Early 3 1/2" Ten Factory Original

Bill Murphy · 11-13-2014, 09:19 AM

Chuck is doing a letter for me on a 1903 NH Grade ten gauge #6 frame Parker that was factory ordered with 3 1/2" chambers. Dave Noreen has provided information that Western Cartridge first introducted the modern mag ten ammunition in 1932. I realize that extra long empty shells were available for handloaders way back into the 1800's, but this will be the first Parker order I have seen for a 3 1/2" ten gauge. I have another #6 frame ten gauge with 3 1/2" chambers, but I have no provenance on its originality. That one was rebarrelled in Vulcan Steel from an eight gauge gun. Maybe Dave or someone else has some information about 3 1/2" ten gauge ammunition in the era of my gun, 1903.

charlie cleveland · 11-13-2014, 10:02 AM

bill this sure is a interesting gun you have found i hope somethings turns up for you on this gun. i m sure the fellow who ordered this gun with these long chambers was shooting heavier loads than the factory was loading in the 2 7/8 shells..i convinced myself that some foks were shooting handloaded shells that were close to magnum standards of today..i have a 3 frame eh gun with those 7 lbs 10ounce barrels that are 3 1/2 chambers but do not know if it was factory long chambers...good luck on the hunt for answers on this gun...charlie

Researcher · 11-13-2014, 11:13 AM

Are you sure the gun is chambered for 3 1/2 inch shells? The longest 10-gauge NPEs I've found offered back in those days was 3 1/4 inch, but most were not offered over 3-inch. In 1901 the UMC EXPERT NPE for bulk smokeless powder was offered up to 3 1/4 inch in 10-gauge --

and the UMC UNION NPE for black powder --

As were their BEST quality brass shells --

By 1910 none of the 10-gauge NPEs for smokeless powders were offered longer than 2 7/8 inch, with only the paper and brass NPEs for black powder offered in the 3 and 3 1/4 inch lengths.

Bill Murphy · 11-13-2014, 11:50 AM

Dave, the order specifies 3 1/2" chambers. Charlie, do you have a letter on your big gun yet? My Vulcan Steel ten has wall thickness no thinner then .100. If my new gun has .100 wall thickness, I will be shooting modern 3 1/2" mag ten lead shells in it. The bores are shiny, so I will measure to see if the thickness is there. The barrels are marked 8-1 if I recall.

charlie cleveland · 11-13-2014, 08:46 PM

i have no letter on this gun it seems every gun i trade for the books are lost on them... i have measured them they are 3 1/2 and are at least as your gun as thick as .100 this gun could go to 8 ga if bored..i have already shot several modern 3 1/2 inch shells thru this gun and it is marked twist barrels that are 30 inches.iut has the little wiggly line across the end of the barrels i assume never cut.serial number is 69388 it is a ph modeltop lever opening gun.i wish they had a book for this gun..hope you find your answers... charlie

charlie cleveland · 11-13-2014, 09:36 PM

i look thru all my info on early shells and only shell in paper i found were the 3 1/4 inch but i have seen brass shells of before the 1900 s in 3 1/2 inch lentgh..maybe somebody was useing brass hulls in these old guns. maybe somebody was useing some of them old 6 inch length 10 ga paper hulls i see from time to time and were cutting them down to 3 1/2 inch length. charlie

Bill Murphy · 11-14-2014, 09:16 AM

Charlie, there is information on your gun in the PGCA records, probably the order book entry. You should request a letter on your interesting gun.

charlie cleveland · 11-14-2014, 09:53 AM

thanks bill will request for a letter.thank you. charlie

C.O.B. · 11-14-2014, 02:34 PM

Bill what is the barrel length on that beast 34 or maybe 36? I know of a 36 inch 10ga but have no idea of the chamber length. The owner uses it for sporting clays

Bill Murphy · 11-15-2014, 08:51 AM

It's just a standard little 13 pound 32" gun. My #6 frame Vulcan Steel ten is a 34" gun.