an option.

I must be rather strange then I like the 10's , 16's and 28's the most . And would relegate the 12's and 20's to the lower shelf so to speak :whistle:

[Bill Murphy]

Rich, 12 gauge Briley tubes are not available in the 10. Most of us use chamber inserts. which allow wad sealing in 10 gauge bores and probably in 9 gauge bores.

[Milton Starr]

I buy all my guns on layaway im quite young and don't have to much of a budget . The rem 1894 was 1100$ but 60 day layaway . gunsinternational has a hammer guild gun in perfect condition for 899$ but I decided to go with a
Edwinson C. Green sxs 10 ga serial # 34xx . Ive read Edwinson C. Green was a high grade shotgun maker and he actually sold a o/u patent to purdey . it was the same price as the guild gun but figured id go with something with a reputation behind it .
don't know if the link works http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=385710206

[Milton Starr]

Charlie I plan to reload after I get my next gun paid for . Was looking at the method that only required reloading with a nail and wooden dowel . I will probably keep to the 1 1/8 oz payload as I like it .

[Milton Starr]

oh yeah briley says they only do 20ga tubes in a 10ga . I asked about 28ga tubes they said they didn't have the aluminum to make those

[charlie cleveland]

get a pair of those skeeters gage reducers i think their 40 doolars on gunbroker..i just punch in 10 ga. and they come up..you can get them in the 10 to 12 and 10 to 20..they work well enough for the money... charlie

[Milton Starr]

Charlie gaugemate Is having a closeout sale on their gold gauge adapters 50$ pair . I would probably get them in 16 ga

[charlie cleveland]

milt i will look into the gauge mate thing sounds like a bargain...as i look at the 10 ga s i don t no why but i fall in love with all of them... i would like to find one that weighs around 8 pounds if i could i ve got several heavy ones..but like i say i love m all... charlie

[Pete Lester]

Charlie gaugemate Is having a closeout sale on their gold gauge adapters 50$ pair . I would probably get them in 16 ga

Proceed with caution.

Gaugemate may be out of business. The 800 number listed for them is disconnected. Their contact us e-mail system is not working on their website. There are postings on their Facebook page by concerned customers who say they ordered before Christmas, and are complaining their credit cards being charged and no product delivered.

https://www.facebook.com/#!/GaugeMate


UPDATE. They have responded to an inquiry I made on their Facebook page.

"GaugeMate. Dear Pete, I apologize but we have been having trouble with our phone service provider. However, we are still in business in our new location, with new phone number 916-859-0882. Give us a call or email at info@gaugemate.com. Thanks!"

[Mark Ouellette]

Thanks Pete!

I called and was told that they no longer make any custom adapters. They do have 10 to 12 gauge in stock at $80 a pair.

Mark

[Milton Starr]

They may have been down for the holidays ?
I doubt ill get any though im having to much fun with the rst loads.
Charlie ive always loved the 10ga ive been shooting them since I was 17 but that was with 2 1/4 3.5" loads . Ive even fired 3oz loads from nitro ammo. very brutal I must say. if you want to shoot 3oz 10ga loads id have to say remove the trigger guard :rotf:

I have seen some 8lb 10ga sxs I think on pugs but they were costly . I have seen a 7lb double ten aswell but it wasn't for sale .

Charlie got any particular 10 ga that is what you'd would consider your dream ten ?

[charlie cleveland]

milt i do not have a dream 10 ga but if i could it would be a hammerless model with 36 inch barrels and 3 1/2 inch chambers and weigh in at about 12 1/2 lbs.my most prized 10 ga that i own is a p grade parker 10 ga with 32 inch barrels it is a hammerless model made in 1901 it was my first parker that i ever bought it has killed lots of turkeys and a few deer for me..useing gauge mates i have shot 3 inch mags and 3 1/2 inch mag 12 ga through this ten the 3 inch 12 ga does not have much recoil the 3 1/2 inch is about like the short ten load of 4 3/4 drams eqivalent and 1 5/8 ounce of lead...these big 3 frame guns are longe range guns for sure... charlie

[Milton Starr]

that P grade sounds like a great gun . My third short 10ga will be a hammerless maybe even a parkers .I got to pay for my second one first though lol. I think next time I order shells im going to go with #6 shot. I finally to squirrel hunt a little this after noon and bagged 2 greys . while I only used 1 shot per squirrel I noticed the 7.5 shot didn't really have enough "oomph"

[charlie cleveland]

you will enjoy a parker when you get one for sure...i too hunt squirls sometimes with the 10 ga ilke no 6 shot also for them..i hunt with a claybrough and brothers 10 ga made in england..its a old hammer gun i really like it..it will kill a squirl at 50 steps every time...i hand load my short 10 shells most time roll crimp the shell..pete lesters recipe for loading a short ten is the best lite load i have ever shot in the 10 ga..its 19 grains red dot powder and 1 1/8 ounce of lead..got plenty of umph but hardly any recoil..you will have to try this load of pete s... you was talking about the 3 ounce s in the 10 ga i tried this load too but its too much for the average old double barrel..i shot the 3 oz load in a ithaca mag ten recoil was purty good and the pattern was not as good as the 2 1/4 oz loads the auto is a fullchoke gun...maybe if it had been more open choked it would have patterned the bb s i was useing in those loads...as you said useing this load in a double barrel you need to take the trigger guard off... charlie

[Milton Starr]

http://i968.photobucket.com/albums/ae165/17ms_10ga/1544303_1433846506848483_1577015301_n.jpg

squirrels are really the only thing I can easily hunt around here. We have quail in our deer woods but I don't have a bird dog . Our deer land is across the road from a quail plantation I think the cross and bed down in our woods . I been feeding them milo to hopefully keep them alive . Charlie down here in south GA we have huge fox squirrels the size of house cats and a abundance of them can be found anywhere there is pine trees . I hunt in oaks though where only greys live .

my bonehill and my brothers lab duke hes only a few months old .
http://i968.photobucket.com/albums/ae165/17ms_10ga/1000012_1433846566848477_1864018892_n.jpg

Charlie I think when it comes time to buy a parkers I should look on here . though it will have to been some time after my next gun . I know I would want a hammerless model any grade 32" tubes under 1500$

[charlie cleveland]

join the parker asociation then you can look at the 4 sale section theres been several nice ten ga s that have been listed and sold in the past for under 1500.. nice bonehill you got there and a good lookin pup tp..by the way we have a few fox squirls but i seldom see one..thats some nice lookin woods to hunt you got pictured.... charlie

[wayne goerres]

Look at that. That gun scared that squirl to death.

[Milton Starr]

thanks Charlie , and yeah I plan on joining the pga so I can use the for sale section. I havnt been seing any hammerless 10 ga parkers on any of the gun selling websites . Now I do see a nice parker hammer 10 ga for sale but its 1800$ so alittle above my price range the seller says its a L1 ? 1 of 919 made .
I mostly look for field guns that I can hunt with though . I was confirmed today as the winning bidding on the EC Green double 10 ga today Charlie :p

Charlie down here its mostly pines but those woods are oak tree woods , South Ga is a beautiful place to live . Its funny when you go into a mom and pop stores and they want to sell you pictures of the scenery where you live and you have to tell them your not a tourist :rotf:

[Frank Srebro]

Ithaca NID Super 10 at work two weeks ago in upstate NY. Weight just a little short of 9 pounds with 32-inch tubes. I usually shoot Nice for long range work but these birds were decoyed and lighter loads of bismuth 2's and 4's worked just fine.

decoy spread at dawn
http://i1044.photobucket.com/albums/b450/silvers897/IMG_4164-1_zps4b6502d7.jpg (http://s1044.photobucket.com/user/silvers897/media/IMG_4164-1_zps4b6502d7.jpg.html)


http://i1044.photobucket.com/albums/b450/silvers897/IMG_4175-1_zps44d34143.jpg (http://s1044.photobucket.com/user/silvers897/media/IMG_4175-1_zps44d34143.jpg.html)

[scott kittredge]

Frank, tell us about your NID,year,lop,dah,choke. I have a grade 2 ,32 in. str. gripped ejector gun that Brian D brought back to life for me. have shot a few crows with it and a round of trap (24) but no waterfowl as of yet. gun shoots great. thanks scott

[Frank Srebro]

Scott, I really like these NID Super 10's and have several of them. As you know they're often confused with the earlier Flues model, and with the later Ithaca Double Magnum which is just too heavy/ponderous for me. Super 10's will weigh 8-1/2 to about 9 pounds and were chambered for the new high velocity progressive 2-7/8" shells. This one was made in 1928 and is the so-called Star Model. Weight 8^15, chokes 44 and 44 points, LOP 14-1/4" and dah 2-5/8" (a little higher than typical).

I usually shoot heavy loads for long range hunting, on par with the original 4-3/4 DE & 1-5/8 ounce loads. Sorry, I won't give any recipes here or by PM. These Super 10's are fantastic long range guns. I've used mine for waterfowl, turkeys, called foxes in the winter, and at targets with 1-1/8 and 1-1/4 ounce loads. The problem is finding good honest guns and without mods like chambers lengthened for magnum 3-1/2" shells

Frank

[Rick Losey]

Ithaca NID Super 10 at work two weeks ago in upstate NY. Weight just a little short of 9 pounds with 32-inch tubes. I usually shoot Nice for long range work but these birds were decoyed and lighter loads of bismuth 2's and 4's worked just fine.


Frank, Nice home coming trip for an Ithaca.

Glad to see we still have birds someplace. They disappeared from the fields around here the September day I put my 10 gauge Clabrough back together. :corn:

The Current season ends tomorrow here (on Thursday a few towns south). Oh well - there is always the March season. And at least one of the Parker 10's will be ready next fall.

[Bill Murphy]

When my former employer's shop had a relationship with Steve Lamboy and ICD guns were coming in on special order on a regular basis, I decided to order a Super Ten, which was in the prototype stages. I talked to Steve at Millbrook when he had the prototype ready for inspection. He had not built the barrels, used real Ithaca barrels, but the rest of the gun was new production and beautiful. My order, which was never completed, was a Grade 4 lightweight, just under 8 pounds, 28" lightly choked bird barrels, straight grip and splinter forend. I can't recall the other specifics, but I still have a copy of the order around here somewhere. It was quite a disappointment when Steve closed up shop before the Supers were built.

[Frank Srebro]

http://i1044.photobucket.com/albums/b450/silvers897/01-1_zps96117f7d.jpg (http://s1044.photobucket.com/user/silvers897/media/01-1_zps96117f7d.jpg.html)

Thanks everyone for your comments. The NID Super 10 described by Bill sounds like a duplicate of the one ordered by Capt Paul Curtis in about 1930. Curtis wrote that it came in at 8-1/4 pounds with 28" tubes. But Ithaca also sent a set of heavier 32" bbls gratis ... probably a statement by the factory folks. The gun weighed 9 pounds with the second set. For those interested, here's a link with more details on the hunt two weeks ago.

http://foxcollectors.com/My%20Forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=5129

[Bill Murphy]

At the time I was writing the order for Lamboy, I hadn't seen the Paul Curtis description. It was some years later that I discovered the Curtis order in some research material. Today, I would order the gun with 30" barrels and still under 8 pounds. I liked 28" because it was different for an NID ten. I have had plenty of light tens, even short barreled ones, but Steve was doing such a good job with the ICD that I just had to have one. I remember telling Steve that I would see him at Vegas in a couple of days in one of the late Januarys of the project. As an ICD dealer, my employer and Steve spoke on a fairly regular basis. When I went through the front door of the "Shiny Gun" room at the Riviera, Steve was on my left, holding court with "Magnum, PI" with an order sheet in his hands. The tables were decorated with late production Exhibition ICDs. There was hardly a Grade 4 or 5 to be seen. Today, I have no ICD guns, and I'm down to one high condition NID Mag Ten. I'm always on the prowl for a nice Super, but apparently, Frank has them sewed up.

[Milton Starr]

Didn't some nid have 3 1/2" chambers ?

[Frank Srebro]

No ..... at least I've never seen a righteous Super 10 chambered for 3-1/2". The Ithaca Double Magnum was developed for magnum 3-1/2" 10-gauge shells. They will have a serial no > 500,000 and weigh 11 pounds or so. NID Super 10's are numbered in the 400,000's and will have 2-7/8" chambers.

[Milton Starr]

ok thanks for the clarification , I don't know much about ithacas doubles .
I think the double magnum is what sxs ive seen online. pugs has one but its 6,000$ . Ive owned modern 10 ga 3.5" guns . I much prefer the 2 7/8" chambering

[Rich Anderson]

Steve Lamboy had a great product with the ICD it's to bad these never took off. A nice 4E or 5E in say 20 but preferably 28 with a straight stock, splinter forarm, 28 inch barrels chocked Ic and a very light mod would be just the ticket in the Grouse/Woodcock coverts.