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Old 02-01-2018, 02:52 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dean Romig View Post
Bobby, I like your first reply better... the one you withdrew...
.
The new one is kinda like a “Reply Reproduction”.

I would suppose that the emotional and financial investment that some make in their
“Originals” seems to call out for some type of differentiation.

So what is it really?

I cant believe it’s the geographic parameters during production i.e.Philly vs. Utica Foxes.
I dont believe it’s continuity of production i.e. Superposed production during WWII.
Use and history? NIB/unfired 100 year old specimens begs that question.
Soul? Maybe those of you who shoot both can answer that.
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Old 02-01-2018, 02:54 PM   #12
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Don't forget Greg Baehman.





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Old 02-01-2018, 02:57 PM   #13
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Oh, BTW.... Your Mileage May Vary...(for George's benefit )





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Old 02-01-2018, 03:16 PM   #14
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This is an interesting discussion.

Are the CSMC Foxes and Parkers given serial numbers associated with the original numbering scheme and sequence?

Did the Skeuse's have to use "Reproduction" on their guns?

Ken
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Old 02-01-2018, 03:21 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Hill View Post
This is an interesting discussion.

Did the Skeuse's have to use "Reproduction" on their guns?

Ken
There is a summary about the Parker Reproduction that addresses this information in the "Grades" page.... follow the "grades" link off the main parkerguns.org page and scroll down the that section.
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Old 02-01-2018, 03:24 PM   #16
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Here is the text from the "Grades" page for you:

In 1984, under the direction and encouragement of Jack Skeuse, the President of the Reagent Chemical & Research Inc, teamed up with the Winchester Arms Company and revived the Parker shotgun. But, because the Remington Arms Company holds the rights to the Parker Brothers brand, they labeled it "The Parker Reproduction by Winchester". Originally introduced in the DHE grade, it was later expanded to limited production of BHE and A1 Special grades. Production continued until the owners of the manufacturing company in Japan closed their doors in 1989. Sales continued while supplies remained but that ended sometime around 1997. On September 17th, 1999, a flood destroyed all remaining inventory, including parts and most of the factory records. Today, parts for these guns are difficult to find because the insurance company destroyed what was recovered in the flood to avoid possible future liabilities.

The first batch of 28 ga guns that were ordered from Japan had an F on the lug where normally the frame size is found. They came that way from the manufacturer probably because they misread an accounting code that was used as a computer codes.

The Steel Shot Special model was produced to address the water foul hunters concern shooting the required steel shot shells and the damage they may do to the barrels and their chokes. The chokes are slightly longer than standard chokes on the other Parker Reproductions models. It was observed that longer chokes patterned steel shot more evenly; all tests were done with 3" 1 5/8oz steel #2 shot. The barrels were chrome throughout, unlike the standard Parker Reproduction which didn't have chrome in the choke area. The choke area chrome was added because no one knew at that time the long term effect steel shot would have on the choke area.

The Sporting Clays Classic model were the only Parker Reproduction's offered with factory screw-in chokes. You cannot tell by looking at the choke tubes themselves to determine if they were original factory or not. But, you can positively identify a Parker Reproduction Sporting Clays Classic model with factory screw-in chokes by looking at the barrel flats; it will be marked with an "ISC" stamping (Internal Screw Choke).

Some Parker Repro serial numbers on the barrels have an extra "0" that the serial number on the frame does not have. Example: serial number on frame 20-XXXX, serial number on barrel 20-0XXXX. There was an anticipation to manufacture and sell many more Parker Reproductions than were actually produced. The extra digit to the action number was made in anticipation of future needs.

Production numbers:

DHE 28 Gauge 4,203
DHE 20 Gauge 5,800
DHE 12 Gauge 2,137
DHE 12 Gauge Steel Shot 350
DHE 12 Gauge Sporting Clays 125
DHE 410 Gauge 33
BHE 28 Gauge 7
BHE 20 Gauge 100
BHE 12 Gauge 100
BHE 410 Gauge 9
A-1 Factory Engraved, All Gauges 150
A-1 Custom Engraved, All Gauges 300
A-1 28/.410 Combo 16
Plus 500 16 Ga barrel sets that fit on the 0 frame 20ga DHE
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Old 02-01-2018, 03:26 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby Cash View Post
I would suppose that the emotional and financial investment that some make in their “Originals” seems to call out for some type of differentiation.

I completely agree with that statement.

So what is it really?

I cant believe it’s the geographic parameters during production i.e.Philly vs. Utica Foxes.
I dont believe it’s continuity of production i.e. Superposed production during WWII.
Use and history? NIB/unfiredd 100 year old specimens begs that question.
Soul? Maybe those of you who shoot both can answer that.
I can answer to the "soul" question having toted both originals in the uplands as well as my "Skeuese Parkers" - My original Parker Bros. guns have it - it's just there right between my hands - but my "Skeuese Parkers" don't....yet.






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but because I'm a romantic - stuck on tradition - and to me,
a Setter just "belongs" in the grouse picture."

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Old 02-01-2018, 04:34 PM   #18
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I was told that when Remington tried to revive the Parker in the 1970's (?) that the lawyers made them redesign the safety system in order to pass the "slam test" which was apparently an industry standard. If true, were the Winchester reproductions modified?
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Old 02-01-2018, 08:20 PM   #19
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Robin,
In regard to the Production Numbers, corresponding with Geoffroy Gournet recently, he indicated to me that only approximately 80 A1 Customs were made
during his 15 years at Reagent Chemical/Parker Reproductions. Approximately
only another 80 have been done since Parker Reproduction closed in early 2000
and he became an Independent Contractor. We can only assume several in-the white A1 Specials were lost in the flood and the remaining few survivors were sold to Tony Galazan for distribution. Consequently the 300 number of A1 Customs is a high number.
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Old 02-01-2018, 08:58 PM   #20
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Personally I don’t consider a Parker reproduction a “Parker”, and that’s nothing against them, I love them for what they are.. But they’re not part of the original continuous production. I’ve had this same discussion about about US WWII firearms. I have a February 1941 M1 Garand and a December 1943 M1 Carbine. Both of these guns are still being produced and the parts interchange, but would you consider them original?
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