Reloading vintage paper 10 ga hulls ?

[Milton C Starr]

These are the hulls I mentioned
https://simpsonltd.com/winchester-10...er-shotshells/

It says the New No 4 was for loads not execding 3 1/2 drams but that seems wrong for the 10 ga 2 7/8 . All the vintage boxes ive seen list the dram equiv for it between 4-5 drams .

[Researcher]

While I don't have a good supply of early Winchester paper, I do have access to plenty of Union Metallic Cartridge Co. paper. In the UMC 1900 catalog, the heaviest 10-gauge load they offered in their low brass NITRO CLUB shell (their equal to the Winchester REPEATER) was 3 1/2 drams of bulk smokeless powder or the equivalent in dense smokeless powder pushing 1 1/4 ounce of shot. 1901 to 1909 the same. By the 1905 UMC catalog the max load offered in their high brass ARROW shell was 4 drams of bulk smokeless powder pushing 1 1/4 ounce of shot, and by 1906 it was up to 4 1/4 drams of bulk smokeless powder.

The 4 1/4 drams of bulk smokeless powder, or the equivalent in dense smokeless powder, pushing 1 1/4 ounce of shot was the heaviest 10-gauge loads our North American ammunition companies offered until the progressive burning powder, high velocity, loads with 1 5/8 ounce of shot came out circa 1925-6.

[6pt-Sika]

Originally Posted by Milton C Starr

These are the hulls I mentioned
https://simpsonltd.com/winchester-10...er-shotshells/

It says the New No 4 was for loads not execding 3 1/2 drams but that seems wrong for the 10 ga 2 7/8 . All the vintage boxes ive seen list the dram equiv for it between 4-5 drams .

There was a time I’d liked to have had a full
Box of WIN 10 gauge Repeaters to go with the full boxes of Repeaters I had in 12 , 20 and 28 gauge . But I’ve sold them so that’s past .

[Milton C Starr]

Originally Posted by Dave Noreen

While I don't have a good supply of early Winchester paper, I do have access to plenty of Union Metallic Cartridge Co. paper. In the UMC 1900 catalog, the heaviest 10-gauge load they offered in their low brass NITRO CLUB shell (their equal to the Winchester REPEATER) was 3 1/2 drams of bulk smokeless powder or the equivalent in dense smokeless powder pushing 1 1/4 ounce of shot. 1901 to 1909 the same. By the 1905 UMC catalog the max load offered in their high brass ARROW shell was 4 drams of bulk smokeless powder pushing 1 1/4 ounce of shot, and by 1906 it was up to 4 1/4 drams of bulk smokeless powder.

The 4 1/4 drams of bulk smokeless powder, or the equivalent in dense smokeless powder, pushing 1 1/4 ounce of shot was the heaviest 10-gauge loads our North American ammunition companies offered until the progressive burning powder, high velocity, loads with 1 5/8 ounce of shot came out circa 1925-6.

You're right I went back and looked at the boxes for sell and all the 4 3/4 dram loads are 1 5/8 oz .

Sounds kind of odd that the 1 5/8oz load was developed so late , because that should be close to the weight of a 10 gauge round ball load . Then again I suppose post choke guns round balls were no longer used ? .

Have you loaded any of the UMC paper hulls ? Would be interesting to see them reloaded.

[Milton C Starr]

Originally Posted by CraigThompson

There was a time I’d liked to have had a full
Box of WIN 10 gauge Repeaters to go with the full boxes of Repeaters I had in 12 , 20 and 28 gauge . But I’ve sold them so that’s past .

Ive just been looking at paper hulls and such to see if they were salvageable for reloading . Theres a guy on GB selling 3 boxes of 10 ga 2 7/8 ammo , so far the auctions only hit $20 . Seems fairly cheap compared to the other vintage ammo going for $400+ for a single box .

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/860450843

[charlie cleveland]

i tried shooting some old repeater amm the other day one was a ten ga another 12 ga 2 3/4 inch a 3 inch magnum and another 3 inch with the 1 3/8 oz load...none would fire i snapped the primers at least 3 times...every thing haveing no 57 or 209 primers have fired in old ammo for me...charlie...i use small and large pistol primers for most of my old brass shells i load....charlie

[Milton C Starr]

Originally Posted by charlie cleveland

i tried shooting some old repeater amm the other day one was a ten ga another 12 ga 2 3/4 inch a 3 inch magnum and another 3 inch with the 1 3/8 oz load...none would fire i snapped the primers at least 3 times...every thing haveing no 57 or 209 primers have fired in old ammo for me...charlie...i use small and large pistol primers for most of my old brass shells i load....charlie

I watched Larry Potterfield loading original 10 ga brass hulls I think they were UMC , he used large pistol primers if I recall .

I watched a youtube video of a guy hunting ducks with a box of 12 ga shells from the 1950s . They fired each time but he didnt realize those old shells were lead .

If the paper hulls dont work out I may eventually ordered some brass ones from RCC .

[Researcher]

From what I've read, the non-corrosive primers don't have near the longevity of the old corrosive primers. Back in 2000 a friend gave me a late 1930s box of Winchester Super-Speed 12-gauge #6C. I took them with me to Nebraska and after getting a click, click at the first rooster I got up, I tried several more and none fired, so I left them on a fence post at a public hunting area in the southeast corner of Nebraska.

The lead balls for "single-ball" loads put out by our North American ammunition companies were 1 1/8 ounce in 10-gauge, 1 ounce in 12-gauge, 7/8 ounce in 16-gauge, 5/8 ounce in 20-gauge and 1/2 ounce in 28-gauge. The balls were small enough to go through chokes, the gas sealing being done by the wads.

The ball diameters were --

10-gauge -- .710"
12-gauge -- .645"
16-gauge -- .610"
20-gauge -- .545"
28-gauge -- .510"

[Researcher]

The original shells in question are over 100 years old.

[edgarspencer]

Milton, Check your PMs