Parker "Squirrel" poster reprint ???

[Jerry VanHorn]

Not sure if this is correct venue..but I'm sure mods will correct if wrong...I thought about a project to reprint the poster..so that all the new members in the last 20 years or so could have a chance to get one for their gun room. Dean suggested a poll of the current membership. So...What are the thoughts...Jerry..

[Brian Dudley]

I would buy one.

[Rich Anderson]

I have one and it's a nice addition the gun room.

[David Noble]

I've been wanting one ever since I got my VH 410.
I'm in!

[Dean H Hanson]

I am on board...

[Dean Romig]

Me too.





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[Phillip Carr]

I would buy one.

[George M. Purtill]

Questions
Was this done before?
If so by who?
What would be the price?

[Dean Romig]

Yes it was done before in a very limited run, which is what I would recommend if this project goes forward.

Were the previous reproductions done by EDM?





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[Jeff Kuss]

EDM produced a smaller version of the squirrel poster. It may have been 1/3 of the size of the originals. I don't believe it sold very well.

[George M. Purtill]

Based on the input of Jeff and Dean I would say do a limited run- 100- and do it full size.
if its a PGCA project then it would get free advertising as well.
Either way. it would get our support and purchases.

[Dean Romig]

Jeff, you're a 'Parker paper guy', what is your opinion of such a reproduction project?




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[Jerry VanHorn]

I don't know who did the first run. I got mine from Ron Kirby. It was an exact copy. I put the poll up to run for 30 days. Let's see how many are on board to discuss it further...Jerry..

[Rich Anderson]

I've had mine for a good 30 years or so. What about copyright infringements?

[Dean Romig]

Good point Rich. Remington Arms may still hold the copyright on the squirrel poster.

Was EDM's reproduction done by his publishing company and what about copyright to his reproduction poster? Does NM hold the copyright now that EDM is gone?





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[James L. Martin]

Is this the poster we are talking about?

[George M. Purtill]

Is this the poster we are talking about?

yes

[Jeff Kuss]

We have been here before. The problem with these projects is that no matter if you print 10000 or 20 the set up cost is the same. A small batch is expensive because you have to get the setup and print costs back. We did the calendar and the Tarnation poster. A large group wanted them, but when it came time to send in the money, we sat with them.
I'm not sure we even got our printing costs back.

[Bill Murphy]

The Bert Sharkey poster was done years before Ed Muderlak did his reprint. They come up for sale occasionally. The originals are selling for outrageous prices. The last one that sold at Ward's sold for an amount I can't remember, but it was a lot.

[Jerry VanHorn]

With today's printing/copying capabilities, Ill bet the poster could be done at WalMart. In fact..That b/w picture of me that I posted was about 4x5. I took it to WalMart..they copied it to 16x22 for less that $20..and it looks nearly perfect..

[Bill Murphy]

How about the Wood Duck poster, which is many times rarer than the Sharkey poster?

[Rich Anderson]

There was a lot of nice art back in the day and I think it would sell IF someone could obtain the copyrights. The art work on some of the old calendars and shell boxes was magnificent.

[Jerry VanHorn]

In 3 days or so, the vote is running 25 to 1. Since I started this, if there is a poster available for sale..I'll buy it and shop around for a firm price. My original poster has been trimmed..so I can't use it.

[Eric Eis]

In 3 days or so, the vote is running 25 to 1. Since I started this, if there is a poster available for sale..I'll buy it and shop around for a firm price. My original poster has been trimmed..so I can't use it.

Jerry, as Bill suggested the Wood Duck poster might also be a very interesting reprint. It's never been done before and begs to be printed........

[Jerry VanHorn]

OK..The Wood Duck has been suggested. I still like the squirrel, but ??..What are the thoughts of doing a copy of the entire calendar ? That was suggested a few years ago.....OR..just the poster...or..should I just forget the idea ?..

[Jerry VanHorn]

The more I think about it...the Wood Duck calendar might have more appeal. The problem is...Who has one that we could use ?

[Eric Eis]

The more I think about it...the Wood Duck calendar might have more appeal. The problem is...Who has one that we could use ?

Talk to Destry, I think he had a lead when we made the calendar. Bill Murphy may also have a lead.

[Jerry VanHorn]

Thanks...I have about a dozen calendars framed..The Wood Duck would be a perfect addition..and I'm sure we could get some buyers..jv..

[Eric Eis]

Thanks...I have about a dozen calendars framed..The Wood Duck would be a perfect addition..and I'm sure we could get some buyers..jv..

I know a few that will buy it........

[Jerry VanHorn]

Sent Destry and Bill Murphy a message. Maybe this can be the project. Any help appreciated in locating a calendar or poster..

[Rich Anderson]

I would be in for the wood duck poster.

[Jerry VanHorn]

2 birds with one stone. Copies of the complete calendar..and copies of just the Wood Ducks.....EASY..Now..who has a calendar ?

[Eric Eis]

2 birds with one stone. Copies of the complete calendar..and copies of just the Wood Ducks.....EASY..Now..who has a calendar ?

Give a shout to Destry a few years ago he had a line on a Wood Duck calendar when the PGCA was thinking about making one. Pm if you want his number. Eric

[Bill Murphy]

Why don't we throw a Clown Catalog into the mix. I know where we can find one of those.

[Bob Hayes]

I would take one of each.
Also now days you can copy those items just about anywhere for a nominal fee.Full color obviously more.Most office store can do it in a day on several different types of paper.Or you can supply paper if you want something special.
Copyright is an issue if your selling but usually only a concern if you use a national printer thats looking out for themselves.Some of the online print shops(cafexpress,zazzles,etc.)have a database and will tell you right away if its copyrighted.

[Robin Lewis]

Copyright could be an issue, it may be wise to approach Remington for permission to copy if they are still under copyright.

When were these printed? The time frame for copyright is listed on this link https://www.copyright.gov/help/faq/faq-duration.html and if they are old enough it isn't an issue. Are they old enough?

[Dean Romig]

From what I understand, Remington Arms owns copyrights to all Parker and Parker Bros. advertising artwork, logos, and corporate identification letterheads and artwork.
That's a pretty loose explanation but suffice to say, when in doubt, check it out.





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[Jim DiSpagno]

When I did the posters, I received a one time release from Remington legal dept. in writing and forwarded it to the PGCA BOD. Jim

[Jerry VanHorn]

I've reached out for help with a Wood Duck poster or calendar..(Not holding my breath) A local shop that has done work for me can do any reprint that I come up with. Attached is a sample calendar that I had the text done and added to the calendar. It's 46x25, and I made the frame from sassafras. I'll post to buy a Squirrel poster, and if I can get one..I'll go ahead with the reprint..

[Eric Eis]

[QUOTE=Jerry VanHorn;219927]I've reached out for help with a Wood Duck poster or calendar..(Not holding my breath) A local shop that has done work for me can do any reprint that I come up with. Attached is a sample calendar that I had the text done and added to the calendar. It's 46x25, and I made the frame from sassafras. I'll post to buy a Squirrel poster, and if I can get one..I'll go ahead with the reprint..[/QUOTE

Wish you could find the Wood Duck calendar that would be the one since it's never been reproduced before. Send Destry a pm.

[Jerry VanHorn]

I sent Destry and Bill Murphy a PM..Will advise..

[Jerry VanHorn]

Destry and Bill racked their brains about the Wood Duck calendar. Seems it's in the same category as unicorns..Unless something new pops up, it looks like the Squirrel poster is the best bet....if the polls numbers say so ? Thanks to all......Jerry..

[Eric Eis]

I would be in on the Wood Duck calendar but not Squirrel poster

[Robin Lewis]

I have no interest in one of these but I took the challenge of finding what I could on this topic. I must admit, I’m no help.:crying: But I did learn a little about paper and found something I never saw before.

First, the Wood Duck calendar – I found nothing on the web?!:banghead: I found Classic Hunting Collectibles: Identification & Price Guide By Hal Boggess on the internet and it didn’t even list it. The only place I see it is in The Parker Story.

Second, I saw a picture on Ebay that is new to me:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/ANTIQUE-REPRO-8X10-EARLY-LIVE-DECOY-circa-1900-DUCK-HUNTING-PHOTO-PARKER-SHOTGUN-/162487552046?hash=item25d503482e:g:P5YAAOSwKfVXH2u 8

This is a tough one. Judging by the prices of other collectable paper:shock:, this must be worth thousands and if I owned one, I don’t think I would want copies out there in the market place mudding the waters.:bowdown:

[Jerry VanHorn]

Looks like the Wood Duck project is Dead in The Water !!..Still, i think there are enough interested members to do another run of Squirrels..We'll see...thanks for all the help..Jerry..

[Bill Murphy]

The last Sharkey poster I saw, sold this year at Ward's auction for $5750. The gentleman whose poster collection was pictured in The Parker Story, offered them for sale at the Baltimore Show several years ago. I don't know whether he sold them all or not. I have only seen two Wood Duck posters in sixty years of Parker collecting and his is one of them.

[Bill Murphy]

Maybe we should reprint the Clown catalog. There is one right handy in the PGCA collection. For all I know, there could be a Wood Duck poster in the PGCA collection.

[Dean Romig]

Not that I've ever seen Bill.





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[Bill Murphy]

Dean's reply speaks volumes.

[Dean Romig]

Dean's reply speaks volumes.

Bill, "Dean's reply" speaks one line and one line only - that which I had written and nothing more - nothing less.

Please don't question my integrity.

End of conversation.






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[Bill Murphy]

My comment only implied that the PGCA collection is buried so deep that even someone as "In the loop" as our newsletter publisher doesn't know what we have in our collection. I am certainly not questioning Dean's integrity. Dean's integrity is of the highest, in my opinion.

[Dean Romig]

That is an incorrect assumption Bill. I have seen each and every item in the PGCA collection and I assure you that there is no wood duck poster in the collection. Other than the clown catalog, the Browning Parker, and a few other interesting Parkers in the Meeiden Historical Society's museum, there is nothing of remarkable value in the PGCA collection.

And I won't be discussing this topic further other than to say that a "black hole" exists only in the minds of disbelievers.






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[Jerry VanHorn]

Well...Looks like a second Squirrel poster reprint is dead. Had 38 in favor..2 against..Thanks to all who participated..Jerry..

[John Nagel]

Shucks I would have been all in the squirrel poster. I know a couple more folks who would have been too.

[Jerry VanHorn]

John..I thought we would have more than 38, but, that's the final number from the members..Like I said originally, I have a trimmed original, and I had one of the copies done 20 some years ago..and I thought that the interest in all things Parker would be better. Maybe later..jv..

[Kirk Potter]

John..I thought we would have more than 38, but, that's the final number from the members..Like I said originally, I have a trimmed original, and I had one of the copies done 20 some years ago..and I thought that the interest in all things Parker would be better. Maybe later..jv..

I'm definitely still interested.. How many would need to be printed for this to make sense?

[Jerry VanHorn]

Maybe someone from the original printing can chime in. The Club has the copyright release, so one of the officers would need to be involved. I would think that an initial run of 50 might work. Does anyone recall what the club cost per print was ?..

[Bill Murphy]

I don't seem to remember that PGCA ever reprinted the Sharkey poster. Is my memory going to heck?

[Jerry VanHorn]

Bill....Maybe it was someone in the Club..not the Club itself. I had one more than 20 years ago, and I assumed it was a Club project. I got it from Ron Kirby. With today's technology, I still think any good print or copy shop..FASTSIGNS..??...could do it.. It was brought to my attention that there MAY be a copyright. If it has not been renewed periodically since 1968..(I think)..then there is no protection..and can be reproduced at will..I'm in the Ozarks now, town of 977..or I would shop it around to a couple places for opinions and costs..

[Bruce Day]

Xxxx

[Bill Murphy]

Nice. Tell us about it.

[Mark Bohon]

yes

[Neil Compton]

I would love to have one.

[Eric Eis]

Yes I would like to see and hear more about that poster too

[Jean Swanson]

Jerry & All

When Art Wheaton was president of the PGCA and still attached to Remington as an advisor to the " POWERS TO BE ", I seem to recall Art arranging some form of a copyright release to the PGCA for certain documents/articles/ prints, etc.

Art probably can shed some light on the subject and the original paper work must be on file in the PGCA records. Check with Mike McKinney or John Davis--record keepers.

Allan

[Jerry VanHorn]

Mr. Swanson..When I proposed another run of the "Squirrel", I did all I could do to check on the copyright. What I surmised, is that the images have become pretty much "public domain"...and I did find a new regulation that says any copyrighted image must be renewed every 5 years . Who knows if this has been done ? I'll bet that Remington legal has no idea either. In any case , there were only about 40 YEAS...and I showed the one my daughter did in about 15 minutes from the internet... and , she did the "Wood Duck"..and the Camp scene..

[Eric Eis]

Jerry,
Please do the Wood Duck, I know you would have over twenty five members buying that one !

[Jean Swanson]

Jerry

Art is on the road heading south to Greensboro ,NC today for the winter months, I will get in touch with him in the next few day and advise as to the status of the copyright issue. I seem to remember it being brought up for a renewal at a BOD meeting.

I will find out
Allan

[Dean Romig]

The BOD also discussed this topic less than two years ago as well.

As I remember it, Remington Arms Inc. owns the copyright on all Parker advertising letterheads and logos and they are very careful about granting 'not for profit, one-time use' of any of it.





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[Jerry VanHorn]

As I mentioned in a very early post...I had no intention of getting any posters printed for resale..of any sort. I have a trimmed original...and I had a reprint that I assumed the PGCA did about 15 years ago. I only started the thread when I thought maybe the CLUB would do run for newer member who might like a copy, since the cost of an original is astronomical now..My final thought on the issue is that possibly the club should secure permission from Remington..if needed...and have maybe 100 printed for the club to sell... not for profit if necessary...I posted the photos of what my daughter did for my personal use.

[Corey Barrette]

I’d like one as well. Thanks.

[Mark Novak]

Likely to buy one. A picture would help the cause.

[Jerry VanHorn]

Take a look at POST 16 in this thread..

[keavin nelson]

count me in

[Jerry VanHorn]

Maybe the Club would consider getting permission for a run of 75-100. I think there are about 50 members now that are buyers..

[Brian Dudley]

Permission from who???

[Dean Romig]

Remington Arms





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[Rich Anderson]

Didn't the PGCA try something along these lines with the Tarnation print? As I recall it didn't fare well. I think the Squirrel and Wood Duck posters would sell if they were reprinted but I would only go into it with a 50% deposit from perspective buyers.

[Brian Dudley]

Remington Arms





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I am not sure that Remington would have any sort of ownership of advertising that was put out before their purchase of the company. But based on my experience, it would be tough to get a straight answer on that from them.

Good folks to talk to would be anyone who had reprinted old catalogs and brochures.

[Jerry VanHorn]

Copyright law changed a few years ago. To be a continuing copyright, the copyright itself must be renewed every 5 years..or it becomes public domain..

[Eric Eis]

Copyright law changed a few years ago. To be a continuing copyright, the copyright itself must be renewed every 5 years..or it becomes public domain..

Wood Duck poster, I know there are some high def photos out there somewhere...........

[John Nagel]

Please lets do both of them!! I don't understand why we can't make this happen!

[Jean Swanson]

to all

Remington ( R A Brands, LLC) OWNES the copyrights of printed materials, literature, collectibles etc. and has the rights to grant a licensee agreement to whom ever they choose. In 2003 the PGCA was granted these rights and it expired on 20 November 2008. These rights are NON- TRANSFERABLE !!

If I were heading up this project, I would tread lightly and not take it upon myself to reproduce anything with FULL legal advise.

This is only my take on the situation, I'm a surveyor not an attorney.

Caution
Allan

[Kirk Potter]

Good advice I suppose, but I find it hard to believe that Remington’s legal team would even know about, let alone care about a limited print.. but you never know I guess.

[Jerry VanHorn]

Looks like the thing to do is to ask Remington for another 5 year permission period..

[Eric Eis]

Good advice I suppose, but I find it hard to believe that Remington’s legal team would even know about, let alone care about a limited print.. but you never know I guess.

I'm not sure the copyright has been maintained by Remington and two, right now Remington has a whole lot more to worry about then an old poster that was published in the twenty's.............:rolleyes: