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View Full Version : Non-Toxic question re: Damascus using gaugemates


will evans
01-04-2016, 12:47 AM
The gun is a 12 gauge GH with Damascus barrels. Trying to figure out the best way to shoot a duck with this gun while protecting myself and the gun. I don't reload and can't find any low pressure non-toxic 12ga loads. Apparently, "nice shot" doesn't actually exist. Any other options I should consider?

Any reason I shouldn't shoot Kent tungsten matrix 20ga 2-3/4" using 12-20 reducers? IIRC the barrels are 37 thousandths.

Merry New Year!

Mark Landskov
01-04-2016, 10:14 AM
http://store.fastcommerce.com/niceshot/12-gauge-2-3-4-4-ff80818116f9842a0116fe9dea010618-p.html

Here is a link to Nice Shot. I placed an order for some 20 gauge shells and was able to specify '7/8 ounce, low pressure'. Good Luck!

Rick Losey
01-04-2016, 10:27 AM
nice shot exists (i have loose shot in sizes 1,2,4 and 5 on my reloading bench - i got a few pounds of 4 shot recently) - however - it is just not reliably available in quantities that some one loading as a business can count on

you may find a few shells around- but get them when you see them

Seriously - I think low pressure or short shell non-tox is squarely in the arena of the reloader now-a-days -I do not see that changing soon

will evans
01-04-2016, 10:52 AM
You are probably right about the future of low pressure loads.

I thank you for the above link. Only 16ga has a listed pressure, which is 10,800 psi. I'm comfortable shooting that in my 2 frame 16 VH without any problems, but I don't know about using their 12ga loads in Damascus. Interesting that they load 20ga with 1oz of shot. Wonder what those pressures look like, and how would that look using the suggested gauge reducers? Were you able to make the special request at checkout for 7/8oz, low pressure? Or did you call them direct?

Mark Landskov
01-04-2016, 11:08 AM
After I placed the on-line order, I was contacted, via e-mail, to verify load and whether high or low pressure.

Bruce Day
01-07-2016, 03:19 PM
I live on the edge and follow Parker recommendations.

will evans
01-08-2016, 09:33 AM
Selfishly, I would almost like to delete this thread after dealing with Dan at NiceShot. I haven't received the loads yet, but he seemed willing to deliver just about anything I wanted.

Mike Koneski
01-10-2016, 10:39 AM
Dawg, if you roll your own shells go to BPI and check out their ITX shot. They sell ITX and all components necessary to reload the non-tox. I load ITX in 10 and 12g hulls. BPI has ITX specific loading data. Good folks there with more info than we can shake a stick at!!

http://www.ballisticproducts.com/

Scott Gentry
01-13-2016, 04:26 PM
Dawg, if you roll your own shells go to BPI and check out their ITX shot. They sell ITX and all components necessary to reload the non-tox. I load ITX in 10 and 12g hulls. BPI has ITX specific loading data. Good folks there with more info than we can shake a stick at!!

http://www.ballisticproducts.com/

Second that! Been loading their 4.5 shot for 10 ga that is pure hell on mallards.
Loading 2 shot now for geese, have every reason to believe is will get the job done well.

Pete Lester
01-18-2016, 09:45 AM
Second that! Been loading their 4.5 shot for 10 ga that is pure hell on mallards.
Loading 2 shot now for geese, have every reason to believe is will get the job done well.

Scott are loading that in 2 7/8" or 3.5" 10ga? If in 2 7/8" what is the pressure of the load your using?

Have you patterned an ITX loading at 40 yards to see how it performs?

Scott Gentry
01-18-2016, 10:07 AM
2/7/8,
Believe the pressures I am currently loading are 10,500 but do have recipe for one much lower.
Have patterned at 40 and like the results. Have also patterned on mallards and they don't like it much.

I am shoot a DH that has sleeved steel barrels and hence not that concerned with pressures.

Send me an email and I will scan the load page out of the Ballistic Products chart I have for short ten ITX loads tonight.
sgentry@wmed.org

will evans
01-19-2016, 10:56 AM
2/7/8,


Have also patterned on mallards and they don't like it much.




:rotf::rotf::rotf::rotf::rotf:

Mark Landskov
01-19-2016, 04:05 PM
Will, were your Nice Shot cartridges roll or star crimped? I could not tell from your photos. They were quite a mess. I have not fired any of my 20 gauge loads.

will evans
01-19-2016, 10:10 PM
Mark, they are star crimped, Some are flat and some have a hump in the middle. The lines on most of them, comparing each shell, are not symmetrical, with the star having a bit of a twist. No two of these look exactly the same but nothing dramatic. Is that how it works when you are loading by hand?

will evans
01-21-2016, 08:43 AM
Mark, here is a picture of the entire remaining box and spent cartridges. I will also carry this over to the thread on DGS. I was able to show these to our local blackpowder gunshop here in town. After seeing the spent shells, he asked about my chamber length. Well...I've never actually measured and just assumed that 2-3/4" shells would be fine. He said the shells look like they weren't able to open all the way as a result of short chambers. I don't have a chamber gauge, but will soon.

http://i862.photobucket.com/albums/ab190/lwevans3/20160121_073507.jpg

John Dallas
01-21-2016, 08:51 AM
An effective (and no cost) chamber gauge can be made by taking a 6" machinist's rule, and inserting the square end into the chamber, tight against the chamber wall. Holding the barrels towards a bright light, move the rule deeper into the chamber When the square end of the rule begins to enter the forcing cone, the rule will move away from the wall, and you will be able to see light around the edge of the rule. Look at the rule. That is the depth of the chamber

will evans
01-21-2016, 10:57 AM
Should I expect 2-5/8" chambers, intended for use with 2-3/4" shells? 12ga GH made in 1898.

As I dig deeper, that is what I read here but also take note in these threads that paper shells were the norm in those days. I'm unclear exactly how that difference impacts the expected pressure vs using today's plastic shells.

Mark Landskov
01-21-2016, 10:42 PM
Will, I just compared my Nice Shot 20s to some fresh RST 20s. The crimps are quite similar. Like yours, they appear to have been roll crimped after being star crimped. The Nice Shot box labeling states that they are loaded by Classic/RST.

Mark Garrett
03-04-2016, 06:47 PM
Those very good crimps on the Niceshot loads . My guess is they are closed using a spinning head finish die that looks similar to a roll crimper. Much the same as most european loads are crimped.

I shot 30 or so of the Niceshot factory loads this season , (that were crimped the same way), out my SweetSixteen and did not have that problem.

Not sure why the hull mouths were torn so badly , but as stated may be due to short chambers.

Call RST and ask them.

Thomas K. Tillman
03-28-2017, 12:26 AM
HI! can anyone give me info on 12 GA. PARKER ser. # 95468 just bought my 3RD parker first Damascus barreled one pretty great shape both mechanically and I hope in originality! THANKS, TOM TILLMAN

William Shirah
03-28-2017, 01:11 AM
Will, you may have seen this on Gaugemate's site...I found it helpful.

http://www.gaugemate.com/images/stories/pdf/ballisticstests.pdf

Paul Harm
04-13-2017, 01:03 PM
I had a couple of Parker hammer guns and one had 2 5/8" chambers that didn't have a forcing cone, just a sharp step. Your shells do look like you have shorter chambers.

charlie cleveland
04-25-2017, 12:15 PM
the gauge mates are great way to make one gun into several guns...charlie