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Can't give up on it
Unread 03-24-2017, 09:49 AM   #1
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Mark Kircher
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Default Can't give up on it

Many years back I purchased a 20 bore Ithaca Flues 4E with Damascus barrels. I bought it unseen along with a Parker from a Florida gun dealer. I had bought many guns from him in the past and took his word on the gun (it was priced as almost a gift)
The gun fit me perfectly and was in better than expected condition (it weighs 5 1/4 lbs). I fired it a few times and witnessed smoke returning through the ejector slide on one barrel. The ejector appeared to have been reworked and I was not comfortable.
I sought counsel from a gunsmith friend. I explained the issues and when he test fired it the first time The Barrel split (at the edge of the chamber) in his hand. The forend cracked and broke into two pieces. Luckily not real harm was done to him. His hand did sting for a bit. Scary stuff. His determination was the forcing cones had been lengthened incorrectly causing the barrel wall to become to thin.
Anyway - we have spent years searching for a set of Damascus flues 20 bore barrels. No luck.

My question to all is - Has anyone had experience with barrel inserts for making this 20 a 28 gauge? I have no experience in this area. I am not afraid to spend some money on the gun as I would really like to hunt quail with it.

Any experience and direction on ways to bring this beauty back to life would be greatly appreciated.
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Unread 03-24-2017, 10:08 AM   #2
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That's pretty sad Mark. What a pretty set of barrels.

I think you need to send it to Brad. He saved a set of barrels for me that had been "irreparably" damaged. I hope yours don't have any ring bulges at the forcing cones.

I think some precision welding needs to be done before anything else, and Brad certainly is the man for that.





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Unread 03-24-2017, 10:10 AM   #3
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Mark - while you look- why not install a set of fluid steel and get it back shooting as a 20? - I have seen some Flues 20 field grades at some responsible prices -
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Unread 03-24-2017, 12:12 PM   #4
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I'm with Dean on contacting Brad. I think he will be at the Southern so if your going bring the gun. A face to face conversation is always better. I have used Briley sub gauge tubes in a skeet gun and would think you could have a set of 28's made for it.
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Unread 03-24-2017, 01:34 PM   #5
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Mr. Kircher:
That appears to be a serious split. In a bad place. Bachelder is indeed a good choice. But so is Kirk Merrrington - a certified barrel maker from the UK. Either fellow can assess your options. Kirk's website is:

http://www.merringtongun.com
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Unread 03-24-2017, 05:16 PM   #6
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Just wondering what load / shell you were shooting when this happened ? Beautiful gun by the way !!!!
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Unread 03-24-2017, 06:26 PM   #7
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Mark: thank you for posting that frightening illustration of the result of misguided and inexpert chamber work. Was the chamber extended also? What is the current chamber length? Researcher has established that at least until 1926 (after introduction of the NID) 20g Ithaca chambers were 2 1/2"

I took the liberty of sharing the story and one image about 1/3 down here
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...vwLYc-kGA/edit

I do not believe Brad or Kirk would attempt to repair the chamber, but anxiously await the rest of the story. It might be possible to sleeve the chamber and barrels past the thin area, but as a 20g it would probably need to be to .410.
Fitting a donor 20g fluid steel Flues barrel would likely be much cheaper.
I would also not suggest full length tube inserts in light of the cracked chamber wall.
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Unread 03-25-2017, 06:30 AM   #8
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Talking

Men
Thank you all for the thoughts and responses. I have recieved a pm with a potential matched set. Pictures forthcoming.
I also exchanged pm with Brad. He has agreed to look at the barrels.
Drew - Thank you for linking your paper. I read it last night. Very well done.
Steve I cannot sure of loads as it was many years back. I expect I would have used RST to test but cannot be sure. I am not sure either what Jason used. I am just forever thankful he was not injured.
Fingers crossed on the potential match. I will of course follow up here if we managed to save the old girl.
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Unread 03-25-2017, 07:36 AM   #9
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Good thing Jason was not hurt. He is a wonderful guy and an excellent gunsmith - if we're thinking of the same Jason.





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Unread 03-27-2017, 08:46 AM   #10
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My best chance for a donor set - of 26" damascus ejector barrels - will not most likely be the answer. The barrels were salvageable I believe, but guns were 40,000 (Minier) apart and lug and for-end attachment were completely different.
My Serial number is 186XXX - 1909.

So for now....It looks like the hunt continues.
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