Receiver variation question

[David Noble]

I was looking at Ron Scores album and ran across these images of the receiver of his GH(?) grade 12ga on a 1/2 frame. Interesting gun, what with the extra engraving and checkering. But that is not what caught my attention. Observe in the picture the slots cut in the joint end of the receiver, and the pins that are on each side near the pivot pin. I have seen this before but I don't understand why this feature was used. Any help?

[Channing Will]

If I had to guess I would say the frame has been machined for an ejector mechanism.

Maybe modified for the patented ejector mechanism below?
http://i806.photobucket.com/albums/yy350/CMWill_DG1/US717486-1.png

[Brian Dudley]

Some engraving on that frame!

Looks to be an aftermarket ejector system. The slots would be for trips sticking out from the forend and the pins would be what trips them.

Deffinately an addition to an extractor gun since this frame has an extractor style roll joint in it.

I believe I have seen other guns with aftermarket ejectors that utilize pins just in from of the roll joint pin. But I do not know of what type they are.

[Dave Noreen]

Here are pictures the late Dr. Gaddy sent me of a Parker he owned with Moran & Wolfersperger ejectors --

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v316/Ansleyone/Parker/MoreMWEjectorsinGH73542.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v316/Ansleyone/Parker/MWEjectorsonGHParker73542.jpg

Something is amiss in the original post. That certainly isn't a GH-grade pictured and Moran & Wolfersperger were 30 years gone when the 1/2 frames appeared.

[Channing Will]

I just browsed through Ron's album and noticed the forend iron is a standard non-ejector iron but appears to be cyanide case colored. The barrels also appear to be newer barrels with Parker Overload Proofs. The serial number puts it at 1896 production so my guess is it went to have ejector fitted by Moran & Wolfersperger at some point in its life and then later went back to Parker for new barrels. Parker probably said we dont fit new barrels to non-factory added ejector systems so they replaced the forend iron as well.

[David Noble]

Something is amiss in the original post. That certainly isn't a GH-grade pictured and Moran & Wolfersperger were 30 years gone when the 1/2 frames appeared.

Hey, I don't just make this stuff up! :rotf:

Here is a picture of the water table of 84025. It has a "G" and a "2".
http://parkerguns.org/forums/album.php?albumid=276&pictureid=2868

Note also the Fleur de Lis points on the stock are just line engraved in the wood and the "A" or "B" style checking does'nt look to be factory. No mullered borders.
http://parkerguns.org/forums/album.php?albumid=276&pictureid=2891

I agree with DoubleOframe that the barrels were supplied as non ejector for the reason he states. I'm sure the receiver is a
"1" size due to its dimensions and date of manufacture. Remington just used "1/2" frame size replacement barrels to fit to the gun.

Still this is a very unique gun that I wish were mine.

Here is the link to Ron's album of this fine gun.
http://parkerguns.org/forums/album.php?albumid=276

[greg conomos]

There has to be a story behind that 'G'. Either it began life as a G and was reincarnated as something higher before it left the factory, or it was the personal gun of one of the engravers, or .......

[Dean Romig]

If it is an 1896 gun it certainly can't be a 1/2-frame.

I believe the 1-frame and the 1/2-frame guns share the same firing pin spacing and my guess is that the gun is a 1-frame.

[Dave Noreen]

Dave,

I'm sure you don't!!

Hey, I don't just make this stuff up!



I made my comments before I went back and looked at all of the Ron Scores pictures of 84025. Very interesting gun. Obviousdly has had a long and varied life. Reminds me a bit of the BH(E) 20-gauge, 84040 that was passed around the Spokane Gun Club not too long ago.

Dave

[David Noble]

Dave,

Very interesting gun. Obviousdly has had a long and varied life. Reminds me a bit of the BH(E) 20-gauge, 84040 that was passed around the Spokane Gun Club not too long ago.

Dave

Yes! I was thinking the same thing! By the way, I'm the current caretaker of 84040 .

David

[David Noble]

Here's a DH(E) serial 149011 in my care that has non-factory ejectors. These work the opposit of Parker. The trip pins extend out from the joint face when the hammers are down. Parker pins snap in when the hammers are down.

Odd thing about this gun is that the Serialization book shows it as having factory ejectors. This is a two barrel set, so possibly the code was entered wrong. I haven't ordered a letter on this gun yet (although I've had it for over thirty years) but I do have the hang tags.

[Channing Will]

David does your forend iron have a pin going through the curve? How are the actual ejector blades held in place? Is there a stop screw in the middle of the barrel lugs like an extractor gun has? It doesnt look there is a typical stop plate on the dolls head but somebody went to the trouble of slotting it for Parker style ejector blades. Makes me think whoever fit the ejectors used factory ejector blades rather then making their own. I cant really tell from the photos but it reminds me of Charles King's patent.

[greg conomos]

I really love extractors....!

[David Noble]

DoubleO, you are correct, there is no stop plate in the dolls head. It does use the standard screw between the lugs to secure and stop the ejector blades.
I will try to get some pictures of the ejector mechanism in the forend iron tonight.
Here is a shot of the barrel flats for each set. Notice that one is stamped with a "5" and the other a "7" where the grade marking usually resides.

[Dean Romig]

The Grade-7 barrels were likely fit to the gun after original production. An extra set of barrels when new would have been marked with the same grade as the gun and barrel set #1. Sometimes a lower grade set would have been used for the second set but it is highly unlikely that barrels intended for a higher grade would have been applied to the gun.

[David Noble]

Edit: Dean, thanks for your reply. You posted it while I was typing this one.

Well....upon closer inspection of the forend irons and ejector mechanism, I've found remnants of another serial number. 85314 . This number is stamped plainly on the underside of the forend latches and partially visible on the irons.
There is the remnant of that number on the lug of one barrel, partially obscured by the current serial number 149011, and the last three digits 314 is found on the rear lug along with the last three of 011, on both barrel sets.
According to the Serialization book, 85314 was indeed a grade 7 gun, but had Whitworth steel barrels, yet both sets of barrels have Titanic Steel marked ribs.
Both barrel sets mate perfectly to this receiver and I have hang tags for both sets that I fully believe are authentic Parker tags.

So now I have a new question. Did Parker recycle barrels? If not, where are the original barrels and who would have used grade 5 and 7 barrels on a grade 3 gun?
I've taken photos and will post them shortly.

[Dean Romig]

Yes, there is a great deal of evidence that Parker Bros. recycled barrels as well as other parts.
Whitworth barrels would have had the Whitworth stamp, a bundled wheat sheave, stamped on the underside of each barrel in the area of the very forward edge of the barrel flats. Whitworth also stamped their consecutive serial numbers on the barrel flats, again at the forward section of the flats.... Is there any evidence remaining of these stamps?

[David Noble]

There is no evidence of the Whitworth stamp or tube numbers.
The forend latches are definitely higher grade than D considering the engraving. I wonder what happened to AAH 85314.
I guess this is a mystery that will never be solved.

Here are some pics of the various pieces and the ejector mechanism.

[Dean Romig]

That is the most well-documented use, by the factory, of orphaned Parker parts I have ever seen. Would really like to know the complete history of both of these guns. Just amazing!!