410 O Frame?

[Dean Romig]

Relative, being the key word, 1/64” is one sixty-fourth of an inch and that is a measurable difference, all things considered. I will have to get out the measuring stick I used when I had Tom’s gun here and put a dial caliper to it.

And I’ll dig out Austin’s records on the one had and see exactly what he measured.

Golly, but you make me work awful hard Edgar....





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[Dean Romig]

I have done more research on two of the AAHE small bore two-barrel sets I mentioned previously and it turns out that I misremembered the details of one of them. That one was made as a 28/26” and 28/28” so, being strictly a 28 gauge and ordered to a specific weight, it was made on the 00-frame and the lugs are marked as such.

The other was made in 1908 as a 20 gauge with an additional set of 28 gauge barrels and being made this early it was most assuredly made on the 9-frame size - that and that there are very likely no 20 gauge Parkers originally made on the 00-frame.

I needed to explain this because I left my post with an unanswered question.





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[Bill Murphy]

Scott J., I wonder who owns that 00 frame .410 today? I would like a second shot at it. It stayed on the market for quite awhile before disappearing.

[Dean Romig]

Bill, are you referring to the .410 prototype?





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[edgarspencer]

Originally Posted by Dean Romig

Relative, being the key word, 1/64” is one sixty-fourth of an inch .

Thank you for explaining that, for those of us who know our fractions, but may not know how to spell the numbers

Originally Posted by Dean Romig

I’ll dig out Austin’s records on the one had and see exactly what he measured.

Golly, but you make me work awful hard Edgar....

You don't need to dig anything out. The gun is no longer in Austin's estate, but owned by another collector, and we've gotten lots of measurements from it.

[Dean Romig]

Originally Posted by edgarspencer

You don't need to dig anything out. The gun is no longer in Austin's estate, but owned by another collector, and we've gotten lots of measurements from it.

I know that Edgar, and what was the precise measurement he determined between the firing pin holes center to center?





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[TxHuntermn]

Originally Posted by Dean Romig

Mark..... the only correct way to determine frame size is the exact distance between firing pin holes, center to center.

1-5/8” is off the charts. A 7-frame is 1-7/16”

But I think your measurement is the width of the stock head. But this is not the way to determine frame size.





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I think I just misstated what I am trying to discover. Based upon the chart attached from the serialization book, it would appear, that all other things being equal, the head of stocks from O,OO, and 1/2 frame guns would, should be interchangeable.

[edgarspencer]

Dean, we have discussed this over and over, both on the phone and here. You know the center to center dimension of the early SMALL framed hammer 20s was 29/32", 1/32" smaller than the finally adopted 00 frame, or 1/64" Difference between the actual firing pin of a true 00 framed gun, and the center of the chamber of the early SMALL frame 20s. However, what matters equally is that the width across the bolsters is the same, as is the height of the breech face, from water table to top of bolster.

I typed SMALL all in capitols, because the first several 20 gauge guns were a mix of 1 frame, and the frame eventually adopted as 00 in hammerless guns.
In making many of these early 20ga. guns with such a small frame, Parker Brothers must have had a very good reason, however, it's anyone's guess what it was.

[Dean Romig]

Originally Posted by Mark Ray

I think I just misstated what I am trying to discover. Based upon the chart attached from the serialization book, it would appear, that all other things being equal, the head of stocks from O,OO, and 1/2 frame guns would, should be interchangeable.

Right Mark. 1 5/8" = 1.625"

I have a 16 gauge on the 0-frame that measures exactly 1.641" so, they're not exact apparently.




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[Bill Murphy]

It does not appear to me that the width of the action (wood) is mentioned in the chart. The wood may be 1 5/8" on the three smaller sizes, but the chart doesn't show it. Dean, no, the 00 frame .410 Scott and I discussed is not a prototype, nor do I believe it is unique. I just know I would like to own it, and will know it when I see it.