W&C Scott 8 Gauge

[Bill Murphy]

I didn't reread the entire thread, but "This is a pigeon gun". I will wait for further comment.

[ArtS]

Originally Posted by Bill Murphy

I didn't reread the entire thread, but "This is a pigeon gun". I will wait for further comment.

That's the first mention I have heard of a Pigeon gun. I have never run across mention of such a model in the catalog reprints I have access to. In fact, I found no listing for any high grade single barrels. From the address on the barrel, this is one of the two high grades they made at the time. It is true it has no safety, but being a single I don't know if that would be an indicator. It was my belief that all pigeon shoots at that time used a two shot rule to down the birds, precluding a single. I that was not the case, it may well be. I would be puzzled by the cylinder bore barrel however. From the condition of the gun,measurements and examination of the bore, I believe it was made this way.

I still believe it was sold as an all around gun someone in the northeast US could use for small game, decoyed water fowl and deer or bear with ball or buck. The chambering/choke would be amenable to all of these.

[Bill Murphy]

Two shot Hurlingham rules came later than the big bore pigeon gun era. The big bore era started in the UK during the percussion period. The latest Holt's auction has several guns from the big bore era. I think choke was not heard of at that time. Holt's does a good job of identifying a "pigeon gun" versus regular sporting guns.

[ArtS]

Originally Posted by Bill Murphy

Two shot Hurlingham rules came later than the big bore pigeon gun era. The big bore era started in the UK during the percussion period. The latest Holt's auction has several guns from the big bore era. I think choke was not heard of at that time. Holt's does a good job of identifying a "pigeon gun" versus regular sporting guns.

Good information. I didn't know about the timing of the rule change. Just in the last 2 days, I took another look at the catalog from 1872, then at the book (can't remember the author; don't have it with me) that is a history of W&C Scott. Pertinent facts from combining both sources, some of which I remembered, were that:

1)Scott, while they would build whatever you wanted, only listed three qualities of guns, designated A, B, and C in 1872. The Premier designation for top grade and special guns was introduced a few years later. A and B quality guns were the only ones that carried the full London Castle Rd. address. The more common guns were labeled just London. I am inclined to believe by the engraving, wood and rib address that this is a B quality gun,

2)Scott recognized 5 classes of shotguns. Basically Upland, Light Upland, Pigeon, Waterfowl and Light Waterfowl. I am sure they always built guns for these purposes, but the actual designations according to the history were implemented in 1876, I believe. Technically, there were no designations at the time the gun was sold. Collectors often classify guns on a retroactive basis, even though they didn't exist at the time of manufacture. Sort of like the use of the Daly Empire and Superior tags applied to guns made decades before the designation was implemented by the company.

3)Most telling, I was showing the gun to a visitor last night and took a closer look at the engraving. I used a good light and magnifier and examined it carefully. I noticed that the only engraving on the gun was floral style engraving, except for a small figure under the hammer pivot on the lock plate, It turned out to be a well executed figure of some sort of retriever coming out of the water carrying a duck dangling from it's mouth. Careful reveals that the duck even has a ring around it's throat.

To me, that was the tipping point. It can't be a coinsident that the only non-floral piece would be a retriever with a duck instead of a pigeon in flight or something similar. I am going with a light waterfowl style of gun. This would make sense for a gun sold along the seashore of New England where waterfowl hunting over decoys was a major sport.

Of course, that's just my guess.

None of this explains the fact of a single barrel style mentioned neither in the company full catalog from the year of manufacture nor the history book of the Make.