Original or altered?
 

In your opinion . . . are these Parker Reproduction choke Q1/Q2 stampings original or have they been struck off and restamped?

The Q does not match my 20ga. stamping. The bottom marking in the Q on mine starts on the left side of the oval and sweeps up and back down, much like this Q.

They look original to me. I have a set in my gun room.





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The stampings look a little odd, but i see no evidence of any wiping out of another stamp an restamping. And all other surrounding stamping looks right.

I can't see anything. But I guess the other posters can see more than I can.

This is Kathy's set of 28 gauge Repro barrels. It looks the same to me.

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I've said it before and I'll say it again . . . It's the itty bitty details that make the big big difference. It's these itty bitty things that offer clues to help us determine originality. Originality may be insignificant to some, but does mean a great deal to others.

Now I realize we're splitting hairs here Dean, but look at the Q and the 1 and 2 following the Q on Kathy's gun, the fonts of the letters and the numbers appear the same size. Whereas, the Q on the subject gun appears a skosh smaller, at least to my eyes, than the numbers of the subject gun. Three more things: 1) I see sanding marks under the choke stampings (especially under the Q1 stamp) and the bluing actually appears to have been sanded away, 2) a little different shape to the curlyque on the Q of the subject gun compared to a known-to-be-original-factory Q stamp (as James Rhodenizer suggested in his post above) and 3) don't the numeral 1's appear a little different, too?

I am again showing the subject gun as well as an original factory Q1/Q2 stamping for ease of reference.

All good points Greg, but...

The Q1 and Q2 stamps of Kathy's Repro look very close to those of the subject gun while, as you point out, the curly-cues are different on your "known to be original" from the ones on the subject gun. So, in my opinion, the stamps on the subject gun and Kathy's gun appear to be closer in appearance than those on your gun.

Incidentally, Kathy's gun is also a 'known to be original' Repro.

And here's another thing to ponder...
There were more than ten thousand Repros made and I'll bet a dollar that they weren't all stamped with the same dies. I know only a small fraction of them were choked Q1 & Q2 and I'll bet a dollar they weren't all stamped with the same dies. I would suggest there may have been at least three sets of Q1 & Q2 dies in use at any one time - one set for the 12 gauge barrels, one set for the 20 gauge barrels and one set for the 28 gauge barrels.... surmising each different gauge would require its own bench chuck to hold the barrels firmly in place while the flats were stamped.

What gauge is the subject set of barrels?





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It's a 28, in both gauge and length.

I wonder if that is the reason the stamps on Kathy's Repro and the subject gun are nearly identical, both being 28 gauge guns and quite possibly had been stamped with the same dies. I know it's a long shot.... just speculation on my part Greg.





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Does anyone else see what appears to be sanding marks and bluing loss under both choke stampings of the subject gun -- especially under the Q1 stamps, or am I hallucinating?

I see what you're talking about Greg - you're not "hallucinating".

Lighter areas around the choke stamps.

I'm going to presume the gun is not in your possession...

Maybe the owner/seller thought the choke stamps would show up better if he 'polished' the area a bit to make the stamps stand out. With his not very good photographic abilities, he may have believed this was a good option.

Just more WAG's Greg.

Best, Dean





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Okay now it seems we're getting somewhere. :cheers:
Does the sanding and bluing loss under the present choke stamps suggest anything?

I raised my thoughts on this in my previous post... sorry, I went back and added some thoughts.





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The letters and the numbers are different sizes on the subject gun. That is what looks odd to me.

Are you sure you're not hallucinating now?:)

Could this be another clue unearthed once again in this thread? Does this suggest anything ?

As mentioned previously, spacing and size seem different, the numbers 1 & 2 are defiantly different, but that may be explained by a different set of factory dies being used as Dean mentions. Where I might be hallucinating is behind the Q 2 what looks to be a ghost shadow of a KE very faintly. Did they make a Skeet in / Skeet out as a choke option? Not sure why someone would go to the trouble of altering those stamps to read Q1 /Q2 but then again I may be seeing things.

In the "Meriden days" of production a lot more attention was paid to the uniformity of die sizes. The Repros were produced more recently than forty years ago. Not so much care and attention went into minutia such as letter die sizes as compared to numeral die sizes.

Not sure it would suggest anything we could call solid.





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I see that too, between the Q and the 2... veery interesting!

And yes, the very early ones had "SKEET" markings as I recall. Greg would know better.





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Okay gents, I see what you see, but I believe what we're seeing is actually ghosting of "LL" -- which is what's left from FULL and what this barrel was originally choked. Under the present Q1 stamps of the right barrel "MOD." was once present.

Has anyone seen a known original set of 28" barrels choked Q1/2? That may be the most significant clue to the possibility of a modification.

I had a twenty-gauge Repro with two sets of barrels, 26" and 28" and they were both choked Q1 & Q2.

The other Repro flats Greg has shown (not the subject gun) are 28 gauge and are 28" long.





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Although we have previously discussed this consecutive numbered pair of 28-ga., 28" factory choked Q1/Q2 DHE Repros owned by a forum associate, I'll post pics of them again for the benefit of Gary and others that haven't seen them. These two guns are the only righteous 28-ga. 28" factory choked Q1/Q2 Repros that I've encountered in over a third of a century of seeking them out. There perhaps are a few more out there, but they are buried deep.

Thanks for posting those beautiful reproductions! I would be proud to own either. Happy Thanksgiving everyone!