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Tom Leshinsky
PGCA Member
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Posted: Thu May 28th, 2009 09:53 pm |
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| I have a 10 ga Parker lifter with ( for want of a better description) circles cut into the breech face where the base of the shell goes. What is the reason for this? I have never seen it in a parker before. They are not from wear but are actually cut into the face.
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Dave Suponski
PGCA Member
| Joined: | Thu Jan 6th, 2005 |
| Location: | Connecticut USA |
| Posts: | 1027 |
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Posted: Thu May 28th, 2009 10:32 pm |
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| Tom, I think there was an article in the old(first edition) Parker Pages on the rebated breech face hammerguns. I will try to source out the issue tonight for ya.
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Dave....
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Derrick Stewart
PGCA Member
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Posted: Thu May 28th, 2009 10:32 pm |
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Tom,
If I understand you correctly the reason this has been machined is due to the gun not being able to close with a paticullar type of shell. A friend of mine has an AE grade Fox and in the left barrel the only shell that you can use is a Remington STS, anything else hits the face of the reciever. Richard Flanders had a 10 ga (if my memory serves me correct, and not a Parker) were he purchased a tool to remedy this problem.
Other's im sure will chime in too.
Derrick
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Dave Suponski
PGCA Member
| Joined: | Thu Jan 6th, 2005 |
| Location: | Connecticut USA |
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Posted: Fri May 29th, 2009 01:24 am |
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| Tom,Volume 11 Issue 1 has some photos of rebated breech guns. Last edited on Fri May 29th, 2009 01:24 am by Dave Suponski
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Dave....
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Dean Romig
PGCA Member
| Joined: | Fri Jan 7th, 2005 |
| Location: | Andover, Ma |
| Posts: | 4887 |
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Posted: Fri May 29th, 2009 02:04 am |
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I have read that this was done to relieve gas expansion . . . for whatever reason. I don't understand it at all, being that expanding gases are contained within the cartridge and likely don't appreciably escape toward the breech. I have seen one example where a groove is machined outward from the circle to the edge of the breech balls.
Dave, what page(s) are those pictures on?
Last edited on Fri May 29th, 2009 02:06 am by Dean Romig
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Tom Leshinsky
PGCA Member
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Posted: Fri May 29th, 2009 02:29 am |
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| why did they put it on someguns and not others? I thought it may be for guns using brass shells, but I don't know. It's not a very early gun the ser# is 11864 which puts it around 1887. its on a #3 frame, and weighs 9 lbs 7oz. What else is strange is the cut tapers it is very shallow at the top and deeper at the bottom.
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Richard Flanders
PGCA Member
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Posted: Fri May 29th, 2009 11:19 am |
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I have two shotguns, a DH12 and a vintage JD Dougall 12ga, that do not like AA hulls due to them having inconsistent diameter and out of round extractor rims. Either will shoot STS hulls or any OLD paper hulls just fine. I bought a rim recess reamer from Clymer in Michigan as a remedy. I didn't and won't ream the DH12 because the breech end of the bbls is not perfectly perpendicular to the bore and the reamer does not touch the bbl end all the way around when you put it in. The Dougall had the same problem but since it has thin bbls and needs sleeving, I did it anyway, but the reamed recess is not perfectly consistent all the way around. It does shoot AA's fine now however, but the headspace is a bit excessive. Fortunately the firing pins are long enough that it works fine. The reamer is very nice. If someone wants to try reaming their 12ga recesses and can pay postage, I'd be glad to send it out for the experiment. You can't just drop it in and start reaming though. I would ream the DH12 if I could figure out a way to get it into the chamber just a tad crooked so that it would ream the recess evenly. For now, I just don't shoot AA hulls in it. I REALLY hate to ream something like that just because Winchester can't make good hulls. Just doesn't seem right.
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Bill Murphy
PGCA Member
| Joined: | Mon Jan 10th, 2005 |
| Location: | Maryland USA |
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Posted: Fri May 29th, 2009 01:33 pm |
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| Richard, if the Clymer reamer is properly piloted, you want the cutter to go in the way the pilot forces it to go in because the shell is also a "pilot". Of course, I would just avoid the bad shells.
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Richard Flanders
PGCA Member
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Posted: Fri May 29th, 2009 01:56 pm |
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That would work IF the breech ends were perfectly orthogonal to the bore axis, which they seem to not be. You stick the reamer in and it hits around one edge but not on the opposite side. If you ream the recess enough to ream the entire thing, the shell headspace will not be equal around the rim diameter; the shell will sit a tad deeper around the portion where the reamer first hit. All I can figure is that a shell put into a chamber is not exactly lined up with the bore axis. Either that or my reamer is not cut quite right. Maybe I'll chuck it into my lathe and just turn it slowly by hand and index the cutting edge to a cutting bit in the tool holder to see if it hits evenly all around. Who knows..... **it does seem to happen sometimes. Assuming that Clymer is still in business, the reamer being the problem would certainly make the issue easier to resolve.....
Last edited on Fri May 29th, 2009 02:01 pm by Richard Flanders
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Larry Frey
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Posted: Fri May 29th, 2009 02:41 pm |
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Richard I think Bill is right you want the recess cut perpendicular to the bores which the reamer should provide. If the breech end of the barrels is not perpendicular it shouldn’t matter as long as it's not excessive.
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Richard Flanders
PGCA Member
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Posted: Sat May 30th, 2009 05:11 pm |
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Your'e right Larry. That is pretty obvious, but that is not possible with the reamer I received from Clymer. No one who was standing by my side watching as I put that reamer into a chamber on my DH12 would dream of actually reaming the chamber. It just looks too wrong. The breech ends seem to not be perpendicular to the bore and it is excessive. I'm going to check the reamer.
Last edited on Sat May 30th, 2009 05:12 pm by Richard Flanders
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