A 16 Ga. Chamber Length Question Please

[Ron Thompson]

I have a 1929 Trojan in 16 Ga. Can I safely assume the chamber is for 2 3/4" shells? As an aside, my inexpensive choke gauge says it is choked IC & Full. Was this a common choke offering?
Thank You

[Dave Noreen]

It is very likely your Trojan left Meriden chambered for the standard of the time 2 9/16 inch 16-gauge shell. Trojans were a "stock" gun, not subject to the special order choices of the the higher grade Parker Bros. guns.

From the 1929 catalogue -- "Made to these specifications only -- 12-gauge, 26", 28" or 30" barrels. Weights 7 1/2 to 8 lbs. 16 gauge, 26" or 28" barrels. Weights 6 1/2 to 7 lbs. 20 gauge, 26" or 28" barrels. Weights 6 1/4 to 6 3/4 lbs. Trojan Guns are regularly bored as follows, but other borings may be had if desired. The 30" barrels both full choke; 26" and 28" barrels, right hand modified, left hand full choke. NOTE: We will not accept orders from Trojan guns calling for any deviation from the above specifications."

[Ron Thompson]

Dave,
Thank you for your informative response. I am aware of 2 3/4" and 2 1/2" 16 ga. shells. Where does one find 2 9/16" 16 ga shells?
Ron

[Don Kaas]

I use 2 1/2' (or 65mm) shells. RST and Kent Gamebore make good ones. Also, visit The 16ga Society website for further choices. As a point of interest, one of our members shot quite a few boxes of local "Stopping Power" ammunition 1 oz #5 2 3/4" in his #1 frame DHE Parker with no ill effects...other than on the ducks...:shock:

[Dave Noreen]

I believe good 2 1/2 inch shells from folks like RST are the best you are going to do.

When the first "modern" 16-gauge load, the Super-X, came out in 1923 it was put up in the 2 9/16 inch case. The first real impetus for the 2 3/4 inch 16-gauge shell was when Remington introduced their autoloaders, the Model 11 and The Sportsman, in 16-gauge in the summer of 1931. They were chambered for 2 3/4 inch shells. The Super-X and Nitro-Express loads of the day in their 2 9/16 inch cases were 3 dram equiv. with 1 1/8 ounces of shot. Remington introduced a 2 3/4 inch 16-gauge shell called the Auto-Express loaded with 3 1/4 dram equiv. and 1 1/8 ounces of shot. The earliest Winchester/Western paper I have showing such a load in their shells is just before WW-II. Why that is so, when Winchester began chambering the Model 12 for 2 3/4 inch shells in 16-gauge in 1926, I don't know. In 1960 Winchester/Western still offered both the Super-Speed/Super-X and the Xpert/Ranger shells in 2 9/16 inch 16-gauge. By 1961 they only offered the Xpert/Ranger 1 ounce load in 2 9/16 inch 16-gauge. The 2 9/16 inch Super-X/Super-Speed is back in the 1962 catalogue and gone again in 1963. By the 1964 Winchester catalogue no 2 9/16 inch 16-gauge shells are offered. The 2 9/16 inch 16-gauge shells disappear from Remington paper between 1962 and 63.

[Ron Thompson]

Gentlemen,
Thank you again for your informative replies. I started hunting at 14 with my dad's Fox Sterlingworth 16 ga. Like a lot of other returning WW II GI's he had to have a "pump gun" and let me use the "old gun". Now, way past 14, I have come full circle and am eagerly awaiting grouse season with my new old 16 ga. Parker double.

[King Brown]

And IC/Full is fairly common, sometimes preferred, for upland gunning.

[Ron Thompson]

King,
Thanks for the response. I am very content with the choke choices someone before my time ordered for this Trojan. He obviously was a grouse hunter. I was born and raised in Upstate New York and lived many years in New England. I began hunting grouse at an early age and continued until my career took me to too many metropolitan areas where the only birds were pidgeons. Now I am in the mountains of North Carolina, retired and looking forward to October and walks with my new found Parker. I have not hunted grouse for the last twenty years. If memory serves, they either flush close (Improved Cylinder) or way out with conifers between the gun and the grouse (Full Choke).

[Dean Romig]

Ron,

Normally I use 2 1/2" RST or hand-loaded shells in my Trojan 16 but a sixteen gauge on a 1-frame like your Trojan will easily digest standard 2 3/4" shells. However, I would never advocate the use of 2 3/4" shells in a 0-frame sixteen or Damascus gun with 2 1/2" or 2 9/16" chambers. The only difference between these 2 3/4" and 2 1/2" shells will be the possibility of a bit more perceived recoil but I don't notice it in my Trojan 16, just don't use heavy or magnum loads in it.

[Ron Thompson]

Dean,
Thank you. I will try the 2 3/4" shells. I have ordered 2 1/2" RST shells two boxes each in #'s 6, 7 1/2 and 8 for hunting. That is probably way more than a season's supply. I ordered from Classic Upland Supply. I need to stay off that site to avoid contracting the dreaded Upland Hunting Disease. Next thing you know I will be ordering brush pants, hunting vests and searching for a Brittany Spaniel breeder.

[Dean Romig]

Thanks for ordering from Classic Upland Supply. Albert and Laura are our friends as is Morris Baker, president of RST. the way you placed your order benefits both Albert and Laura as well as Morris. And thanks for reminding me, I've been meaning to order a new gun case from Classic so I will do it today.

[Bruce Day]

Try measuring some fired 16 ga shells. Rems and Wins are 2 11/16's when fired. I have three flats of Fed 16ga and I don't know what they are fired yet.

I am not in the least bit concerned about 1/8" of thin plastic, and after about 80,000 rounds through a 1921 gun, I grow even less concerned.

Here I am holding a prairie chicken killed with a Rem Express Long Range 1 1/8oz load. They work fine on chickens and pheasant and are a standard load for me in the wind.

[Dean Romig]

Received my new Boyt two-barrel-set soft case from Classic Upland Supply yesterday. Very, very nice.

[Bill Murphy]

Don't panic. I own about fourteen bird vests, six pair of bird pants that are still fit to wear, eight pair of bird boots, and I have spent about ten days in the field in the last year. I would have mentioned the number of short barrel bird guns under seven pounds that I have squirrelled away, but The Lovely Linda looks in on this site occasionally. The good news is that I haven't bought one this week, well, maybe just one.

[Greg Franklin]

And IC/Full is fairly common, sometimes preferred, for upland gunning.

Perfect! :)