Tell Tale Signs of a Re-Stock

[Southpaw]

Reggie,

Don't sell yourself too short. I'll bet you are way ahead of the game. Just keep your head on a swivel and look for reasonableness in the gun and the info. The story will reveal itself and that is part of the fun and adventure of these old guns, at least it is for me.

Family has an old black powder hammer rifle that hung over my grandfathers fireplace for 40 years. He collected and restored antiques but knew little about guns. My dad liked old guns and turns out the gun over the fireplace was made by a guy named Ogden out of New York. Dad likes shotguns and inherited gun and just put it back in the gun safe. Started doing some research the other day 20 years after grandfather died and found an identical gun that is housed in the Jim Bridger museum that was gun given to him and it was made by Ogden. Only difference is our gun is a 50 caliber. Remember as a kid wondering about that gun and what it used for and who owned it, what was its story. Most guns storied pasts are as fleeting as burning gun powder. Some get immortalized like Bo Whoop. http://museumofthemountainman.com/jim-bridgers-rifle/

Fun stuff. Enjoy the journey.

[King Cobb]

Originally Posted by Robin Lewis

Is that ethical? I think making something to the same standards is a goal to strive to but to make it 'appear' original isn't. JMHO

I had an old peeling python reblued one time and intentionally asked the smith to Blue the hammer in hopes of avoiding someone down the road trying to pass it off as original.

However, I have had conversations with gentlemen(not certain that truly applies) who spend large amounts of money restoring a firearm to like new condition. In their opinion on the matter, if they do a restoration the point is to have the gun returned to original like new condition including restoring original markings or serial numbers. In their opinion with the level of work and money put into the gun, they consider it to be restored to stock new condition. When I asked them if it was ethical to present a restored gun as a like new gun, their basic response was if you cannot tell a gun is restored in their opinion it is original.

I don't personally agree with their logic, and have never been willing to trade guns with them, for both originality concerns and pricing issues, but that is what they firmly believe.

[Dean Romig]

Originally Posted by Reggie Bishop

I guess for those of us who are late into the game we aren't going to get all the years experience examining nice original guns to acquire the skill needed to ID some things.

Yes you will, but it doesn't come overnight. And many of the old-timers who can recognize these nuances have paid their dues in mistakes made during the learning curve.





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[Bindlestiff]

I apologize Reggie for my post derailing the focus of this thread. The would like to ask the current direction of comment made here should be directed to a new thread, if anyone so desires to start one up.

It's good to get views on restored Parker's discussed but it's not helping to answer the question on what to look for that may determine wood replacement. On that topic, my only red flag (assuming high quality workmanship) would be if the wood quality or type doesn't match what I would expect to find on a particular grade. Many times replacement wood exceeds the quality of the grade because it's a replacement (repair or upgrade) and not a 'restoration'.

[Dean Romig]

To Robin's post I would add, If you have a particular gun in mind and don't mind a wide variety of opinions, why not post up some pictures?





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[Reggie B]

I will try to do that. The gun in question is a 20 gauge VHE that has been with the last owner about 14 years and he has a letter from the family that he got the gun from documenting that it was originally bought in NC and was in their family since new until the 2nd owner bought it. They stated that the gun was stored away in a closet for years and years after the original buyer passed away in a car accident. The PGCA letter documents the 26" barrel length and the capped pistol grip stock. The LOP agrees with the letter. The case colors are gone and the barrel blue is thinning in spots. It obviously has been well cared for but enjoyed.

What is unusual is the forearm and buttstock are in very good condition. Thea forearm looks correct and has no handling marks and very little wear. The buttstock has no scratches or handling marks and the checkering is strong. The buttplate has the spur and it does show some wear at the heel that would come from shouldering the gun. I just don't see how the wood could be so nice and the case colors gone and blue thinning. Unless maybe it was used 100% on skeet or something. I guess the checkering is why I am doubting its original. There is no wear on the checkering. The original Parkers I own also have strong checkering but they also have most of their blue and a lot of color too. Bores are bright and shiny.

I will remove the trigger guard once I get a chance.

[Reggie B]

OK I lifted the trigger guard and found an "O" indicating the grade. In a smaller size stamp is a serial number, but it has degraded to the point I can't be sure what the numbers are. I am pretty sure the first digit is correct and maybe a couple others but its not clearly determinable. The serial number is stamped with very small numbers. Would this be typical for an early 20s gun? Pics coming tomorrow.

UPDATE- pulled out the big magnifying glass. The numbers are correct! So as far as I am concerned the stock is original. This is fun stuff!

[Southpaw]

That's cool. Thanks for sharing. I think its even better that you know something about its history. Hope everything else your concerned with checks out and you make can make a deal. Case coloring can wear off pretty easily with even moderate use so told and I think UVs from sunlight can work on it. Maybe for years it was stored in the open gun case exposed to sunlight by original user. He might of really babied the wood as well.

[Reggie B]

[Dean Romig]

Hi Reggie, thanks for those nice pictures.

Your stock looks to be original but has been completely refinished with recut checkering. Nicely done too. But the mullered border must have been beyond the capabilities of the person who did the work. The butt plate does show a bit of wear, as you say, from shouldering.





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