Allen & Marshall Auction Parsonsburg,MD

[Asa Kelley]

Allen and Marshall Auctioneers have several Parkers listed on their Feb 4th auction. Lots 84A 84B 93 108 163 & 164 are hammer guns. FYI

[Asa Kelley]

Auction starts today.

[Bill Murphy]

I live in MD and I am not excited. The first time they ran a gun auction that I knew about, a few years ago, the realized prices would have indicated shill bidding. Let us know how any of you did at the auction.

[E Robert Fabian]

Thanks Jent, was there any issues with the D hammer gun ?
Most of the prices didn't look to bad on the hammer guns if the the bores where in good condition.

[David Holes]

I guess that kinda tells us what lifters are bringing. I personally think lifters are very neat and very underpriced. Thank you for posting that info. Dave

[Jerry Andrews]

I bought 108. I'll have $750.00 in it when the dust settles I believe. I guess it all depends on the bores. As if I need another gun itch to scratch but some of these early guns are so gorgeous it makes me wonder why I passed them all these years. Jerry

[Jerry Andrews]

Nope, it's being shipped. I may have to head your direction in a week however as I bought a stock duplicating machine, after 35 years of filing blanks down with a horse hoof file and a draw knife I've purchased a duplicator. Guaranteed down to .003 tolerance, I'll tape the inletting as I still want to an absolutely perfect fit on these old doubles. Jerry

[ED J, MORGAN]

Jerry, What mfg. of duplicator? Aprox. cost? I have over 200 stock blanks on the drying rack, thanks, ed.

[Jerry Andrews]

Ed, I bought a Radarcarve. About $1200.00. Manual duplicating machine. I used one and cut a Smith stock so closely that the inletting required very little work and the fit was as if the wood had grown around the metal. The accuracy is all derived from the guide pins and the cutter if the machine is made correctly. The machine I used was at a wood workers show, had been used extensively for other matters, it had a lot of hours. It was set up for show use so I dragged an American walnut blank there and an L.C. Smith field 20ga stock, SST, AE that was broken in half with much of it missing. I glued the stock and glassed in the missing areas to make it whole before going to the duplicator. The inletted area was perfectly intact however. I taped the inside of the inletting to reduce the amount taken out, and in 1/2 hour, the stock was off the duplicator. By NO MEANS is this a drop in or anything close. It still required meticulous hand fitting to acquire a factory fit but...it reduced my time extensively, especially the outside shaping which I've always done with files. I've posted some photos of the Eagle grade L.C. Smith I'm in the middle of and you can see the advantages of a duplicator quite easily! This Eagle grade was done all by hand from a blank. A box lock gun should be easier yet for the duplicator. Feel free to call anytime to chat. Jerry

[Jerry Andrews]

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j303/CaneRodMaker/IMG_2461.jpg

[Jerry Andrews]

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j303/CaneRodMaker/IMG_2457.jpg

[Jerry Andrews]

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j303/CaneRodMaker/IMG_2444.jpg

[Jerry Andrews]

This auction house has simply turned their back on their obligation to sell the gun to the person with the highest bid. They said it was a software problem. It was actually a greed problem. I'm still not sure how far I want to go with this, I don't know if the gun is worth the hassle. Life is pretty short. An attorney did contact the auction house and the Better Business Bureau in their town as well as the folks who govern an auctioneers license. I get so mad I could kick a teddy bear a country mile when lied to like this. I'd think a good old fashioned bare knuckle match would be most appropriate here but the legal system really frowns on that type of action these days. Jerry

[Eric Eis]

Jerry just make their lives as miserable as possible and cost them as much money as you can by refering people you know to other dealers and auction houses. That is the best payback....! I know I have already cost one major auction house over $65,000 in sales (I know Jim (owner) doesn't care, but so far I have cost him close to 10K in commission over a $5,000 gun and that number is still climbing after he told me to "pound sand" (or there abouts,won't even refund my buyers premium...) Eric

[Jerry Andrews]

The auction house guy, Dave Marshall told me the gun actually sold for less than I bid! Now that truly takes nerve! Jerry

[Ed Blake]

I smell BS. Hang in there Jerry.

[Eric Eis]

I smell BS. Hang in there Jerry.

I agree with Ed make them sweat..:cuss: Eric

[Jerry Andrews]

My attorney just sent the paperwork to me he received back from Allen & Marshall. I have the name of the guy who bought the gun. He did get it for $100.00 under my bid. This appears to simply be a very poorly run auction, one I won't ever bid in again. Jerry

[Dave Suponski]

What's next Jerry?

[Jerry Andrews]

I would need to hire an attorney in Maryland to pursue this any further. I'm not sure it's worth it, I have no idea how the courts would handle this or how it would be viewed in a court of law. Any Maryland attorneys out there with any ideas? Jerry

[Bill Davis]

Save your time and your money! Other then hurt feelings, you have no real damages, Lot's of guns out there--forget this one! I've been burned in a couple of these types of auctions. I don't bid anymore, unless I'm there or I have someone there bidding for me.

[Jerry Andrews]

Pretty much my thoughts on this issue. You can spend your money and make more money but if you spend your time you are NOT getting that back. Jerry

[George Lander]

Jerry: Don't get mad, just GET EVEN! There are ways that will cost them dearly. One is, refer them to this thread!

Best Regards, George

[Dean Romig]

Cut your losses - walk away, sadder but wiser.

[Francis Morin]

Cut your losses - walk away, sadder but wiser. I also agree with brother Lander here- if we can post such scenarios without name calling and possible libel action, the "word" will travel through the double gun brotherhood and this "questionable" site will twist slowly in the wind and fade away. Hiring a lawyer at a $5000 retainer to possibly collect an iffy $1000-- not smart poker- and recalling the wisdom of the Oriental-- "When you set out on a journey of revenge, dig TWO graves first"!! Jerry, you are truly one of the good guys- honest as the day is long, and it is always sad to see a friend get the proverbial "shaft" here- For what it is worth in passing, I never get too deeply in love with any gun I buy, life is fleeting, is it not? :bigbye::bigbye:

[Bill Murphy]

I hate to give my friend Jerry the business, but I'm sure he read my post of February 5 where I related my suspicion that this auction used shills and was not on the up and up. I expected at least one PM to clarify my comments. Oh well.

[Jerry Andrews]

Yes Bill, I should have listened. I have the bug pretty badly however for these old guns with non fluid steel barrels now. The hammer guns especially have me. The quality and precision with which these guns are made is simply outstanding! Jerry

[Bill Murphy]

I don't spend a lot of words on telling people what to buy, but I'm pretty mouthy when I'm giving advice on what not to buy. You're better off without another bad gun, Jerry.

[charlie cleveland]

we do listen bill thanks and hope you keep tellin us.... charlie

[Jerry Andrews]

You really must pick your battles in life. If you rage war on everything that happens you'll be a miserable SOB. I live pretty upbeat day to day. I've been a lucky guy in business, marriage and have three daughters that love me. So all in all this gun is not worth the hassle. It's nice there are ways to get the word out about them however. People usually get what's theirs. Like Mark Twain said, " He who carries a cat by it's tail is about to learn things he can learn no other way. ". Jerry

O & R, thank you for the kind words!

[Francis Morin]

[quote=Jerry Andrews;37836]You really must pick your battles in life. If you rage war on everything that happens you'll be a miserable SOB. I live pretty upbeat day to day. I've been a lucky guy in business, marriage and have three daughters that love me. So all in all this gun is not worth the hassle. It's nice there are ways to get the word out about them however. People usually get what's theirs. Like Mark Twain said, " He who carries a cat by it's tail is about to learn things he can learn no other way. ". Jerry

O & R, thank you for the kind words![/-- Have to admire a man who can quote from one of my favorite "sages" ever- Samuel Langhorn Clemens- I like best his phrase about learning from bitter experience, and again, the apparent feline thread is apparent here as well: "A cat who has sat on a hot stove once will never visit a kitchen again!""

Life is, indeed, way too short to spend it planning revenge against those who would choose to "short-change" us, whether they be Bernie Madoff or Messers Marshall and Allen. The word about their apparently intentional favoritism in a auction/business deal will spread, and perhaps they'll be reduced to trying to sell rusty farm implements-:bigbye:

[Dave Suponski]

Jerry, A very true statement and a great attitude. Thanks for your thoughts and I am sure the membership here will be better off by not dealing with these people. Over time it will cost them more in lost revenue than just this one deal. A good reputation is an expensive thing to uphold at times.

[Eric Eis]

Jerry, A very true statement and a great attitude. Thanks for your thoughts and I am sure the membership here will be better off by not dealing with these people. Over time it will cost them more in lost revenue than just this one deal. A good reputation is an expensive thing to uphold at times.

Just bringing this to light Jerry has cost them :) and it will continue to cost them so in the end you did win and it didn't cost you and you can feel good about it (I know I do, as I have cost one auction house over 60K ($9,000 in commission and almost twice the cost of the gun I bought) in sales :) over what they did to me). As said a "Good reputation is an expensive thing to uphold at times." Eric

[Dave Purnell]

Gentlemen,
I never imagined this thread would go this far. My blood pressure is too high to keep my anonimity any longer. I am the instigator of this thread. I had consigned four solid Parker Under Lifters to this auction. Jerry, your gun was NOT one of mine. I asked my friend and ex-neighbor Asa Kelley, to post the original heads up, to inform fellow members of this auction. Here on the Eastern Shore of Maryland, this auction is widely advertised as "The premier gun auction of the mid Atlantic States". I live on the edge of the world and it seemed like a good opportunity to make some money on guns I no longer wanted. I spoke to the auction house on the phone, and they claimed that past auctions drew bids from twenty-six states, by internet, phone, and in person. My experience with auctions has been that Parkers bring their value or sometimes much more.

After the auction ended, I apologized to Asa for getting him involved. I want to apologize to all of you for leading you down the road on a bogus auction. I usually live and learn everything in this life "the hard way". Jerry, I'm sorry for your aggravation, but I'm glad you didn't lose any money. I don't know who bought my four guns, shills, dealers, I don't know. In the final analysis, I lost almost $1,000.00. I am the cat that jumped on the stove.

Dave Purnell

[Dean Romig]

Experience is the best teacher - She tests first, then teaches.

Experience is often costly.

[Jerry Andrews]

Dave, none of this is your fault, that's for sure. You did this all in good faith and as a group we need people like you to bring things forward. The fact that this particular auction house did what they did is certainly no fault of yours.
My wife is a physical therapist here in WV in pediatrics. She has children/patients who will never walk, jump, run skip, say their first word, walk down the aisle someday, walk across the stage for graduation, play ball of any kind, HOLD a ball of any kind but most of them smile. Their parents smile. So I feel pretty tiny complaining about a gun I didn't get. I wish I would never have posted originally also. I have more double guns than I could ever shoot on a regular basis. It was childish of me to complain and get everyone else involved.
With that said, we also as a group if we are going to bid at auctions, need know who the stiinkers are. So the thread has merit, we just need to keep in all in perspective. I get spiteful and that's not a gracious quality in a person. I think we need to move on and concentrate on the positive. Spring is coming and I know of some native brook trout willing to bend the little 7ft 3wt cane rod I've built over the winter. God Bless our military, present and past serving, Jerry

[Dave Purnell]

Thanks Jerry, Good thoughts there. I think I'll try to catch the tide today and put my little boat in the water. I hear the Perch are running.

Dave

[Francis Morin]

Even though I am NOT an auction buyer or for that matter, consignor, you have clarified for all of us on the PGCA Forum what exactly happened. Your words ring true for me, and I believe your willingness to come forth and give us all the "Paul Harvey- rest of the story" details will possibly prevent future incidents such as this one. As for the Mark Twain quotes- yes indeed. But as Mark Twain lived and wrote in an era without microwave ovens, his sage observations about cats and stoves is most telling- I wonder what the greatest American fiction writer (Hemingway's words of praise) would say if he saw a foto on my daughter's Calico cat sleeping on top of the microwave in her kitchen??:bigbye:

[Francis Morin]

Dave, none of this is your fault, that's for sure. You did this all in good faith and as a group we need people like you to bring things forward. The fact that this particular auction house did what they did is certainly no fault of yours.
My wife is a physical therapist here in WV in pediatrics. She has children/patients who will never walk, jump, run skip, say their first word, walk down the aisle someday, walk across the stage for graduation, play ball of any kind, HOLD a ball of any kind but most of them smile. Their parents smile. So I feel pretty tiny complaining about a gun I didn't get. I wish I would never have posted originally also. I have more double guns than I could ever shoot on a regular basis. It was childish of me to complain and get everyone else involved.
With that said, we also as a group if we are going to bid at auctions, need know who the stiinkers are. So the thread has merit, we just need to keep in all in perspective. I get spiteful and that's not a gracious quality in a person. I think we need to move on and concentrate on the positive. Spring is coming and I know of some native brook trout willing to bend the little 7ft 3wt cane rod I've built over the winter. God Bless our military, present and past serving, Jerry== Jerry, my friend- your description of what your wife deals with on a daily basis recalls to my mind the wisdom of the Hindu-- "I cried because I had no shoes, until I saw a man who had no feet!"--

[Jerry Andrews]

So true O & R, so true! My wife is an angel, and has the greatest attitude 99.9% of the time. The time she's down however, she's really down but...I can't say much as she has one tough job. We've been to a lot of funerals with little caskets. it's sad. Jerry